Towing another bike?

Erik Freitag said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

a) Perhaps a "Trail-Gator" is what you want. Bike Nashbar sells them.

nashbar.comprofile.cfmOpen ↗

b) I've found it pretty easy to ride one bike while I steered another bike alongside. I kept my hand
on the other bike's handlebar stem. However, I think I'd try this only if the ride was smooth and
traffic-free.

c) Sounds like you've got a good excuse to buy a tandem!

--
Frank Krygowski [email hidden]

Erik Freitag said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

Yes, let her ride her bicycle to and from practice. Otherwise I don't understand the problem.

Jobst Brandt [email hidden] Palo Alto CA

In jobst.brandt@stanfordalumni. org said:

Erik Freitag said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

Yes, let her ride her bicycle to and from practice. Otherwise I don't understand the problem.

Jobst Brandt [email hidden] Palo Alto CA

I probably gave an incomplete explanation - it is difficult to convey the complexity of a pre-teen's
life in a short post.

She is dropped off at the practice field by car from school - too far to ride her bike from school
to practice in the time available. Home to practice field: 4-5 miles; school to practice field: 15
miles; home to school: also 15 miles.

Just to fuel the fire, I should mention that she is afraid to ride her bike the 15 miles to school
because she is afraid of traffic, which in my opinion, is pretty benign on her route. I'd be
interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic, but I don't
expect any progress until she gets to high school, which is a little closer to home.

In article said:

In jobst.brandt@stanfordalumni. org said:

Erik Freitag writes:

Quoted message said:

I probably gave an incomplete explanation - it is difficult to convey the complexity of a
pre-teen's life in a short post.

She is dropped off at the practice field by car from school - too far to ride her bike from school
to practice in the time available. Home to practice field: 4-5 miles; school to practice field: 15
miles; home to school: also 15 miles.

Just to fuel the fire, I should mention that she is afraid to ride her bike the 15 miles to school
because she is afraid of traffic, which in my opinion, is pretty benign on her route. I'd be
interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic, but I
don't expect any progress until she gets to high school, which is a little closer to home.

15 miles for a pre-teen? I don't think traffic levels would be my first concern. How fast can she
ride, anyways?

15 miles would take me an hour, maybe 45 minutes under ideal circumstances, and I fancy my self a
reasonably fast rider for a commuter.

--
Ryan Cousineau, [email hidden] sfu.ca~rcousineOpen ↗ President, Fabrizio Mazzoleni Fan Club

Found an old rusty bike in a dumpster and tried to tow it home using duct tape to afix (tow it) to
my bike. A great failure.

To my surprise, I was able to balance the bike from the cross-bar on (my right) handlebar just
inside of the grip as I recall. I travelled a distance of about 5 miles fairly flat. I balanced the
bike at an angle so it was off and away from the operation of my bike. I had to make sure the pedal
on the inside was at a correct position so in the event of an occasional swaying motion it would not
intefere with my operation. I believe the pedal was kept high. Of course, it is/was all about
balance, but just a normal grip was all that was necessary. It was kind of fun and not really a
problem. Hope I have described it well enough.

Erik Freitag said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

"Erik Freitag" wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at
the practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow
her bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

She is dropped off at the practice field by car from school - too far to ride her bike from school
to practice in the time available. Home to practice field: 4-5 miles; school to practice field: 15
miles; home to school: also 15 miles.

Just to fuel the fire, I should mention that she is afraid to ride her bike the 15 miles to school
because she is afraid of traffic, which in my opinion, is pretty benign on her route. I'd be
interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic, but I
don't expect any progress until she gets to high school, which is a little closer to home.

Get a tandem. Get some exercise, bond with your daughter, help her gain more confidence in traffic.
Trail-a-bikes are nice, but they might strike a pre-teen as a bit juvenile.

--
mark

Frank Krygowski <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Erik Freitag said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

b) I've found it pretty easy to ride one bike while I steered another bike alongside. I kept my
hand on the other bike's handlebar stem. However, I think I'd try this only if the ride was
smooth and traffic-free.

c) Sounds like you've got a good excuse to buy a tandem!

Here's another vote for a tandem, they can be ridden by a single rider and can be a lot of fun for a
parent & child. Sheldon Brown has a nice write up on tandems and kids
sheldonbrown.comtandkids.htmlOpen ↗ Although a good quality used tandem is not cheap, they
hold their value well which helps make this a reasonable cost option.

