Ebay Bikes

in message <[email hidden]>, Alan

(') said:

Hi all,

I am in the market for a decent Hybrid / mountain bike for lots of
town
use, light off road / trail riding / wooded paths ( no Ariel
acrobatics), carrying a child on a bike seat and even pulling a two
child carrier gizmo.

In that case you want a hybrid, and you will be better off with slick or
semi-slick tyres and rigid forks. Knobbly tyres are only useful on
really gnarly off-road tracks and are actively a disadvantage on the
road. Good suspension forks are wonderful but very expensive, and cheap
suspension forks are much worse than useless.

Quoted message said:

I was looking on Ebay and there are some nice "Looking" bikes there
which of course bears no reflection on quality or durability.
Also there are dealers ( Bolton etc) with very good feedback who are
obviously supplying a decent service or they would cease to trade.

How can a body determine the likely build quality of these Ebay
bikes?.... the makers names mean nothing to me whatsoever, leaving me
very little to go on.

All sorts of bikes are sold on eBay and there are very good bargains to
be had in second hand bikes. But I would not buy the new bikes which
are offered there. They are broadly similar to the bikes you can get in
supermarkets, or free with Hoover appliances: extraordinarily heavy,
and fitted with rubbish components. They will not give you reasonable
service.

Quoted message said:

I am 5ft 10.5" with a 30 inch inside leg measurement.

Any advice on buying would be appreciated.

Edinburgh Bicycle Cooperative's own brand ('Edinburgh' and 'Revolution'😉
bikes are inexpensive and reliably good value for money. Apart from
that, second hand bikes of reputable brands are often bargains - bikes
are pretty simple and reliable and usually you can fix them up to good
as new by a good service, and replacing any worn out components. Your
local supermarket 'customers adverts' board, or your local newspaper
classifieds ads, is the first place to look but you will also find
bargains on eBay.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

There are no messages. The above is just a random stream of
bytes. Any opinion or meaning you find in it is your own creation.

Alan said:

I am 5ft 10.5" with a 30 inch inside leg measurement.

Any advice on buying would be appreciated.

What's your budget?

--

Burning_Ranger

To email: [email hidden]

Alan said:

Hi all,

I am in the market for a decent Hybrid / mountain bike for lots of town
use, light off road / trail riding / wooded paths ( no Ariel acrobatics),
carrying a child on a bike seat and even pulling a two child carrier gizmo.

I was looking on Ebay and there are some nice "Looking" bikes there which of
course bears no reflection on quality or durability.
Also there are dealers ( Bolton etc) with very good feedback who are
obviously supplying a decent service or they would cease to trade.

How can a body determine the likely build quality of these Ebay bikes?....
the makers names mean nothing to me whatsoever, leaving me very little to go
on.

I am 5ft 10.5" with a 30 inch inside leg measurement.

Any advice on buying would be appreciated.

If its anything like dvd players you find that the chinese/taiwanese
branded model sells for £30 but you can also find the same model with
a japanese case for £70 and a high brow brand name like Denon for £150
but fundamentally they are all the same.

A similar situation seems to be true of bicycles with many famous
brands buying in products from these countries to rebrand and charge a
lot more. You'll probably find that the bikes on ebay around £75 are
similar to budget branded offerings around £150-200 and ebay bikes
around £150 are similar to £300 branded bikes. In a situation like
this you'll be paying for profits twice as the taiwanese company
making the bike will make a profit and then the firm that brands the
bike making theres.

The main thing to watch out for I think is chinese made frames as its
the taiwanese that make low cost high quality frames where as chinese
frames are much more hit and miss. Most of the big american bike firms
and most of the other main brands have their frames made in Taiwan not
mainland china.

It amazes me how much bikes can sell for nowadays made in Taiwan and
China and no wonder Raleigh have stopped manufacturing in this
country. Look at this;

http://www.sterlinghouse.co.uk/Default.asp?Action=ViewProduct&ID=7981

I don't know how good it is and its probably rubbish but its an
amazing price point to reach for a whole bike. Some of the basic
components like shimano tourney gears which can be found on sterling
house bikes costing £40 can be found on bikes costing upto £400 with
decent branding.

Alan said:

Hi all,

I am in the market for a decent Hybrid / mountain bike for lots of town
use, light off road / trail riding / wooded paths ( no Ariel acrobatics),
carrying a child on a bike seat and even pulling a two child carrier gizmo.

