9 or 10 speed

mgkaplan said:

Is there any real advantage to 10 speed over 9 speed?

You'll probably get a wide variety of opinions on this. If you're used to riding a 9-speed 12-23T then basically it either gives you option of either keeping the same spacing and having a bailout 25T cog or adding the 18T between the existing 17 and 19. I think it probably is more of an advantage to people who are riding a wider cassette like a 12-27T as it gives them the 16T cog.

(Of course I made out just fine taking my old retired Cannondale out for the first time in years the other day with its 6-speed 11-24 rear, and downtube shifters, while I was working on my main ride! 😉 )

On the downside you definitely give up some longevity on the chain (and ultimately on the cassette, as the chain goes); and of course higher price on consumables and replacements; as well as initial outlay.

But it is the way that the market has turned. IMHO upgrading an existing drivetrain just to go to 10-speed makes little sense. On new rides, for better or worse, it has just pretty much become the norm.

supergrill said:

You'll probably get a wide variety of opinions on this. If you're used to riding a 9-speed 12-23T then basically it either gives you option of either keeping the same spacing and having a bailout 25T cog or adding the 18T between the existing 17 and 19. I think it probably is more of an advantage to people who are riding a wider cassette like a 12-27T as it gives them the 16T cog.

(Of course I made out just fine taking my old retired Cannondale out for the first time in years the other day with its 6-speed 11-24 rear, and downtube shifters, while I was working on my main ride! 😉 )

On the downside you definitely give up some longevity on the chain (and ultimately on the cassette, as the chain goes); and of course higher price on consumables and replacements; as well as initial outlay.

But it is the way that the market has turned. IMHO upgrading an existing drivetrain just to go to 10-speed makes little sense. On new rides, for better or worse, it has just pretty much become the norm.

I'd agree with all that. Also, in my experience (exclusively Campag), 10sp seems a little more finnicky to set up for noise-free running, and goes out of tune quicker than 9sp. To be honest, I wish I hadn't bothered putting 10sp on the one bike, when I've got 9sp on the other three road bikes (2 x mine, 2 x the wife's).

The biggest advantage is you can run popular cassette combinations without giving up a mid range gear. But in terms of performance, nah, just more marketing by the component companies. There are many, many folks out there still riding and racing 9 speed stuff. Since 10 speed has trickled down to the 105 level most any mid-level bike will be 10 not by choice, but by availibility. I still ride in 9 speed because I can easily swap out race wheels for training wheels.

Giant seems to have 10sp components on a lot more of the '06 bikes than say Trek and Specialized. I even saw some 9sp Ultegra stuff from Trek in '06.

I just bought a new Allez with 9 speed and I'm hoping this was an okay choice. I really did consider the Giant OCR1 with 10sp, I just liked the specialized better.

Hey, I'm a newbie anyway, I'll won't know the diff between the 9sp/10sp for quite some time, and when I do, I'll get an 11sp...😄

The obvious advantage is one more gear; which you can use to give you finer gears in a particular range (allowing greater/more precise control of your pedalling cadence), or give you a lower "bail out" gear while still keeping the gear spacing of a normal 9 speed setup.

Another less obvious advantage is that the 10 speed is of a newer design, so for example the shifters feel that little bit crisper, lighter, more precise than the 9 speed equivalents.

However there are downsides to 10 speed. First of all, because the cog spacing is tighter, it's more susceptible to cable tension and other derailleur alignment issues.

The cost of consumables (chains and cassettes) is also higher, though now with 105 becoming 10-speed, it's brought the price down a little.

rek said:

.......However there are downsides to 10 speed. First of all, because the cog spacing is tighter, it's more susceptible to cable tension and other derailleur alignment issues.

The cost of consumables (chains and cassettes) is also higher, though now with 105 becoming 10-speed, it's brought the price down a little.

I can vouch for the cable / alignment issues. I went from 8 to 10 speed, bypassing the 9 & yes it appears that I need to more regularly tweak the barrel adjusters on my 105 10 speed. When the drive train gets a bit guncked up it also "plays" up with smooth changing compared to the 8. Both issues are easily resolved & keeping the cables clean & oiled also helps. More of a problem, I guess, for those less mechanically minded who may need to visit their LBS on a more regular basis.

Eastway82 said:

I'd agree with all that. Also, in my experience (exclusively Campag), 10sp seems a little more finnicky to set up for noise-free running, and goes out of tune quicker than 9sp. To be honest, I wish I hadn't bothered putting 10sp on the one bike, when I've got 9sp on the other three road bikes (2 x mine, 2 x the wife's).

I have bikes with 8, 9, and 10 spd campy components. Anything more than 8 is pure piggery. However, that being said, I have a 10 spd campy that I put together and tuned up 2 years and 10 K miles ago and other than cable stretch and new brake pads I haven't found it either finnicky or noisy. I haven't had to do any adjustments more than once a year PM and minimal at that. Oh yes, the parts are Record but, I have a Centaur with 4.5K that is virtually the same and that one I use for some light cyclocross riding. Seriously have the bike tuned by a good campy mechanic and not some shimano wonck if you can't do it your self. This is not a Campy vs Shimano statement (I think both are good) but campy can be rebiuld and I like that capability (more than makes up for any initial cost differential). My 8 spd C-Record has more than 40K miles in 15 years and I have only replaced normal wear items including the indexer for the DTS. I do all my own work.

mgkaplan said:

Is there any real advantage to 10 speed over 9 speed?