We have a ca. early 80's Santana tandem with kid back to ride with our 5 year old and a Burley
Piccolo half bike to ride with our 3 year old. The half bike works well but it's not as efficient as
the tandem (I see many cheap non-Burley half bikes in our area that do not have a good connection
between the half bike and adult bike and those do not appear to be a good solution). A direct quote
from my 5 year old yesterday "tandems are the best, we're much faster on a tandem". This as she and
my wife zoomed by on the tandem while I struggled to keep up pulling the Piccolo and a trailer
behind my single.

Although I've pulled many single bikes riding my single using one hand on the stem I would not
recommend this on a regular basis.

Bill "tandems are the best" Putnam

Erik Freitag said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, let her ride her bicycle to and from practice. Otherwise I don't understand the problem.

Quoted message said:

I probably gave an incomplete explanation - it is difficult to convey the complexity of a
pre-teen's life in a short post.

Quoted message said:

She is dropped off at the practice field by car from school - too far to ride her bike from school
to practice in the time available. Home to practice field: 4-5 miles; school to practice field: 15
miles; home to school: also 15 miles.

Is this really necessary? It sounds like a lot of travel. Maybe she should get on the school soccer
team so practice is at a reasonable distance. I don't know when school is out but riding 15 miles
doesn't sound bad to me. It probably does more for fitness than playing soccer.

Quoted message said:

Just to fuel the fire, I should mention that she is afraid to ride her bike the 15 miles to school
because she is afraid of traffic, which in my opinion, is pretty benign on her route. I'd be
interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic, but I
don't expect any progress until she gets to high school, which is a little closer to home.

That's another problem entirely. I see many high school youths who are afraid of many things that
they should be able to handle had they not led such a sheltered early youth, a time for adjusting to
the world and its problems. Around here there are huge traffic jams of SUV's at schools. Even at
neighborhood school bus-stop, parents deliver children and wait reading newspapers until they are
SAFELY on the bus.

Jobst Brandt [email hidden] Palo Alto CA

"Bill Putnam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Frank Krygowski <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Erik Freitag said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip

by car of around

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

5 miles. Round-trip by bike is around 4 miles. One of

the other parents

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

picks her up at school and drops her off at the

practice field, by car.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Is there any technique or hardware component that

would let me tow her

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could

ride back together?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

b) I've found it pretty easy to ride one bike while I

steered another

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

bike alongside. I kept my hand on the other bike's

handlebar stem.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

However, I think I'd try this only if the ride was

smooth and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

traffic-free.

c) Sounds like you've got a good excuse to buy a tandem!

Here's another vote for a tandem, they can be ridden by a

single rider

Quoted message said:

and can be a lot of fun for a parent & child. Sheldon

Brown has a nice

Quoted message said:

write up on tandems and kids

sheldonbrown.comtandkids.htmlOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Although a good quality used tandem is not cheap, they

hold their

Quoted message said:

value well which helps make this a reasonable cost option.

We have a ca. early 80's Santana tandem with kid back to

ride with our

Quoted message said:

5 year old and a Burley Piccolo half bike to ride with our

3 year old.

Quoted message said:

The half bike works well but it's not as efficient as the

tandem (I

Quoted message said:

see many cheap non-Burley half bikes in our area that do

not have a

Quoted message said:

good connection between the half bike and adult bike and

those do not

Quoted message said:

appear to be a good solution). A direct quote from my 5

year old

Quoted message said:

yesterday "tandems are the best, we're much faster on a

tandem". This

Quoted message said:

as she and my wife zoomed by on the tandem while I

struggled to keep

Quoted message said:

up pulling the Piccolo and a trailer behind my single.

Although I've pulled many single bikes riding my single

using one hand

Quoted message said:

on the stem I would not recommend this on a regular basis.

I'll third the motion for the tandem. If you don't want to spring for a new one, used ones are
always available somewhere. Because of the good resale (compared to other bikes) you can probably
unload it if/when you're done, for about what you paid for it. The downsides are the cost, the cost
of shipping, and storage -- they take up a lot of space.

Tandems are always appealing. Your daughter will probably think it's cool, and so so will her
friends. We have one sitting in the garage that's been in the family for years. It's a cheapo
coaster brake beach cruiser type, not workable for hills, but great fun for beach areas. Every time
it gets taken out, someone approaches with an offer to buy it.

Note to Drill Sgt. Jobst -- 15 miles is a pretty healthy ride for a young teenager, and probably not
doable at all in conjunction with other athletics. Even healthy teenagers rarely have that kind of
energy, let alone the time. I'd want to be sure they could stay awake to get their homework done.

Matt O.