I was looking on Ebay and there are some nice "Looking" bikes there which of
course bears no reflection on quality or durability.
Also there are dealers ( Bolton etc) with very good feedback who are
obviously supplying a decent service or they would cease to trade.

How can a body determine the likely build quality of these Ebay bikes?....
the makers names mean nothing to me whatsoever, leaving me very little to go
on.

Have a look at online shops for the same/similar models. The prices
should give you a good idea of relative quality.

"Martin Wilson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

It amazes me how much bikes can sell for nowadays made in Taiwan and
China and no wonder Raleigh have stopped manufacturing in this
country. Look at this;

http://www.sterlinghouse.co.uk/Default.asp?Action=ViewProduct&ID=7981

That's amazing value. Triple chainset, 10 speed rear cog, mudguards and
carrier. Even two cheapo alloy wheels cost more than the price of the whole
bike!
--
Simon M.

Alan said:

I am in the market for a decent Hybrid / mountain bike for lots of town
use, light off road / trail riding / wooded paths ( no Ariel acrobatics),
carrying a child on a bike seat and even pulling a two child carrier gizmo.

What Simon said. Especially the bit about Edinburgh Bikes - I've just
bought an Edinburgh Contour (£215) which came with a Blackburn EX2 rack
(£30) fitted as an optional extra - this rack is rated as suitable for
carrying a child seat, but many aren't, so be careful what you buy. You
can also get things like dynamos and bottle cages fitted.

Contour:
<URL:http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/detail.cfm?ID=19061>
Blackburn EX2:
<URL:http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/detail.cfm?ID=5968>

My requirements were very similar to yours and for this type of use I
reckon the Contour is probably about as good a bike as you'll get for
the money.

Ridgeback bikes are also worth a look - you can get something with a
similar spec to the Contour for about the same money (eg the Rapide
Speed - steel frame, rack and mudguards, triple chainset; or the Rapide
Nova - aluminium frame, no rack or mudguards, single chainset. Both are
£199. Judging by the spec, the Nova is a slightly lighter, sportier bike
but it will take a rack and mudguards should you wish to fit them.)

Speed:
<URL:http://www.ridgebackbikes.co.uk/bikes/2004/bike.asp?seriesid=21&index=2>
Nova:
<URL:http://www.ridgebackbikes.co.uk/bikes/2004/bike.asp?seriesid=21&index=0>

Quoted message said:

Also there are dealers ( Bolton etc) with very good feedback who are
obviously supplying a decent service or they would cease to trade.

I don't know about Bolton but SJS are very reputable - I wouldn't
hesitate to buy from them if they had something I wanted (as long as I
could afford it!)

Aside from the bigger companies, the only measure of seller reliability
on ebay is the seller's feedback rating.

Quoted message said:

How can a body determine the likely build quality of these Ebay bikes?....
the makers names mean nothing to me whatsoever, leaving me very little to go
on.

Ask as many questions as you like in this forum - whether it's about
specific bikes or more general questions such as the relative merits of
suspension vs rigid forks, what tyres/pedals/saddle to fit, etc. -
there's usually someone with an answer, and it's nearly always friendly. 😉

Quoted message said:

I am 5ft 10.5" with a 30 inch inside leg measurement.

I'm a touch shorter than you but have slightly longer legs. The 18"
frame Contour fits me just fine.

d.

in message <[email hidden]>, Martin Wilson

(') said:

Alan said:

Hi all,

I am in the market for a decent Hybrid / mountain bike for lots of
town
use, light off road / trail riding / wooded paths ( no Ariel
acrobatics), carrying a child on a bike seat and even pulling a two
child carrier gizmo.

I was looking on Ebay and there are some nice "Looking" bikes there
which of course bears no reflection on quality or durability.
Also there are dealers ( Bolton etc) with very good feedback who are
obviously supplying a decent service or they would cease to trade.

How can a body determine the likely build quality of these Ebay
bikes?.... the makers names mean nothing to me whatsoever, leaving me
very little to go on.

I am 5ft 10.5" with a 30 inch inside leg measurement.

Any advice on buying would be appreciated.

If its anything like dvd players you find that the chinese/taiwanese
branded model sells for £30 but you can also find the same model with
a japanese case for £70 and a high brow brand name like Denon for £150
but fundamentally they are all the same.

It isn't anything like DVD players.

