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BeHIT

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UK and Europe
Published
27 April 2004
Last activity
29 April 2004
Original author
Just Zis Guy
Posts
19
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  1. BeHIT say:

    getreading.co.ukstory.asp

    “Some of our opponents in the cycling lobby were putting out
    propaganda on websites.

    “We can at least say that all the information that we used
    was based on real evidence and genuine facts.”

    So, BHIT said "Jason Queally supports the bill".

    Apparently not: BikeBiz says....

    Tuesday 20th April 2004 Jason Queally does not support
    BHIT's helmet-compulsion bill Chris Murray, Queally's agent,
    will be calling BHIT today to clarify with the Reading-based
    charity that the Olympic gold medal winning cyclist is pro-
    helmet but cannot be used to endorse Eric Martlew's private
    members' bill. This follows yesterday's news that Nationwide
    is downgrading its support of BHIT because of its political
    lobbying activities.

    Mainstream websites such as BBC.co.uk have been told that
    Jason Queally supports Martlew's bill.

    [See news.bbc.co.uk3
    623089.stm]

    In fact, the rider has not been consulted by BHIT about the
    bill, said Chris Murray, Queally's agent.

    "Jason wouldn't ride his bike without his helmet and
    supports the Bicycle Helmet Initiative Trusts aims to
    popularise cycle helmet wearing, but Jason has not been
    briefed about the specifics of the bill. I shall be calling
    BHIT today to clarify this position"

    --
    Guy
    ===
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after
    posting. chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at
    Washington University

  2. All riders of two wheelers should wear helmets, stands
    to reason.

    --
    Ian

    catrike.co.ukcatrike.co.uk

    Quoted message said:

    From: "Just zis Guy, you know?"
    <[email hidden]> Organization: Disorganised
    Reply-To: [email hidden] Newsgroups:
    uk.rec.cycling Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 22:56:07 +0100
    Subject: BeHIT

    BeHIT say:

    getreading.co.ukstory.asp

    “Some of our opponents in the cycling lobby were putting
    out propaganda on websites.

  3. In article <[email hidden]>,
    [email hidden] says...

    Quoted message said:

    All riders of two wheelers should wear helmets, stands
    to reason.


    Get back under your bridge, you nasty troll
    --
    .paul

    If at first you don't succeed... Skydiving is probably not
    the sport for you.

  4. Ian said:

    All riders of two wheelers should wear helmets, stands
    to reason.


    why ?

  5. Just zis Guy said:


    BeHIT say:

    getreading.co.ukstory.asp

    “Some of our opponents in the cycling lobby were putting
    out propaganda on websites.

    Just what the hell does Lee expect? Did she expect opponents
    to do nothing? At least this time perhaps she has learned
    something as her statement above does not say that this
    "propaganda" was incorrect.

    John B

  6. MSeries said:


    Ian said:

    All riders of two wheelers should wear helmets, stands
    to reason.


    why ?

    As protection against the light sabres ;-)

    John B

  7. Well, it is obvious, especially on upwrongs, the rider falls
    over and always lands on their head, on two wheel recumbents
    it is less frequent but happens at higher speed, much better
    to sit between three wheels.

    --
    Ian

    catrike.co.ukcatrike.co.uk

    Quoted message said:

    From: "MSeries" <[email hidden]> Reply-To:
    "MSeries" <[email hidden]> Newsgroups:
    uk.rec.cycling Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 08:03:58 +0100
    Subject: Re: BeHIT

    Ian said:

    All riders of two wheelers should wear helmets, stands to
    reason.


    why ?

  8. Are you writing a letter? Reference to a few "facts" in the
    EDM should help illuminate the matter for readers. I would
    but I've found out of towners generally don't get published.

    Tony

    Just zis Guy said:

    BeHIT say:

    getreading.co.ukstory.asp

    "Some of our opponents in the cycling lobby were putting
    out propaganda on websites.

    "We can at least say that all the information that we used
    was based on real evidence and genuine facts."

    So, BHIT said "Jason Queally supports the bill".

    Apparently not: BikeBiz says....

    Tuesday 20th April 2004 Jason Queally does not support
    BHIT's helmet-compulsion bill Chris Murray, Queally's
    agent, will be calling BHIT today to clarify with the Reading-
    based charity that the Olympic gold medal winning cyclist
    is pro-helmet but cannot be used to endorse Eric Martlew's
    private members' bill. This follows yesterday's news that
    Nationwide is downgrading its support of BHIT because of
    its political lobbying activities.

    Mainstream websites such as BBC.co.uk have been told that
    Jason Queally supports Martlew's bill.

    [See news.bbc.co.ukbbc parliament
    /3623089.stm]

    In fact, the rider has not been consulted by BHIT about
    the bill, said Chris Murray, Queally's agent.

    "Jason wouldn't ride his bike without his helmet and
    supports the Bicycle Helmet Initiative Trusts aims to
    popularise cycle helmet wearing, but Jason has not been
    briefed about the specifics of the bill. I shall be
    calling BHIT today to clarify this position"

  9. in message <[email hidden]>, John Hearns

    (') said:
    paul said:
    Quoted message said:


    Get back under your bridge, you nasty troll

    I think you forgot a :-) there. Ian (may I call you Darth
    Ian?) rides a recumbent trike. Look at his URL...

    Smileys are for Merkins who don't understand irony. I feel
    sure paul was also being ironic.

    --
    [email hidden] (Simon Brooke)
    jasmine.org.uk~simon

    'Victories are not solutions.' ;; John Hume,
    Northern Irish politician, on Radio Scotland 1/2/95
    ;; Nobel Peace Prize laureate 1998; few have
    deserved it so much

  10. Simon Brooke said:

    Smileys are for Merkins who don't understand irony.