When we were kids, we weren't afraid at all to ride in traffic. As a result, several of us got hit.
I learned how to ride in the street after watching my friend's little brother knocked clean off his
bike by a car.

I'd look for a used trail gator, or something like that. It sounds like you just need to tow an
empty bike, and you might even be able to tow an adult bike (without rider) with it.

I just try to ride with my kids as much as I can, and I try to put them in front as much as
possible. This way they can make mistakes and I can yell at them before they get into real trouble.
It's also a little less intimidating riding with an adult. My daughter is very cautious, but my son
would cross the autobahn if there was an ice cream truck on the other side. Cautious is better.

Steve.

P.S.Send your kids on a 15 mile ride to reduce the SUV traffic at the school parking lot? That's the
stupidest thing I've heard all day, and I work with a bunch of engineers, so I hear a lot of
stupid things.

Quoted message said:

Erik Freitag writes:

...

Quoted message said:

Just to fuel the fire, I should mention that she is afraid to ride her bike the 15 miles to school
because she is afraid of traffic, which in my opinion, is pretty benign on her route. I'd be
interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic, but I
don't expect any progress until she gets to high school, which is a little closer to home.

That's another problem entirely. I see many high school youths who are afraid of many things that
they should be able to handle had they not led such a sheltered early youth, a time for adjusting
to the world and its problems. Around here there are huge traffic jams of SUV's at schools. Even
at neighborhood school bus-stop, parents deliver children and wait reading newspapers until they
are SAFELY on the bus.

Jobst Brandt [email hidden] Palo Alto CA

Erik Freitag <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of around 5 miles. Round-trip by
bike is around 4 miles. One of the other parents picks her up at school and drops her off at the
practice field, by car. Is there any technique or hardware component that would let me tow her
bike to the practice field with my bike, so we could ride back together?

I have an idea:

Take an old front hub, tape it or somehow attach it to a rack on the back of your bike Duct tape,
zip tie, etc.). Remove the front wheel from your daughter's bike and attach that somehow to her
bike-- use a bungy and strap it to the side of the bike. Then mount her bike's front forks onto the
old hub you fastened to your bike and use a quick release to hold it on. Does that make sense?

I came up with this solution so I could ride the bike I have my son's child seat attached to with my
race bike towed behind. That way I can go to races that are close by with my son and leave him in
the care of a team mate who races some other category while I ride.

Jobst, does that fit your vision of how children should be raised?

--Keven.

Erik Freitag said:

I'd be interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic....

I've recently started taking my seven-year-old son on short (< 5 mile) rides to nearby parks, the
grocery store, etc. in order to get him acclimated to riding in traffic. I'm teaching him the rules
of the road, traffic safety, and cycling safety things like making eye contact and so forth.
Basically I'm indoctrinating him with Forester's Effective Cycling material :-), pointing out things
to watch for as we encounter them.

I plan on building up his exposure to traffic, staying in our low-traffic residential area, then
gradually moving up from there when I feel he's ready for it. I envision this process taking a
few years.

Saturday I was in Colorado Springs and I talked with a dad and his two sons who were riding some
*nice* road bikes. The kids -- ages 10 and 11 IIRC -- were on custom 47 cm frames. They were riding
in an area with narrow roads and moderate traffic and the kids seemed to handle their bikes and the
traffic just fine.

RFM

In drifter said:

Found an old rusty bike in a dumpster and tried to tow it home using duct tape to afix (tow it) to
my bike. A great failure.

To my surprise, I was able to balance the bike from the cross-bar on ( my right) handlebar just
inside of the grip as I recall. I travelled a distance of about 5 miles fairly flat. I balanced
the bike at an angle so it was off and away from the operation of my bike. I had to make sure the
pedal on the inside was at a correct position so in the event of an occasional swaying motion it
would not intefere with my operation. I believe the pedal was kept high. Of course, it is/was all
about balance, but just a normal grip was all that was necessary. It was kind of fun and not
really a problem. Hope I have described it well enough.

That's clear, thanks. I'll give it a try.

In Keven Ruf said:

I have an idea:

Take an old front hub, tape it or somehow attach it to a rack on the back of your bike Duct tape,
zip tie, etc.). Remove the front wheel from your daughter's bike and attach that somehow to her
bike-- use a bungy and strap it to the side of the bike. Then mount her bike's front forks onto
the old hub you fastened to your bike and use a quick release to hold it on. Does that make sense?

I came up with this solution so I could ride the bike I have my son's child seat attached to with
my race bike towed behind. That way I can go to races that are close by with my son and leave him
in the care of a team mate who races some other category while I ride.

