Inconsiderate bikers

On 2004-08-04, Maybe_one_time penned:

Quoted message said:

I just started mountain biking (Gary Fisher and eggbeaters) and find
it very rewarding and a great workout.

But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do
not obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open
Space here in Albuquerque.

In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter, restoration in
progress" and they even put barriers across to keep you from entering.
Guess what, bikers go around the barriers, ride in the off-limits
areas and leave tire tracks for all the hikers to see and get angry
at.

Any suggestions? These people may well ruin it for all of us.

I have the same concerns here in Colorado. If you figure out how to get
them to behave themselves, please let me know.

I used to think that maybe they just didn't know any better, but as my
dad said: "No, they're just [censored]. If they cared, they would make it
their business to know."

--
monique

"Get a bicycle. You will not regret it, if you live."
-- Mark Twain

"Maybe_one_time" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I just started mountain biking (Gary Fisher and eggbeaters) and find it

very

Quoted message said:

rewarding and a great workout.

But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do not
obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open Space here

in

Quoted message said:

Albuquerque.

In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter, restoration in
progress" and they even put barriers across to keep you from entering.
Guess what, bikers go around the barriers, ride in the off-limits areas

and

Quoted message said:

leave tire tracks for all the hikers to see and get angry at.

Any suggestions? These people may well ruin it for all of us.

Thanks,
James

We don't have that much of a problem here in SW Idaho, (almost -0-) though
we have a fairly large mtnbike community. There's zealous peer pressure to
obey the rules, where riders pretty much police other riders. The bike
shops tell new bike owners how to behave, and I think some have handouts of
the rules. This should be a must. But I think it takes education and
constant repetition and reminder and that peer pressure I mentioned.

And an intolerance for Barneys that lets them know in very certain terms
that they are out of line. If you see it happen, yell at them. If you can,
chase them down and get in their face. Explain to them that their
momentary thrill could shut the whole thing down for everybody.

If they're stupid jerks that won't listen, but wanna fight, take your frame
pump and shove it in their chest just beneath their ribs. In a friendly
way, of course.

paladin

paladin

RE/

Quoted message said:

But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do not
obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open Space here in
Albuquerque.

In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter...

It's partially the "one-percenter" effect. IMHO one reason why nobody should
want their favorite passtimes to be come too popular - MTB-ing,
Windsurfing.....current becoming a recognized phenomonon in kitesurfing...

Once the raw numbers exceed a certain level, one percent becomes enough people
to cause problems.

Another part is education. At least some of those people aren't thinking too
deeply and if there were some way to make them see the consequences at least
some of them would change their behavior.

--
PeteCresswell

(Pete Cresswell) said:

It's partially the "one-percenter" effect. IMHO one reason why nobody should
want their favorite passtimes to be come too popular - MTB-ing,
Windsurfing.....current becoming a recognized phenomonon in kitesurfing...

I went windsurfing for the first time in a while
this weekend and I was amazed at how many
kitesurfing kooks there are out there.

Coupled with the numerous windsurfing kooks that
apparently don't understand "starboard," it made
for a crazy day.

Boy did I feel like a grumpy retro dude as I
out-pointed and out-sailed numerous nimrods on
equipment made by companies that I didn't even
recognize.

--
petefagerlin.com

everything that is wrong with the internet

(Pete Cresswell) said:

It's partially the "one-percenter" effect. IMHO one reason why nobody should
want their favorite passtimes to be come too popular - MTB-ing,
Windsurfing.....current becoming a recognized phenomonon in kitesurfing...

Sounds reasonable, but there are scads of mountain bikers in Portland, and
a lot of the ride in a 5,100-acre metro forest park with 74 miles of
fireroad and hiking-only singletrack. This is some sweet-looking
singletrack, and you'd think that 1% would be causing conflict by riding
there. But I pass by singletrack trailheads all the time and have seen
bike tracks only once in 8 years. On most trailheads, I've never seen any.

It must have something to do with attitude and education as well.

--
-BB-
To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail address, at least)

Pete Fagerlin says:

Quoted message said:

Coupled with the numerous windsurfing kooks that
apparently don't understand "starboard," it made
for a crazy day.

I honestly sometimes feel that people should have to take a test before they're
allowed on the water. Powerboaters should have to take 2 tests
We had a collision (and near-death) in the Bay here last year where a
powerboater was playing around to see how high he could get the bow. In the
harbor entrance where 3 classes of dinghies were racing, tour boats going in
and out, etc. He ran over a Hobie cat, got the trap wires around his prop and
nearly "ate" the crew. Luckily his wife killed the engines because she heard a
funny noise. He quite literally could not see where he was going in one of the
busiest harbors on the east coast.

[censored]!

Steve

Stephen Baker said:

I honestly sometimes feel that people should have to take a test before they're
allowed on the water.

You misspelled "out of their houses".

gabrielle (why, yes, it's been one of *those* days)

Gab says:

Quoted message said:

You misspelled "out of their houses".

