1500 hours per year ...

cfsmtb said:

The model... male spends more than 1500 hours per year on his car;
driving or sitting in it, parking or searching for it; earning enough
to pay for the vehicle, the tolls, the tyres, the insurance or the
highway taxes. These four hours per day for gathering his resources for
it do not include his transport-related dally-ing in hospitals, traffic
courts, and garages, his sitting time before the TV to be sold a new
model, or the time needed to earn or enjoy the travelling on his
vacation. In terms of lifetime invested, the average (driver) attains
four miles per hour. In countries without any transport industry,
people walk at this rate wherever they want to go.

Man, unaided by any tool, is quite efficient when he moves. He carries
one gram of his weight over a kilometre in 10 minutes by expending 0.75
calories, which makes him thermodynamically more efficient than any
motorized vehicle and most animals, such as rats or oxen. He is still
less efficient than horses or sturgeon.

A century ago, however, the bicycle appeared. It lifted man's
self-powered mobility into a new order, beyond which there can be no
further progress. On flat ground he can travel faster than on foot and
do so using only one-fifth of the calories he would have expended
walking. He can now carry one gram of his weight over one kilometre
expending only 0.15 calories. Equipped with a bicycle, man does better
not only than any machine but also than any animal.

Ivan Illich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Illich

Is this the same Ivan Illich that suggested a world wide
speed limit of 25kph? That would slow me down too much on
the bike.

DeF.

--
e-mail: d.farrow@your finger.murdoch.edu.au
To reply, you'll have to remove your finger.

Go the Sturgeon! 😄

flyingdutch said:

Go the Sturgeon! 😄

Mmm, caviar.

--
e-mail: d.farrow@your finger.murdoch.edu.au
To reply, you'll have to remove your finger.

DeF said:

cfsmtb said:

The model... male spends more than 1500 hours per year on his car;
driving or sitting in it, parking or searching for it; earning enough
to pay for the vehicle, the tolls, the tyres, the insurance or the
highway taxes. These four hours per day for gathering his resources for
it do not include his transport-related dally-ing in hospitals, traffic
courts, and garages, his sitting time before the TV to be sold a new
model, or the time needed to earn or enjoy the travelling on his
vacation. In terms of lifetime invested, the average (driver) attains
four miles per hour. In countries without any transport industry,
people walk at this rate wherever they want to go.

Man, unaided by any tool, is quite efficient when he moves. He carries
one gram of his weight over a kilometre in 10 minutes by expending 0.75
calories, which makes him thermodynamically more efficient than any
motorized vehicle and most animals, such as rats or oxen. He is still
less efficient than horses or sturgeon.

A century ago, however, the bicycle appeared. It lifted man's
self-powered mobility into a new order, beyond which there can be no
further progress. On flat ground he can travel faster than on foot and
do so using only one-fifth of the calories he would have expended
walking. He can now carry one gram of his weight over one kilometre
expending only 0.15 calories. Equipped with a bicycle, man does better
not only than any machine but also than any animal.

Ivan Illich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Illich

Is this the same Ivan Illich that suggested a world wide
speed limit of 25kph? That would slow me down too much on
the bike.

DeF.

I first heard of Ivan Illich when I read his book "Deschooling Society",
which I thought presented a useful view on education.

Unfortunately, it seems he has not taken into account the additional heat
energy lost from the human body when riding a bicycle at 6 km/hr. Apart
from Brisbanites, most people wouldn't ride wearing an insulating suit.

During and after physical activity our body temperature is higher than at
rest, and we continue to use up extra energy for some time after we have
reached the destination. This additional energy consumption can be higher
than the mechanical energy expended.

Which is my excuse for why I have just been eating about 2000 kilojoules
worth of chocolate...

Yum,

Vince

cfsmtb said:

The model... male spends more than 1500 hours per year on his car; driving or sitting in it, parking or searching for it; earning enough to pay for the vehicle, the tolls, the tyres, the insurance or the highway taxes.