Jobst, does that fit your vision of how children should be raised?

--Keven.

I like this a lot. I was trying to think of a way to put the front wheel in some kind of mount on
the rack, this might be easier. Thanks.

In Ryan Cousineau said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Erik Freitag
<[email hidden]> wrote:

15 miles for a pre-teen? I don't think traffic levels would be my first concern. How fast can she
ride, anyways?

Not very fast this trip would probably take her 70 minutes. I was trying to explain why it won't
really work to have her ride her bike to school, then to practice.

In jobst.brandt@stanfordalumni. org said:

Erik Freitag said:

Quoted message said:

> I pick up my daughter at soccer practice, a round-trip by car of

Is this really necessary? It sounds like a lot of travel. Maybe she should get on the school
soccer team so practice is at a reasonable distance. I don't know when school is out but riding 15
miles doesn't sound bad to me. It probably does more for fitness than playing soccer.

It is a lot of travel. 15 miles is around 70 minutes (each way) by bike for her, even if she would
do it. The school doesn't have a soccer team, and she doesn't play soccer for fitness. I'm guessing
from your suggestions that you might not have kids her age.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just to fuel the fire, I should mention that she is afraid to ride

That's another problem entirely. I see many high school youths who are afraid of many things that
they should be able to handle had they not led such a sheltered early youth, a time for adjusting
to the world and its problems. Around here there are huge traffic jams of SUV's at schools. Even
at neighborhood school bus-stop, parents deliver children and wait reading newspapers until they
are SAFELY on the bus.

Alas, yes. Kids! What's the matter with kids these days? ... Why can't they be like we were, perfect
in every way? ...

In Fritz M said:

Erik Freitag said:

I'd be interested in hearing suggestions to help her to get her more comfortable with traffic....

I've recently started taking my seven-year-old son on short (< 5 mile) rides to nearby parks, the
grocery store, etc. in order to get him acclimated to riding in traffic. I'm teaching him the
rules of the road, traffic safety, and cycling safety things like making eye contact and so forth.
Basically I'm indoctrinating him with Forester's Effective Cycling material :-), pointing out
things to watch for as we encounter them.

I plan on building up his exposure to traffic, staying in our low-traffic residential area, then
gradually moving up from there when I feel he's ready for it. I envision this process taking a
few years.

Saturday I was in Colorado Springs and I talked with a dad and his two sons who were riding some
*nice* road bikes. The kids -- ages 10 and 11 IIRC -- were on custom 47 cm frames. They were
riding in an area with narrow roads and moderate traffic and the kids seemed to handle their bikes
and the traffic just fine.

RFM

This is kind of my approach as well. There are several problems.

(1) As Mr. Brandt pointed out above, kids are lazy slugs, and will do anything to get out of any
activity that smells like work. They also don't have the drive to stay with it until it is not
so much effort.

I know of two very pretty "easy" rides around here - Cañada Road on Sunday and the Nimitz Way path
to Inspiration Point in Tilden Park. Both of these are "too hilly" for my kids. I think anyone who
reads this newsgroup would have a hard time recalling a hill on either of these rides. After riding
3 miles into Nimitz Way and back, my youngest claims she will never ride a bike again - I'm sure
this isn't true, but now I'm in for a lot of convincing ...

(2) Opposite other suggestions in this thread that kids might think some kinds of bikes are cool,
all kids that I know think that bikes are for geeks and really don't want to be seen riding one,
especially with old dad. Bog forbid there should be a flat.

I'm trying to point out the freedom being able to ride a bike effectively will give them - they
could easily get to a friend's house, the ice cream store, or the mall by riding their bikes. Much
easier than wheedling a ride from the 'rents.

In mark said:

Get a tandem. Get some exercise, bond with your daughter, help her gain more confidence in
traffic. Trail-a-bikes are nice, but they might strike a pre-teen as a bit juvenile.

Well, yeah - I kind of wanted to bond with her without pulling her. Don't really have a place to
keep a tandem anyway.

In Steve said:

When we were kids, we weren't afraid at all to ride in traffic. As a result, several of us got
hit. I learned how to ride in the street after watching my friend's little brother knocked clean
off his bike by a car.

I'd look for a used trail gator, or something like that. It sounds like you just need to tow an
empty bike, and you might even be able to tow an adult bike (without rider) with it.

I just try to ride with my kids as much as I can ...

.. me too. drifter had a good idea, above, which I'll try, and I'm really liking Keven's concept.