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7 to 8 Speed

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Road Cycling
Published
3 August 2004
Last activity
5 August 2004
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ChronoFish
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  1. Hello,

    Right - I'm WAY behind the technology curve. But it all
    comes down to money and priorities.....

    I currently have a 1996/1997 Cannondale R300 that has been
    slowly "upgraded" and transformed into a tri bike over time.

    The rims on the wheels are grooved and should probably be
    replaced at the end of the season if not sooner. While
    doing so I would like to move up to an 8-speed cassette.

    Why 8? The thought is that it would give me one more gear
    choice while allowing me to keep my current drive train. Is
    this the correct assumption?

    The current setup of a older 105 rear derailleur with
    bar-end shifters mounted on aerobars in friction setting
    (rather than STI) works quite well I am very happy with it.
    However the 11-21 cluster is a bit of a challenge (for me)
    on steeper hills.

    I was hoping to focus more of my money on the wheels -
    something like a pair of Aerospokes with an 8-speed (11-26
    or something similar) without having to upgrade the
    rear-derailleur, chain, and therefore crankset (in other
    words the entire drivetrain).

    Is there any reason why I couldn't do this?

    Thanks!
    -CF

  2. "ChronoFish" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:ScKPc.644$73.115@lakeread04...

    Quoted message said:

    Hello,

    Right - I'm WAY behind the technology curve. But it all
    comes down to money and priorities.....

    I currently have a 1996/1997 Cannondale R300 that has been
    slowly "upgraded" and transformed into a tri bike over time.

    The rims on the wheels are grooved and should probably be
    replaced at the end of the season if not sooner. While
    doing so I would like to move up to an 8-speed cassette.

    Why 8? The thought is that it would give me one more gear
    choice while allowing me to keep my current drive train. Is
    this the correct assumption?

    The current setup of a older 105 rear derailleur with
    bar-end shifters mounted on aerobars in friction setting
    (rather than STI) works quite well I am very happy with it.
    However the 11-21 cluster is a bit of a challenge (for me)
    on steeper hills.

    I was hoping to focus more of my money on the wheels -
    something like a pair of Aerospokes with an 8-speed (11-26
    or something similar) without having to upgrade the
    rear-derailleur, chain, and therefore crankset (in other
    words the entire drivetrain).

    Is there any reason why I couldn't do this?

    Thanks!
    -CF


    No reason that I can think of as long as you keep your shifters in friction
    mode. By upgrading to an 8-speed rear wheel you can later upgrade to a
    9-speed if desired. If for any reason you want to stay with 7-speed, there
    is a spacer available that will allow a 7-speed cassette to be used on an
    8-speed wheel.

  3. di said:

    No reason that I can think of as long as you keep your shifters in
    friction mode.

    I'm a big fan of friction--but have noticed that you can often find quite
    good deals on 8 speed bar-ends on e-bay, seeing as a lot of folks are
    moving to 9 and 10 speed clusters. you'll need a new derailleur as well--a
    brand new Shimano 105 will shift great and set you back a whopping $30.

    Or you could just friction shift...

    😄

  4. "ChronoFish" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<ScKPc.644$73.115@lakeread04>...

    Quoted message said:

    Hello,

    Right - I'm WAY behind the technology curve. But it all
    comes down to money and priorities.....

    I currently have a 1996/1997 Cannondale R300 that has been
    slowly "upgraded" and transformed into a tri bike over time.


    <snip>

    Quoted message said:

    I was hoping to focus more of my money on the wheels -
    something like a pair of Aerospokes with an 8-speed (11-26
    or something similar) without having to upgrade the
    rear-derailleur, chain, and therefore crankset (in other
    words the entire drivetrain).

    Is there any reason why I couldn't do this?

    Not in particular. You should probably replace the chain when you
    replace the cassette, just as a matter of course. Double-check the
    spacing of your rear triangle- if it's 126mm, you may have trouble
    fitting the Aerospoke rear wheel. See
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_sp-ss.html#spacing .

    Jeff

  5. ChronoFish said:

    I currently have a 1996/1997 Cannondale R300 that has been
    slowly "upgraded" and transformed into a tri bike over time.

    The rims on the wheels are grooved and should probably be
    replaced at the end of the season if not sooner. While
    doing so I would like to move up to an 8-speed cassette.

    Why 8? The thought is that it would give me one more gear
    choice while allowing me to keep my current drive train. Is
    this the correct assumption?

    Yes, but the same is true of 9. 8-speed is a bit of a dead end, and I
    would advise against it.

    Quoted message said:

    The current setup of a older 105 rear derailleur with
    bar-end shifters mounted on aerobars in friction setting
    (rather than STI) works quite well I am very happy with it.
    However the 11-21 cluster is a bit of a challenge (for me)
    on steeper hills.