Again? Dang! ;-)

Steve

p e t e f a g e r l i n <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

(Pete Cresswell) said:

It's partially the "one-percenter" effect. IMHO one reason why nobody should
want their favorite passtimes to be come too popular - MTB-ing,
Windsurfing.....current becoming a recognized phenomonon in kitesurfing...

I went windsurfing for the first time in a while
this weekend and I was amazed at how many
kitesurfing kooks there are out there.

Coupled with the numerous windsurfing kooks that
apparently don't understand "starboard," it made
for a crazy day.

Boy did I feel like a grumpy retro dude as I
out-pointed and out-sailed numerous nimrods on
equipment made by companies that I didn't even
recognize.

Wow, I had the same type of experience as I clamped my metal
skates to my shoes to do some roller skating at the park.
All these kooks on these newfangled "rollerblade" thingies
whipping around at speeds I never imagined could be possible.
What will they think of next, a horseless carriage? Poppycock!

Later I donned my top hat and with my walking cane I went for a
walk. I strolled to where the calliope used to play only to be met
by a group of dastardly young hoodlums who were no doubt up to no
good. I asked one rather oddly dressed young man "Excuse me laddy,
can you tell me where the calliope is?" He replied "I got your
calliope right here beeotch" as he grabbed himself in the nether region.
I was agast at such shenanigans. I bid him good day and he then
consficated my cane, shoved it up my anal canal and proceded
to "[censored] slap" me until I capitulated. It does seem the times
are a changing.

Quoted message said:

I went windsurfing for the first time in a while
this weekend and I was amazed at how many
kitesurfing kooks there are out there.

Kitesurfing is still evolving and my impression is that it's truly
dangerous.

To wit; not only can you get maimed or killed by a momentary lapse in
judgement, you can also be done in by a rogue gust while you're just
standing there waiting to launch or land the kite. Once that thing
takes off, you might as well be tied to the bumper of a Greyhound bus.

Couple that with a relatively quick learning curve (compared to
windsurfing) and people like the instructor at a major kitesurfing
center down in Hatteras that assured me that they'd teach me
"everything I need to know to be 100% safe on land..." and the same
for water in each of two 90-minute lessons and it gets even worse.

I think a lot more innocents are going to get wacked before public
conciousness catches up with reality.

Meanwhile, the geniuses in local governments are tending to lump
kitesurfing and windsurfing together and issuing bans on both because
of deaths/injuries from the former.

PeteCresswell said:

Couple that with a relatively quick learning curve (compared to
windsurfing) and people like the instructor at a major kitesurfing
center down in Hatteras that assured me that they'd teach me
"everything I need to know to be 100% safe on land..." and the same
for water in each of two 90-minute lessons and it gets even worse.

It reminds me of snowboarding in that sense.

Q: "What's the difference between an expert
snowboarder and a beginner?"

A: A few days.

--
petefagerlin.com

everything that is wrong with the internet

R.White sez:

Quoted message said:

Later I donned my top hat and with my walking cane I went for a
walk. I strolled to where the calliope used to play only to be met
by a group of dastardly young hoodlums who were no doubt up to no
good. I asked one rather oddly dressed young man "Excuse me laddy,
can you tell me where the calliope is?" He replied "I got your
calliope right here beeotch" as he grabbed himself in the nether region.
I was agast at such shenanigans. I bid him good day and he then
consficated my cane, shoved it up my anal canal and proceded
to "[censored] slap" me until I capitulated. It does seem the times
are a changing.

Even good points can be funny! Thanks for the laugh R.

--
T o m Dillon
Lakewood, CO
Z to S to email

On 2004-08-05, gabrielle penned:

Quoted message said:

Stephen Baker said:

I honestly sometimes feel that people should have to take a test
before they're allowed on the water.

You misspelled "out of their houses".

gabrielle (why, yes, it's been one of *those* days)

This seems like a good opportunity to share an anecdote. You hear
warnings all the time about inattentive drivers on cell phones, but this
was the first time I saw a pedestrian nearly kill themselves with a cell
phone!

Guy standing at the corner of an intersection on cell. Blabbing,
showing no sign of moving. Suddenly wanders halfway across the near
lane (with the red hand showing on the light -- he wasn't supposed to
cross), stops, blabs a bit again, then saunters back the way he came.

I, trying to make a turn involving the lane into which he meandered, was
not amused. I don't believe the pedestrian ever noticed me. You know,
bright blue WRX wagons are *so* quiet and they blend so well.

--
monique

"Get a bicycle. You will not regret it, if you live."
-- Mark Twain

On Wed, 4 Aug 2004 10:29:00 -0600, "Maybe_one_time" <[email hidden]>
wrote:

..I just started mountain biking (Gary Fisher and eggbeaters) and find it very
..rewarding and a great workout.
..
..But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do not
..obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open Space here in
..Albuquerque.
..
..In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter, restoration in
..progress" and they even put barriers across to keep you from entering.
..Guess what, bikers go around the barriers, ride in the off-limits areas and
..leave tire tracks for all the hikers to see and get angry at.
..
..Any suggestions? These people may well ruin it for all of us.