Which is only a fraction of the time he will spend catching public transport in Melbourne… waiting for it, paying for it, lining up for a ticket, renewing a monthly ticket made from paper that fails to validate after two days, trying to find enough change because some machines only take coins… being jammed up against other unhappy people in peak hour, being sneezed on and catching a flu, recovering from that flu… and that’s just on the way to work!...

Yay cars, yay bikes, boo the state of our PT.

gplama said:

Which is only a fraction of the time he will spend catching public
transport in Melbourne. waiting for it, paying for it, lining up for a
ticket, renewing a monthly ticket made from paper that fails to
validate after two days, trying to find enough change because some
machines only take coins. being jammed up against other unhappy people
in peak hour, being sneezed on and catching a flu, recovering from that
flu. and that's just on the way to work!...

Yay cars, yay bikes, boo the state of our PT.

ditto for Sydney, in spades.

--
beerwolf (remove numbers from email address)

cfsmtb said:

The model... male spends more than 1500 hours per year on his car; driving or sitting in it, parking or searching for it; earning enough to pay for the vehicle, the tolls, the tyres, the insurance or the highway taxes. These four hours per day for gathering his resources for it do not include his transport-related dally-ing in hospitals, traffic courts, and garages, his sitting time before the TV to be sold a new model, or the time needed to earn or enjoy the travelling on his vacation. In terms of lifetime invested, the average (driver) attains four miles per hour. In countries without any transport industry, people walk at this rate wherever they want to go.

Man, unaided by any tool, is quite efficient when he moves. He carries one gram of his weight over a kilometre in 10 minutes by expending 0.75 calories, which makes him thermodynamically more efficient than any motorized vehicle and most animals, such as rats or oxen. He is still less efficient than horses or sturgeon.

A century ago, however, the bicycle appeared. It lifted man's self-powered mobility into a new order, beyond which there can be no further progress. On flat ground he can travel faster than on foot and do so using only one-fifth of the calories he would have expended walking. He can now carry one gram of his weight over one kilometre expending only 0.15 calories. Equipped with a bicycle, man does better not only than any machine but also than any animal.

Ivan Illich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Illich

Where does the first paragraph come from? I found the rest of it. The gender specificity is odd, given that the whole notion has nothing to do with gender. To be honest, although I can see the point of what's being said in that excerpt, Ivan appears to be something of a [censored] from what I read in the full text.

Resound said:

Where does the first paragraph come from? I found the rest of it. The gender specificity is odd, given that the whole notion has nothing to do with gender. To be honest, although I can see the point of what's being said in that excerpt, Ivan appears to be something of a [censored] from what I read in the full text.

Ivan's (was) one of those card-carrying intelligentsia folk, read the wiki entry.

**wanders off muttering something about groupthink**

cfsmtb said:

Ivan's (was) one of those card-carrying intelligentsia folk, read the wiki entry.

**wanders off muttering something about groupthink**

He sounds vaguely Chomskyesque only without Chomsky's actual knowledge of anything actually pertaining to the real world. And even Chomsky got waffly. They were pretty much of the same period, anyway. I find myself with an urge to throw around the phrase "proto post-modernist" but that's probably just residue from my half completed arts degree.

cfsmtb said:

The model... male spends more than 1500 hours per year on his car; driving or sitting in it, parking or searching for it; earning enough to pay for the vehicle, the tolls, the tyres, the insurance or the highway taxes. These four hours per day for gathering his resources for it do not include his transport-related dally-ing in hospitals, traffic courts, and garages, his sitting time before the TV to be sold a new model, or the time needed to earn or enjoy the travelling on his vacation. In terms of lifetime invested, the average (driver) attains four miles per hour. In countries without any transport industry, people walk at this rate wherever they want to go.
Ivan Illich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Illich

I came across another example of these concepts at http://www.greenhouse.gov.au/tdm/publications/effectivespeeds.html

A report by Paul J. Tranter
School of Physical, Environmental and Mathematical Sciences, UNSW@ADFA, Canberra, ACT, Australia
Commisioned by the Australian Greenhouse Office, Department of the Environment and Heritage, 2004