    I was hoping to focus more of my money on the wheels -
    something like a pair of Aerospokes with an 8-speed (11-26
    or something similar) without having to upgrade the
    rear-derailleur, chain, and therefore crankset (in other
    words the entire drivetrain).

    You don't need to change that much stuff.

    To convert to 9-speed friction, all you need is the new rear wheel with
    a 9-speed cassette and suitable chain. (You should always replace the
    chain when you install a new cassette.)

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to replace the shifters.

    The 9-speed Dura-Ace bar-end shifters had been in very short supply, but
    we just received a large shipment of them.

    See: http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/shifters.html#dura

    You don't need to replace derailers or chainrings, the ones you have
    will work fine.

    Sheldon "Upgrades" Brown
    +-----------------------------------------------------+
    | We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, |
    | or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses. |
    | --Abraham Lincoln |
    +-----------------------------------------------------+
    Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
    Phone 617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041
    http://harriscyclery.com
    Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
    http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

  6. Sheldon Brown said:

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to replace the shifters.

    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    TIA,
    Brad

  7. Brad Hubbard said:
    Sheldon Brown said:

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to replace the
    shifters.

    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    TIA,
    Brad

    "clicky" shifting, where the shifter, when adjusted properly, clicks
    through a number of indents instead of having a smooth travel. Each
    indent precisely lines the derailleur cage up with the appropriate cog.
    With friction shifting, you have to rely on "feel" to make sure the gear
    is properly aligned, using your feel, ear, and sometimes a glance back at
    the cage (be careful LOL).

  8. Brad Hubbard said:
    Sheldon Brown said:

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to replace the shifters.

    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    TIA,
    Brad

    Dear Brad,

    See "indexed shifting" here, which has a link leading to
    "friction shifting":

    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_i-l.html#index

    Briefly, older bicycles often shifted by a lever on the down
    tube, whose cable heaves the rear derailleur back and forth
    as much as the cable is pulled. Friction on the lever kept
    things where you moved them, while springs moved things
    back.

    These friction shifters are not a great deal more
    complicated than pulling on a string until the chain moves
    to where you want. They can, of course, be mounted in other
    places.

    The advantage is that friction shifters are cheap and
    simple.

    Newer bicycles have more complicated brake levers that
    double as click-shifters. You pull back on the brake levers
    to brake, but nudge them sideways to shift up (or down, I
    forget which) a single indexed step at a time, much like
    pulling a trigger repeatedly. Another lever next to the
    brake is nudged to shift the other way in steps.

    Shimano and Campagnolo make different versions of these
    indexed shifters, but they work roughly the same way from
    the rider's point of view. Fierce debates rage about the
    relative merits of the two brands. Almost all touring bikes
    now come with these indexed shifters.

    The advantage is that indexed shifters when set up properly
    let you click-click-click to whatever gear you please
    without fiddling and fussing to get the chain to sit
    properly, all without taking your hands off the handlebars,
    which allows you to shift while heaving madly in a full
    sprint.

    (Or so I hear. The number of posts here about misbehaving
    indexed shifters are comforting to Luddites like me.)

    In automobile terms, the older friction shifters somewhat
    resemble a normal car's manual gearshift, which requires you
    to take one hand off the steering wheel to move the
    gearshift into place, as opposed to a high-tech racing gear
    shift, which consists of buttons on the steering wheel
    pressed repeatedly to shift up or down.

    There are times when I suspect that the widespread
    enthusiasm on rec.bicycles.tech for fixed-gear bicycles (a
    single speed with no freewheel that must be pedalled
    whenever it moves) is a Luddite reaction to the increasing
    complexity of bicycle gearing.

    Another gearing option is the internal gear-hub, such as the
    Rohloff, which offers a wide range of gears hidden inside a
    chubby hub. While expensive and heavy, these are said to
    have many advantages, including the ability to shift in an
    indexed fashion while not moving.

    Carl Fogel

  9. "Brad Hubbard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Sheldon Brown said:

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to


    replace the shifters.

    Quoted message said:


    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    TIA,
    Brad

    "Indexing" means that the shifter is setup to move in
    increments. It "snaps" into place - and when it does so
    your derailleur is setup in such a way that it moves
    "perfectly" from one gear to the next.

    "friction" means that shifters move smoothly across the
    range of shifting and you can adjust the derailleur
    manually.

    -CF

  10. Brad Hubbard <[email hidden]> wrote in news:WqWPc.32003$K53.12298@news-
    server.bigpond.net.au:

    Quoted message said:

    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    The old style were frictions shifters, meaning you could move them to any
    position and had to feel your way into and out of each gear. Index shifters
    "click" into each gear, giving you a finite shift from each gear to the
    next.

    I sometimes wonder if friction isn't really the best way to go, since it
    requires so much less fine tuning.

  11. Tom Henderson said:

    I sometimes wonder if friction isn't really the best way to go, since it
    requires so much less fine tuning.