The cheapest bikes have steel frames with oversize tubes. The reason
aluminium framed bikes use oversize tubes is because aluminium is
lighter but not as strong as steel, so you need a bigger tube to
provide the same strength. Oversize tube steel bikes are intended to
look like (more expensive) aluminium bikes, but are a lot heavier.

Quoted message said:

A similar situation seems to be true of bicycles with many famous
brands buying in products from these countries to rebrand and charge a
lot more. You'll probably find that the bikes on ebay around £75 are
similar to budget branded offerings around £150-200 and ebay bikes
around £150 are similar to £300 branded bikes.

No, you won't. There are a few reliable sellers of good, cheap, bikes in
the UK, the best known probably being Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op.
Otherwise you are buying a pig in a poke, and most of the pigs are
dreadful.

There are some good unbranded Taiwanese bikes around but they are much
rarer than the total [censored] and unless you know what you're doing buy a
brand.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
There's nae Gods, an there's precious few heroes
but there's plenty on the dole in th Land o th Leal;
And it's time now, tae sweep the future clear o
th lies o a past that we know wis never real.

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:u4cft1-

Quoted message said:

The cheapest bikes have steel frames with oversize tubes. The reason
aluminium framed bikes use oversize tubes is because aluminium is
lighter but not as strong as steel, so you need a bigger tube to
provide the same strength. Oversize tube steel bikes are intended to
look like (more expensive) aluminium bikes, but are a lot heavier.

To be fair, the hybrid in the photo uses narrow tubing and isn't trying to
pass itself off as alloy, although it will be poor quality steel of course.

--
Simon M.

Quoted message said:

OTOH look at the customer review at the bottom of this page:

http://www.sterlinghouse.co.uk/Default.asp?Action=ViewProduct&ID=7270

Ok the bikes probably/is rubbish but a lot of these bikes do need
setting up on arrival and a lot of people aren't capable of doing
this. Its almost a diy bike. I'm sure many of these criticisms are
related to the purchaser not tightening or adjusting various things.

I could be wrong of course but when you buy a bike from a LBS its
setup for you and tested. This isn't possible on discount mail order
bikes obviously.

I suspect that basic £60 Tourer is only 10 speed in total (2x5) and
that the image is of a slightly different spec bike. Surely it can't
be 30 speed for that money?

Martin Wilson said:

It amazes me how much bikes can sell for nowadays made in Taiwan and
China and no wonder Raleigh have stopped manufacturing in this
country. Look at this;

http://www.sterlinghouse.co.uk/Default.asp?Action=ViewProduct&ID=7981

Wow. I'm almost tempted to spend 40 quid just to see what
turns up! Until it got stolen a couple of weeks ago, I
used to use a cheap old MTB to pop into town, if it was
going to be locked up out of sight for a while. Something
like this might be a viable replacement...

OTOH look at the customer review at the bottom of this page:

http://www.sterlinghouse.co.uk/Default.asp?Action=ViewProduct&ID=7270

--
jc

Remove the -not from email

Martin Wilson said:

Quoted message said:

OTOH look at the customer review at the bottom of this page:

http://www.sterlinghouse.co.uk/Default.asp?Action=ViewProduct&ID=7270

Ok the bikes probably/is rubbish but a lot of these bikes do need
setting up on arrival and a lot of people aren't capable of doing
this. Its almost a diy bike. I'm sure many of these criticisms are
related to the purchaser not tightening or adjusting various things.

Good point, I hadn't considered that. Bits "snapping off" is a
bit unusual, though.

Quoted message said:

I suspect that basic £60 Tourer is only 10 speed in total (2x5) and
that the image is of a slightly different spec bike. Surely it can't
be 30 speed for that money?

I assumed as you did - when they say "10-speed gripshift" they mean
2x5, but now you mention it, it does look like a triple chainset.

Perhaps these bikes aren't that much different from the £100-ish
Apollo stuff you see in Halfords, and I see quite a lot of those
on the roads.

--
jc

Remove the -not from email

Jeremy Collins said:

Good point, I hadn't considered that. Bits "snapping off" is a
bit unusual, though.

My wife got one of these £40 bikes - just as a taster to see if she was
interested enough in cycling to spend the money on a proper bike at a
later date.

There was a fair bit of setting up and adjusting to do, which is
unsurprising and not a problem for me anyway. Of more serious concern
was the fact that one of the cantilever arms on the front brake was
damaged in such a way as it might have appeared OK to the untrained eye
but would have caused the brakes to fail catastrophically the moment you
pulled hard on the brake lever.