So what else is new? IMBA and other mountain biking organizations promote the
attitude that mountain bikers are discriminated against, with the result that
bikers feel justified in breaking the law. Anyone who tells the truth (such as
you) will be shouted down by mountain bikers who don't want the truth to get
out.

..Thanks,
..James
..

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"😉. Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:20:24 -0600, "Paladin" <[email hidden]> wrote:

..
.."Maybe_one_time" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
..news:[email hidden]...
..> I just started mountain biking (Gary Fisher and eggbeaters) and find it
..very
..> rewarding and a great workout.
..>
..> But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do not
..> obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open Space here
..in
..> Albuquerque.
..>
..> In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter, restoration in
..> progress" and they even put barriers across to keep you from entering.
..> Guess what, bikers go around the barriers, ride in the off-limits areas
..and
..> leave tire tracks for all the hikers to see and get angry at.
..>
..> Any suggestions? These people may well ruin it for all of us.
..>
..> Thanks,
..> James
..>
..We don't have that much of a problem here in SW Idaho, (almost -0-) though
..we have a fairly large mtnbike community. There's zealous peer pressure to
..obey the rules, where riders pretty much police other riders. The bike
..shops tell new bike owners how to behave, and I think some have handouts of
..the rules. This should be a must. But I think it takes education and
..constant repetition and reminder and that peer pressure I mentioned.
..
..And an intolerance for Barneys that lets them know in very certain terms
..that they are out of line. If you see it happen, yell at them. If you can,
..chase them down and get in their face. Explain to them that their
..momentary thrill could shut the whole thing down for everybody.
..
..If they're stupid jerks that won't listen, but wanna fight, take your frame
..pump and shove it in their chest just beneath their ribs. In a friendly
..way, of course.
..
..paladin
..
..paladin
..

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"😉. Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 22:25:42 GMT, "(Pete Cresswell)" <[email hidden]> wrote:

..RE/
..>But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do not
..>obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open Space here in
..>Albuquerque.
..>
..>In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter...
..
..It's partially the "one-percenter" effect. IMHO one reason why nobody should
..want their favorite passtimes to be come too popular - MTB-ing,
..Windsurfing.....current becoming a recognized phenomonon in kitesurfing...
..
..Once the raw numbers exceed a certain level, one percent becomes enough people
..to cause problems.

BS. On IMBA's web site is a study showing that a MAJORITY of mountain bikers
break the law.

..Another part is education. At least some of those people aren't thinking too
..deeply and if there were some way to make them see the consequences at least
..some of them would change their behavior.

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"😉. Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

Please ignore poor Mikey. He is either a troll or a head case. Either way,
he's been posting nonsense in this and other usenet groups for a long time.

A Google groups search for "Mike Vandeman" and "troll" returns 1880 hits,
dating back over over 6 years:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22Mike%20Vandeman%22%20troll&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wg

"Mike Vandeman" and "[censored]" returns 381 hits:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Mike+Vandeman%22+[censored]&btnG=Search

"Mike Vandeman" and "moron" returns 502 hits:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Mike+Vandeman%22+moron&btnG=Search

"Mike Vandeman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 22:25:42 GMT, "(Pete Cresswell)" <[email hidden]> wrote:

.RE/
.>But I am disturbed by the number of bikers here in New Mexico that do

not

Quoted message said:

.>obey the rules and postings that are meant to protect the Open Space

here in

Quoted message said:

.>Albuquerque.
.>
.>In the back areas it is clearly posted "Do not enter...
.
.It's partially the "one-percenter" effect. IMHO one reason why nobody

should

Quoted message said:

.want their favorite passtimes to be come too popular - MTB-ing,
.Windsurfing.....current becoming a recognized phenomonon in

kitesurfing...

Quoted message said:

.
.Once the raw numbers exceed a certain level, one percent becomes enough

people

Quoted message said:

.to cause problems.

BS. On IMBA's web site is a study showing that a MAJORITY of mountain

bikers

Quoted message said:

break the law.

.Another part is education. At least some of those people aren't

thinking too

Quoted message said:

.deeply and if there were some way to make them see the consequences at

least

Quoted message said:

.some of them would change their behavior.

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"😉. Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

GaryG said:

Please ignore poor Mikey. He is either a troll or a head case.
Either way, he's been posting nonsense in this and other usenet
groups for a long time.

A Google groups search for "Mike Vandeman" and "troll" returns 1880
hits, dating back over over 6 years:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22Mike%20Vandeman%22%20troll&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wg

Quoted message said:

"Mike Vandeman" and "[censored]" returns 381 hits:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Mike+Vandeman%22+[censored]&btnG=Search

Quoted message said:

"Mike Vandeman" and "moron" returns 502 hits:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Mike+Vandeman%22+moron&btnG=Search

Mike Vandeman" and "dicklick" returned just one hit:

Some guy who went to his junior high school and doesn't want to talk about
it.

Bill "sorted pass reveals sordid past" S.

The ONLY idiots are those that respond to Mike.