Yes, additional 2 gears (or 3 for a triple crank).

i would say that the only benefit is the extra cog, but the 10sp Shimano cranks probably are a little better, but I can't notice any difference, apart from the looks 🙂

Talking about Shimano: if you want, you can get the sexy 10 speed cranks and still use 9sp, coz the 10sp cranks work with a 9sp chain, as does the 10sp rear derailleur.

I prefer the shinier look of Shimano 9sp compared to the 10sp 'gun metal' grey. I'm a bit of an 80s guy, and I still like shiny stuff 🙂

Deanster04 said:

I have bikes with 8, 9, and 10 spd campy components. Anything more than 8 is pure piggery. However, that being said, I have a 10 spd campy that I put together and tuned up 2 years and 10 K miles ago and other than cable stretch and new brake pads I haven't found it either finnicky or noisy. I haven't had to do any adjustments more than once a year PM and minimal at that. Oh yes, the parts are Record but, I have a Centaur with 4.5K that is virtually the same and that one I use for some light cyclocross riding. Seriously have the bike tuned by a good campy mechanic and not some shimano wonck if you can't do it your self. This is not a Campy vs Shimano statement (I think both are good) but campy can be rebiuld and I like that capability (more than makes up for any initial cost differential). My 8 spd C-Record has more than 40K miles in 15 years and I have only replaced normal wear items including the indexer for the DTS. I do all my own work.

Must just be me then... We've got three Mirage-equipped 9sp bikes and have very little trouble with them, but my Centaur-equipped 10sp, is just always not quite right, not as smooth as any of the 9speeds (worth pointing out that everyone's idea of what works and doesn't is different – I have zero tolerance for ANY untoward noise in the drivetrain). And yes, I do all my own work too - have done for 30 years!

531Aussie said:

but I can't notice any difference, apart from the looks 🙂

Talking about Shimano: if you want, you can get the sexy 10 speed cranks.

'Sexy'? Those things? You need glasses or something...?
😄

Well, looking at some sample numbers you miss exactly one possible gear combination by staying with a 9 speed cluster...

With a 52/39 chainwheel and an 11-23 cassette, going with the standard 11/23 clusters listed on Sheldon Brown's gear calculator:

Each has a gear range of 45.8 to 127.6 gear inches (obviously this doesn't change).

The 10 speed cassette adds two possible gearings with the 16 tooth cog that is added.

87.8 with the large chain ring and 65.8 with the small

However, 87.8 is available with the small chainring and the 12 tooth cog and a close match to 65.8 can be found with the large chain ring and the 21 tooth cog (66.9).

So, basically, if it is important enough to you to keep a better chain line for these two gears, then by all means, go with 10 speed.

It is also important to move to 10 speed if you are one of the lemmings that marketers love, or if you really care about what the lemmings think. 😄

I think the biggest improvement with the 10 speed Shimano stuff is the new 2 piece crank design. It's extrememly stiff. I recenently "upgraded" from a bike with 2000 9 speed Ultegra to one with 10 speed 105. The new 105 is better as far as shift quality and the extra gear is a bonus.

dgregory57 said:

However, 87.8 is available with the small chainring and the 12 tooth cog and a close match to 65.8 can be found with the large chain ring and the 21 tooth cog (66.9).
So, basically, if it is important enough to you to keep a better chain line for these two gears, then by all means, go with 10 speed.

[font=Times New Roman]Saying that the ratios "created" by the 16 on a 10 Sp are already covered by certain other gear combinations makes little sense. It is more the ability to keep your gearing close as you move up/down on a given front ring & the 16 is usable on all front rings including the 30 on my triple as apposed to say adding an 11 or 27 with either obviously only of use on one ring. I'm fortunate in the 9 V 10 that I have never had 9, but I can imagine the dilemma of some who have a multitude of chains, Q links, cassettes etc of the 9 variety, all with plenty of "life" in them.[/font]

dgregory57 said:

However, 87.8 is available with the small chainring and the 12 tooth cog and a close match to 65.8 can be found with the large chain ring and the 21 tooth cog (66.9).
So, basically, if it is important enough to you to keep a better chain line for these two gears, then by all means, go with 10 speed.

[font=Times New Roman]Saying that the ratios "created" by the 16 on a 10 Sp are already covered by certain other gear combinations makes little sense. It is more the ability to keep your gearing close as you move up/down on a given front ring & the 16 is usable on all front rings including the 30 on my triple as apposed to say adding an 11 or 27 with either obviously only of use on one ring. I'm fortunate in the 9 V 10 that I have never had 9, but I can imagine the dilemma of some who have a multitude of chains, Q links, cassettes etc of the 9 variety, all with plenty of "life" in them.[/font]

Eastway82 said:

'Sexy'? Those things? You need glasses or something...?
😄

yeah, I love 'em :p