Fortunately, I spotted this and requested a replacement part from
Sterling House, which was dispatched promptly - full marks for customer
service. Even so, the quality of the components doesn't exactly reassure
me - the brake arms are made of plastic resin with a decidedly
cheddar-like consistency. I've told my wife to avoid going down hills as
far as possible until we get her a proper bike.

Aside from that, it's actually not that bad a bike - for the price. I
don't think I'd want to pay much more than £40 for it. There wouldn't be
any point getting one of the £40 bikes if you're the sort of person who
would be tempted to upgrade components - you'd be much better off buying
a better bike to start with.

Quoted message said:

I assumed as you did - when they say "10-speed gripshift" they mean
2x5, but now you mention it, it does look like a triple chainset.

My wife's bike has a triple chainset with a 7-speed freewheel on the back.

Quoted message said:

Perhaps these bikes aren't that much different from the £100-ish
Apollo stuff you see in Halfords, and I see quite a lot of those
on the roads.

I'm almost certain that's the case, and in that context they are pretty
good value.

d.

Hi all

Thanks to everyone so far for the replies and advice.

There is quite a bit of info there so I will take it in and then go a bit
further.

Regards Alan

"davek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Alan said:

I am in the market for a decent Hybrid / mountain bike for lots of town
use, light off road / trail riding / wooded paths ( no Ariel

acrobatics),

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

carrying a child on a bike seat and even pulling a two child carrier

gizmo.

Quoted message said:

What Simon said. Especially the bit about Edinburgh Bikes - I've just
bought an Edinburgh Contour (£215) which came with a Blackburn EX2 rack
(£30) fitted as an optional extra - this rack is rated as suitable for
carrying a child seat, but many aren't, so be careful what you buy. You
can also get things like dynamos and bottle cages fitted.

Contour:
<URL:http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/detail.cfm?ID=19061>
Blackburn EX2:
<URL:http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/detail.cfm?ID=5968>

My requirements were very similar to yours and for this type of use I
reckon the Contour is probably about as good a bike as you'll get for
the money.

Ridgeback bikes are also worth a look - you can get something with a
similar spec to the Contour for about the same money (eg the Rapide
Speed - steel frame, rack and mudguards, triple chainset; or the Rapide
Nova - aluminium frame, no rack or mudguards, single chainset. Both are
£199. Judging by the spec, the Nova is a slightly lighter, sportier bike
but it will take a rack and mudguards should you wish to fit them.)

Speed:

<URL:http://www.ridgebackbikes.co.uk/bikes/2004/bike.asp?seriesid=21&index=2

Quoted message said:

Nova:

<URL:http://www.ridgebackbikes.co.uk/bikes/2004/bike.asp?seriesid=21&index=0

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Also there are dealers ( Bolton etc) with very good feedback who are
obviously supplying a decent service or they would cease to trade.

I don't know about Bolton but SJS are very reputable - I wouldn't
hesitate to buy from them if they had something I wanted (as long as I
could afford it!)

Aside from the bigger companies, the only measure of seller reliability
on ebay is the seller's feedback rating.

Quoted message said:

How can a body determine the likely build quality of these Ebay

bikes?....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the makers names mean nothing to me whatsoever, leaving me very little

to go

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

on.

Ask as many questions as you like in this forum - whether it's about
specific bikes or more general questions such as the relative merits of
suspension vs rigid forks, what tyres/pedals/saddle to fit, etc. -
there's usually someone with an answer, and it's nearly always friendly.

😉

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I am 5ft 10.5" with a 30 inch inside leg measurement.

I'm a touch shorter than you but have slightly longer legs. The 18"
frame Contour fits me just fine.

d.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If its anything like dvd players you find that the chinese/taiwanese
branded model sells for £30 but you can also find the same model with
a japanese case for £70 and a high brow brand name like Denon for £150
but fundamentally they are all the same.

It isn't anything like DVD players.

The cheapest bikes have steel frames with oversize tubes. The reason
aluminium framed bikes use oversize tubes is because aluminium is
lighter but not as strong as steel, so you need a bigger tube to
provide the same strength. Oversize tube steel bikes are intended to
look like (more expensive) aluminium bikes, but are a lot heavier.

