Bravo Freddy

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

Quoted message said:

A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!

4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

Boyd Speerschneider said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

Quoted message said:

A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!

4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

Yeah, look how the europeans creamed the americans in their own
championship race. There was something about this in VeloNews some
while back, making the National Championship race USA riders only.

How many other countries allow international riders in their championship?

"Boyd Speerschneider" <bspeerscREMOVE_ME@ME_TOOyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

Quoted message said:

A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!

4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

As first American, in 4th place, Freddy has indeed won the right to wear the
jersey of USPRO champion for the coming year. While he didn't win overall
this year, he has won overal in the past, as was the last USPRO champion to
do so. Considering his win this year in the Giro against Petacchi(sp?), he's
clearly a very deserving US champion.

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Boyd Speerschneider said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

Quoted message said:

A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!

4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

Yeah, look how the europeans creamed the americans in their own
championship race. There was something about this in VeloNews some
while back, making the National Championship race USA riders only.

The US riders made up nearly 50% of the top 30 finishers. It is true than
most of the DNFs were US riders. But,consider also that some of the
allegely best US riders were not in Philadelphia. Perhaps it's time to move
the championship to the week the Euro championshpis are held and make it an
all american event. This has been discussed here at length before. No easy
answer.

Quoted message said:

How many other countries allow international riders in their championship?

"Boyd Speerschneider" <bspeerscREMOVE_ME@ME_TOOyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

Quoted message said:

A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!

4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

Consider also that Freddy won the week long overall.

B. Lafferty said:

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Boyd Speerschneider said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

>A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!

4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

Yeah, look how the europeans creamed the americans in their own
championship race. There was something about this in VeloNews some
while back, making the National Championship race USA riders only.

The US riders made up nearly 50% of the top 30 finishers. It is true than
most of the DNFs were US riders. But,consider also that some of the
allegely best US riders were not in Philadelphia. Perhaps it's time to move
the championship to the week the Euro championshpis are held and make it an
all american event. This has been discussed here at length before. No easy
answer.

Something I did see, here, I believe was this is the last year for this
sponsor of the race. Maybe a new sponsor and a new time go together.

Richard Adams said:

Boyd Speerschneider wrote:
How many other countries allow international riders in their
championship?

None in Europe.

--

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Yeah, look how the europeans creamed the americans in their own
championship race. There was something about this in VeloNews some
while back, making the National Championship race USA riders only.

How many other countries allow international riders in their championship?

Australia does, though usually only a few euros are in the bunch, and they
mainly are there to help their Aussie teammates. Canada also, but the
foreigners they attract are those riding on the US circuit. And the three
Baltic countries have a funky race where all three jerseys are given out in
one race.

I think the problem with a national championship at the end of June is that
you would never get any US rider planning to ride the Tour to come. And it
would be a pity to limit Philly to US riders, because this would downgrade
the best race on the domestic calendar.

Probably the ideal solution would be to have another race, limited to US
riders, run the same week as Philly/Trenton/Lancaster. It also would be
nice if they made Philly a harder race so that we don't get a bunch sprint.
But face it: the Philly race is a much bigger deal than the satisfaction of
us real cycling fans, or even the cyclists and teams. The huge crowd and
awesome civic support is special, and I bet the organizers are loathe to
screw around with the formula (and I wouldn't blame them).

JMS

"JMS" wrote...

Quoted message said:

Probably the ideal solution would be to have another race, limited to US
riders, run the same week as Philly/Trenton/Lancaster. It also would be
nice if they made Philly a harder race so that we don't get a bunch

sprint.

Quoted message said:

But face it: the Philly race is a much bigger deal than the satisfaction

of

Quoted message said:

us real cycling fans, or even the cyclists and teams. The huge crowd and
awesome civic support is special, and I bet the organizers are loathe to
screw around with the formula (and I wouldn't blame them).

It really boils down to a what -- thirteen mile (or whatever) circuit race.
The fact that it's the "US Pro Cycling Championship" and in Philly probably
speaks more to the weakness of USA Pro Cycling than to the strength of the
course (eh?). A week of crits then a circuit race. The United States --
let's face it -- can create a better course, and a better week, in an
equally strong economic center than that. I shudder to say this, but they
could probably even do better in Boston. There's plenty of local money in
Philadelphia that will try to keep it there, I am guessing, but a true
national championship can do better than a circuit race, IMHO.

JF

[censored], DC Shoes offered the City of Philadelphia a million dollars last week
to reopen Love Park to skateboarders and The Honorable Mayor John Street sez
no. As bicyclist friendly as Philly can be (on a good day), they're just in
it for the money. The bike messenger championships were fun tho.

There is one more year on the contract!

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

B. Lafferty said:

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Boyd Speerschneider wrote:

>"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:P6Kwc.15569$Yd3.10031
>@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:
>
>
>
>>A well desered win for a solid rider and a nice guy! BRAVO!
>
>
>4th place isn't a win... even if he gets the jersey for the next year.

Yeah, look how the europeans creamed the americans in their own
championship race. There was something about this in VeloNews some
while back, making the National Championship race USA riders only.

The US riders made up nearly 50% of the top 30 finishers. It is true

than

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

most of the DNFs were US riders. But,consider also that some of the
allegely best US riders were not in Philadelphia. Perhaps it's time to

move

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the championship to the week the Euro championshpis are held and make it

an

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

all american event. This has been discussed here at length before. No

easy

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

answer.

Something I did see, here, I believe was this is the last year for this
sponsor of the race. Maybe a new sponsor and a new time go together.

I rode the Austrian pro championships in 92. It happens in some countries.

"Time Cop" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Richard Adams said:

Boyd Speerschneider wrote:
How many other countries allow international riders in their
championship?

None in Europe.