    I miss friction on the front derailler for trimming the
    position. Oh well, I suppose it's progress.

    I love indexed shifting on the rear though. Worth the extra
    trouble setting up, IMO.

    --
    jc

    Remove the -not from email

  12. carlfogel said:

    Another gearing option is the internal gear-hub, such as the Rohloff,
    which offers a wide range of gears hidden inside a chubby hub. While
    expensive and heavy, these are said to have many advantages, including the
    ability to shift in an indexed fashion while not moving.

    The Rohloffs are indeed pricey, but magnificent--I've seen a display with
    one slice open. Wow!

    For the commuter, bike trail user, and otherwise utilitarian cyclist, I
    can think of no better gearing system than internal. Bikes equipped with
    Shimano Nexus are quite affordable and the most common bikes in most of
    western Europe. They're even less finicky than the old Sturmey Archers,
    and require zero maintenance except for occasional cable adjustment. Sure
    they weigh a couple pounds, but its not perimeter wheel weight, so you
    won't really notice, you'll just ride more since it's not a hassle. Use
    fancy bike lube or motor oil on the wide chain--it matters little with a
    chain that's not going up or down a cluster and threaded through a
    derailleur.

    Some bikes you can get in the US with Nexus:
    http://www.breezerbikes.com/bdp-town-u.html
    http://www.electrabike.com/04/bikes/townie/townie_7.html

    See Sheldon Brown's site for more internal gearing info.

    You can also buy a 7 speed Nexus hub for around a hundred bucks at
    bikepartsusa.com and have your LBS rebuild your rear wheel with it and
    otherwise convert your bike to internal gearing, I'd estimate total cost
    at around $200 for a conversion. A perfect solution for that cool, but
    unused 80s MTB in the garage.

  13. I wrote, in part:

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to replace the shifters.



    Brad Hubbard asked:

    Quoted message said:


    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    "Click shifting."

    This is one of hundreds of bicycle terms explained in my online Bicycle
    Glossary.

    See: http://sheldonbrown.com/glossary

    or more specifically: http://sheldonbrown.com/gloss_i-l.html#index

    Sheldon "Cyclexicographer" Brown
    +----------------------------------------+
    | Promote the institution of marriage: |
    | Make it available to all adults! |
    +----------------------------------------+
    Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
    Phone 617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041
    http://harriscyclery.com
    Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
    http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

  14. Tom Henderson said:


    Brad Hubbard <[email hidden]> wrote in news:WqWPc.32003$K53.12298@news-
    server.bigpond.net.au:

    Quoted message said:

    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    Quoted message said:

    The old style were frictions shifters, meaning you could move them to any
    position and had to feel your way into and out of each gear. Index shifters
    "click" into each gear, giving you a finite shift from each gear to the
    next.

    I sometimes wonder if friction isn't really the best way to go, since it
    requires so much less fine tuning.

    nah. i haven't "fine tuned" my shifting in years. it's all been set-up &
    go with my campag setup & the ratchet campag front is the best of both
    worlds, imo.
    --
    david reuteler
    [email hidden]


  15. Quoted message said:
    Sheldon Brown said:

    If you want go to with indexing, you'll also need to replace the shifters.

    Pardon my ignorance but what's indexing?

    TIA,
    Brad

    You are revealing your callow youth, Brad.

    Newer bikes click from gear to gear, with detents in the shifter (not
    the derailleur). That's "indexed" shifting.

    Back in the old days, or less than 15 or 20 years ago, shifting was done
    by moving the lever the right distance. Worked fine, but indexing has
    now taken over. It could be called an improvement, but not a big one.

  16. I have an extra Shimano 600 rear derailleur (8 speed) if you need one.
    It's in good condition with low mileage. $20 shipped.

    "ChronoFish" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<ScKPc.644$73.115@lakeread04>...

    Quoted message said:

    Hello,

    Right - I'm WAY behind the technology curve. But it all
    comes down to money and priorities.....

    I currently have a 1996/1997 Cannondale R300 that has been
    slowly "upgraded" and transformed into a tri bike over time.

    The rims on the wheels are grooved and should probably be
    replaced at the end of the season if not sooner. While
    doing so I would like to move up to an 8-speed cassette.

    Why 8? The thought is that it would give me one more gear
    choice while allowing me to keep my current drive train. Is
    this the correct assumption?

    The current setup of a older 105 rear derailleur with
    bar-end shifters mounted on aerobars in friction setting
    (rather than STI) works quite well I am very happy with it.
    However the 11-21 cluster is a bit of a challenge (for me)
    on steeper hills.

    I was hoping to focus more of my money on the wheels -
    something like a pair of Aerospokes with an 8-speed (11-26
    or something similar) without having to upgrade the
    rear-derailleur, chain, and therefore crankset (in other
    words the entire drivetrain).

    Is there any reason why I couldn't do this?

    Thanks!
    -CF

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