But surely then if there made of steel and even more oversized than
normal they will be stronger than normal and that might be what they
are aiming for. Not that many of the bikes featured are oversized in
this way anyway.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A similar situation seems to be true of bicycles with many famous
brands buying in products from these countries to rebrand and charge a
lot more. You'll probably find that the bikes on ebay around £75 are
similar to budget branded offerings around £150-200 and ebay bikes
around £150 are similar to £300 branded bikes.

No, you won't. There are a few reliable sellers of good, cheap, bikes in
the UK, the best known probably being Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op.
Otherwise you are buying a pig in a poke, and most of the pigs are
dreadful.

Parkers do aluminium bikes that don't fetch much more than £100 and
feature components that are fitted to bikes 2 to 3 times more
expensive in some shops. You say 'No, you won't' above but how can you
be so decisive? What makes you think a company in Taiwan that sells a
frame to a US or euro brand company won't sell the same frame in a
bike they themselves fully assemble? Assuming the edinburgh co-op
import taiwanese frames and then bolt on the components themselves
wouldn't it be cheaper if the actual assembly was done on a production
line in a lowish wage economy like Taiwan?

Quoted message said:

There are some good unbranded Taiwanese bikes around but they are much
rarer than the total [censored] and unless you know what you're doing buy a
brand.

Universal bicycles seem to be the main importer of chinese made
bicycles and these seem to sell via the mail order catalogues and
halfords plus customer returns are sold via sterling house. There are
also resellers of universal returns on ebay.

I think Parker are selling bikes from a company/importer called Viking
who have stronger connections with taiwan.

Quoted message said:

To be fair, the hybrid in the photo uses narrow tubing and isn't trying

to

Quoted message said:

pass itself off as alloy, although it will be poor quality steel of

course.

Quoted message said:

--
Simon M.

This is exactly the bike I got off eBay fo £50. For commuting to the rail
station 3 miles each way it is great and if it goes missing it is 'only'
£50. It even survived my crash (not the bikes fault) a week or so ago much
better than my arm did.

However, if you intend to do any serious cycling then get a 'proper' bike as
after a few miles you can certainly tell the difference. A friend got a
nice Claud Butler Milano off eBay for aserious discount but there is a lot
of overpriced rubbish on there.

Woody

davek <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I don't know about Bolton but SJS are very reputable - I wouldn't
hesitate to buy from them if they had something I wanted (as long as I
could afford it!)

SJS reputable? Really? That wouldn't be the same SJS then who tried to
rip off some of EBC's business by registering a domain name containing
the words 'edinburgh' and 'bicycle' would it?

See here if you don't remember the incident...
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=lang_en&ie=UTF-8&threadm=38A01E44.F9E07C8F%40no-spam-geocities.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dg:thl3094104913d%26dq%3D%26hl%3Den%26lr%3Dlang_en%26ie%3DUTF-8%26selm%3D38A01E44.F9E07C8F%2540no-spam-geocities.com
or http://makeashorterlink.com/?L27363AE8 if you prefer.

They've never had any of my money since then.

peter said:

SJS reputable? Really? That wouldn't be the same SJS then who tried to
rip off some of EBC's business by registering a domain name containing
the words 'edinburgh' and 'bicycle' would it?

I think it sucked (and I wrote to SJS complaining, as it happens), but
it's hardly ripping off EBC's business as once you got to SJS there was
never any suggestion you'd gone to EBC, and if you specifically wanted
to find EBC you wouldn't have much trouble tracing the error.
I think it's fair to say that you could expect a fair dose of specialist
knowledge, a fair deal and customer satisfaction if you were to buy from
SJS, which is rather more to the point here. And I further note that
the fake name link doesn't seem to work any more, so maybe they learned
their lesson?

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch said:

peter said:

SJS reputable? Really? That wouldn't be the same SJS then who tried to
rip off some of EBC's business by registering a domain name containing
the words 'edinburgh' and 'bicycle' would it?

I think it sucked (and I wrote to SJS complaining, as it happens),

As did I, and I got an apologetic reply. It seems they regretted it
almost as soon as they did it.

They're certainly knowledgeable, and I've never had any direct
dealings with them, but they're said to be reliable, but can tend to
grumpiness.

A

"Woody" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:qwyNc.543$%
A friend got a

Quoted message said:

nice Claud Butler Milano off eBay for aserious discount but there is a lot
of overpriced rubbish on there.

I was going to get one of those in yellow+black (v. nice) before I settled
on a Fondriest.
--
Simon M.