--

Jim almost all the countries national championships are a circuit races. The
worlds is always a circuit race. Try and organize a race in Boston. Shut one
road done and the city would be at gridlock for days.

"Jim Flom" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:5wRwc.29019$B%4.1171@clgrps12...

Quoted message said:

"JMS" wrote...

Quoted message said:

Probably the ideal solution would be to have another race, limited to US
riders, run the same week as Philly/Trenton/Lancaster. It also would be
nice if they made Philly a harder race so that we don't get a bunch

sprint.

Quoted message said:

But face it: the Philly race is a much bigger deal than the satisfaction

of

Quoted message said:

us real cycling fans, or even the cyclists and teams. The huge crowd

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

awesome civic support is special, and I bet the organizers are loathe to
screw around with the formula (and I wouldn't blame them).

It really boils down to a what -- thirteen mile (or whatever) circuit

race.

Quoted message said:

The fact that it's the "US Pro Cycling Championship" and in Philly

probably

Quoted message said:

speaks more to the weakness of USA Pro Cycling than to the strength of the
course (eh?). A week of crits then a circuit race. The United States --
let's face it -- can create a better course, and a better week, in an
equally strong economic center than that. I shudder to say this, but they
could probably even do better in Boston. There's plenty of local money in
Philadelphia that will try to keep it there, I am guessing, but a true
national championship can do better than a circuit race, IMHO.

JF

Big difference between skateboarders tearing up a park and a cycling event
that brings positive revenue to buisness and a overall good light on the
city.

"Jim Flom" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:qzRwc.29079$B%4.22193@clgrps12...

Quoted message said:

[censored], DC Shoes offered the City of Philadelphia a million dollars last

week

Quoted message said:

to reopen Love Park to skateboarders and The Honorable Mayor John Street

sez

Quoted message said:

no. As bicyclist friendly as Philly can be (on a good day), they're just

in

Quoted message said:

it for the money. The bike messenger championships were fun tho.

No Threshold is still Threshold, Tailwind is a partner in the San Fran race.
Whats up Carl

Tom

"Carl Sundquist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Benjamin Weiner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

AFAIK, the big Euro countries' national championships, and the road
worlds, are circuit races. I don't know if this is for logistical
reasons, tradition, or both. Philly is different from the Euros
because it is the same circuit each year. Given the difficulty of
closing down cities for courses in the US that seems understandable.
It's not clear to me that the US _can_ create a better week and a
better course than Philly, since cycling is a marginal sport here.
Nobody's doing it - the SFGP is the comparable race right now and its
finances are always a little questionable (and it's the same organizers
anyway).

I haven't kept up on it, but the Philly races were organized by Dave
Chauner's group. Did Tailwind Sports buy them out?

Jim Flom said:

It really boils down to a what -- thirteen mile (or whatever) circuit race.
The fact that it's the "US Pro Cycling Championship" and in Philly probably
speaks more to the weakness of USA Pro Cycling than to the strength of the
course (eh?). A week of crits then a circuit race. The United States --
let's face it -- can create a better course, and a better week, in an
equally strong economic center than that. I shudder to say this, but they
could probably even do better in Boston. There's plenty of local money in
Philadelphia that will try to keep it there, I am guessing, but a true
national championship can do better than a circuit race, IMHO.

AFAIK, the big Euro countries' national championships, and the road
worlds, are circuit races. I don't know if this is for logistical
reasons, tradition, or both. Philly is different from the Euros
because it is the same circuit each year. Given the difficulty of
closing down cities for courses in the US that seems understandable.
It's not clear to me that the US _can_ create a better week and a
better course than Philly, since cycling is a marginal sport here.
Nobody's doing it - the SFGP is the comparable race right now and its
finances are always a little questionable (and it's the same organizers
anyway).

IMO, the teams at Philly are stronger now and so there are just enough
riders left at the end to bring back last-lap breaks over Lemon Hill.
That doesn't mean it's easy. Some dude who beat Alessandro Petacchi
straight up only managed fourth.

"Benjamin Weiner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

AFAIK, the big Euro countries' national championships, and the road
worlds, are circuit races. I don't know if this is for logistical
reasons, tradition, or both. Philly is different from the Euros
because it is the same circuit each year. Given the difficulty of
closing down cities for courses in the US that seems understandable.
It's not clear to me that the US _can_ create a better week and a
better course than Philly, since cycling is a marginal sport here.
Nobody's doing it - the SFGP is the comparable race right now and its
finances are always a little questionable (and it's the same organizers
anyway).

I haven't kept up on it, but the Philly races were organized by Dave
Chauner's group. Did Tailwind Sports buy them out?

In Santa Cruz, CA, a skateboard park was built down near the main
tourist hub of the municipal wharf and boardwalk. It's certainly
cleared out many of the skateboarders from downtown where sidewalks
around shops and restaurants are mostly clear of them. My only
complaint about skateboarders is the racket from practicing some Tony
Hawk move day in and day out.

armstrong said:

Big difference between skateboarders tearing up a park and a cycling event
that brings positive revenue to buisness and a overall good light on the
city.

"Jim Flom" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:qzRwc.29079$B%4.22193@clgrps12...

Quoted message said:

[censored], DC Shoes offered the City of Philadelphia a million dollars last

week

Quoted message said:

to reopen Love Park to skateboarders and The Honorable Mayor John Street

sez

Quoted message said:

no. As bicyclist friendly as Philly can be (on a good day), they're just

in

Quoted message said:

it for the money. The bike messenger championships were fun tho.

"armstrong" wrote ...

Quoted message said:

Big difference between skateboarders tearing up a park and a cycling event
that brings positive revenue to buisness and a overall good light on the
city.

Oh, don't even go there about skateboarders. That's as bad a stereotype as
any motorist ever had about cyclists.