Abstract
Formula One racing teams spend hundreds of millions of dollars each year so that their drivers can travel at very high speeds for a very short time. If these teams want to be competitive, they have no choice but to devote huge amounts of time and money to their cars. But is this strategy a sensible one when applied to everyday transport? Is it worth investing hundreds of hours per year to pay for a mode of transport that might save only half of that in travel time? We can help answer this question by considering the concept of 'effective speed', where speed is calculated on the basis of the total amount of time consumed by a particular mode of transport. Applying this concept of 'effective speed' provides some surprising results in the comparison of cars, bicycles and public transport

I havent been thorough it all again recently but I recall some interesting comparisons

RoryW

cfsmtb said:

The model... male spends more than 1500 hours per year on his car;
driving or sitting in it, parking or searching for it; earning enough
to pay for the vehicle, the tolls, the tyres, the insurance or the
highway taxes. These four hours per day for gathering his resources for
it do not include his transport-related dally-ing in hospitals, traffic
courts, and garages, his sitting time before the TV to be sold a new
model, or the time needed to earn or enjoy the travelling on his
vacation. In terms of lifetime invested, the average (driver) attains
four miles per hour. In countries without any transport industry,
people walk at this rate wherever they want to go.

Man, unaided by any tool, is quite efficient when he moves. He carries
one gram of his weight over a kilometre in 10 minutes by expending 0.75
calories, which makes him thermodynamically more efficient than any
motorized vehicle and most animals, such as rats or oxen. He is still
less efficient than horses or sturgeon.

A century ago, however, the bicycle appeared. It lifted man's
self-powered mobility into a new order, beyond which there can be no
further progress. On flat ground he can travel faster than on foot and
do so using only one-fifth of the calories he would have expended
walking. He can now carry one gram of his weight over one kilometre
expending only 0.15 calories. Equipped with a bicycle, man does better
not only than any machine but also than any animal.

It's only going to get worse here in WA (Bunbury). The Harvey Shire has
voted to become part of the pilot program for 40km/h speed limits in
built-up areas and 30km/h limits in school zones! If it's 'successful'
it will be expanded throughout the state.

--
Brett"Now I can get a speeding ticket on the flat without a tailwind"S

In aus.bicycle on Fri, 26 May 2006 17:38:25 +1000

Rory Williams said:

by a particular mode of transport. Applying this concept of 'effective
speed' provides some surprising results in the comparison of cars,
bicycles and public transport

Sigh... motorcycles lose again.

can't be enough lazy cyclists in Canberra!

Zebee

BrettS said:

It's only going to get worse here in WA (Bunbury). The Harvey Shire has
voted to become part of the pilot program for 40km/h speed limits in
built-up areas and 30km/h limits in school zones! If it's 'successful'
it will be expanded throughout the state.

SA has had "25kmh in school hours or when children present" zones for
some years now.

Aeek said:

BrettS said:

It's only going to get worse here in WA (Bunbury). The Harvey Shire has
voted to become part of the pilot program for 40km/h speed limits in
built-up areas and 30km/h limits in school zones! If it's 'successful'
it will be expanded throughout the state.

SA has had "25kmh in school hours or when children present" zones for
some years now.

That sounds bizarre! How much more likely are kids to be on the road
*during* school hours than on the road outside their house *after*
school hours?

--
BrettS

Aeek said:

SA has had "25kmh in school hours or when children present" zones for
some years now.

Whoa!!

I'd be a candidate to get booked every day while riding past the local high
school under those rules. Crazy stuff.

Oh yeah. I don't do it while children are present - well no more then one or
two.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

In aus.bicycle on Fri, 26 May 2006 21:55:12 +1000

Peter Signorini said:

Aeek said:

SA has had "25kmh in school hours or when children present" zones for
some years now.

Whoa!!

I'd be a candidate to get booked every day while riding past the local high
school under those rules. Crazy stuff.

Yeah, but the zones have flashing lights in school hours so that
helps.

I didn't know about the "when children present" bit, and never heard
of anyone being done when the lights weren't flashing.

Zebee