    Less of the national stereotyping, if you don't mind. There
    are plenty of other people who don't get it either.
    Particularly on Usenet when it's not flagged.

    Anyway, there must be some understanding of irony in
    America. You can do a whole course on it at the University
    of Edinburgh. (Absence of ridiculous prejudices is probably
    a condition of entry.)

    See: tinyurl.comytcxr

    --
    Michael MacClancy Random putdown - "He has never been known
    to use a word that might send a reader to the dictionary." -
    William Faulkner (about Ernest Hemingway)
    www.macclancy.demon.co.uk www.macclancy.co.uk

  11. Reply to editor:

    Last Friday's defeat of the Protective Headgear for Young
    Cyclists bill was a triumph for common sense. As a result of
    the campaign many MPs did indeed become much better informed
    about the issues, several of them changing from pro-
    compulsion to anti-compulsion on the basis of the evidence
    presented to them by cycling organisations (not one of whom
    was in favour of the Bill).

    Among other absurdities it would have made it an offence to
    allow a child to ride a tricycle in the park without a
    helmet, while unicycling on a public road would have been
    exempt. And of course a child riding a bike without a helmet
    would not have been committing an offence at all; the
    offence would have been committed by whichever hapless adult
    the courts happened to decide was responsible for them at
    the time (which could include friends over 16, teachers,
    bike shop employees and employers). Mr Martlew finessed the
    flaws in his Bill by saying that the law would, in essence,
    not be enforced. So why have it at all?

    I would like to thank Angela Lee for the statistics
    presented by BHIT. Merely comparing them with real (and much
    smaller) figures from the Departments of Transport and
    Health was sufficient to persuade many people.

    It is a source of some regret that opponents of the Bill
    were falsely characterised as anti-helmet; this is an
    unfortunate conclusion to draw when their judgement is based
    on careful consideration of both sides of an argument which
    is far more complex than it seems at face value. Cycling
    organisations are committed to cyclist safety in the round,
    and know from long experience that this neither begins nor
    ends with the wearing of a cycle helmet.

    Although the Government confirms it knows of no case where
    cyclist safety has improved with increasing helmet use, one
    can show using Government figures that a universally obeyed
    child helmet law which did not cause children to ride in a
    less careful manner due to feeling safer, might reduce the
    number of children killed on our roads by a maximum of one
    per annum. Recent experience in Hull shows that Home Zones
    (traffic calmed, human friendly environments) have the
    potential to be significantly more effective, and this
    benefit is not restricted to the small proportion of victims
    who are cycling at the time.

    This is hardly a surprise. A dispassionate look at the data
    reveals that it is motor traffic, not cycling, which is
    uniquely dangerous to children, accounting for 10% of injury
    admissions but half of all fatalities. Few of those children
    were cycling at the time. Head injury ratios and severity
    ratios are comparable for child pedestrians and child
    cyclists, although around five times more child pedestrians
    are killed and seriously injured.

    Anybody who is genuinely concerned about child safety will
    surely applaud schemes which reduce danger at source, and
    urge Reading Council to consider similar measures. After
    all, it is far better to avoid crashes altogether than to
    try to mitigate the effects of a small number of them.
    Especially when the method proposed has failed wherever it's
    been tried.

    Guy Chapman chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.uk

  12. John Hearns said:

    Ian (may I call you Darth Ian?)

    No - Darth Ian runs Futurecycles ;-)

    --
    Guy
    ===
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after
    posting. chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.uk

    Victory is ours! Down with Eric the Half A Brain!

  13. "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    BeHIT say:

    getreading.co.ukstory.asp

    'Miss Lee said: "We won't be giving up. I suppose if the
    bill had gone through on Friday, it would have meant that we
    would be out of business today.'

    She's lying there, too. BsHIT regard MHLs for children as
    the first step only. But she isn't lying when she says she
    won't give up. We cannot afford to be complacent.

    'The charity has had considerable success in reducing the
    number of head injuries among young cyclists in areas – like
    Reading – where they have promoted their safety message.'

    Guy, do you know what basis they have for this claim?

    --
    Dave...

  14. Dave Kahn said:

    'The charity has had considerable success in reducing the
    number of head injuries among young cyclists in areas -
    like Reading - where they have promoted their safety
    message.'

    Quoted message said:

    Guy, do you know what basis they have for this claim?

    A lavishly funded pilot study from which they have yet to
    produce a report. This did not stop them being given more
    money for further pilot studies, from which they have
    similarly failed to produce any report.

    --
    Guy
    ===
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after
    posting. chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.uk

    Victory is ours! Down with Eric the Half A Brain!

  15. "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:
    Dave Kahn said:

    'The charity has had considerable success in reducing
    the number of head injuries among young cyclists in
    areas - like Reading - where they have promoted their
    safety message.'

    Quoted message said:

    Guy, do you know what basis they have for this claim?

    A lavishly funded pilot study from which they have yet to
    produce a report. This did not stop them being given more
    money for further pilot studies, from which they have
    similarly failed to produce any report.

    That's more or less what I'd supposed. They say they've had
    considerable success and the meeja echo it as a statement of
    fact. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to produce some
    imaginary statistics too when pressed.

    --
    Dave...

  16. On 28 Apr 2004 12:49:37 -0700, [email hidden] (Dave Kahn) wrote
    in message <[email hidden]>:

    Quoted message said:

    That's more or less what I'd supposed. They say they've had
    considerable success and the meeja echo it as a statement
    of fact. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to produce
    some imaginary statistics too when pressed.

    IIRC the paper "time for compulsion" by Lee & Mann cites
    the Reading work, but gives no figures. It also cites
    TR&T (obv.).

    --
    Guy
    ===
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after
    posting. chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at
    Washington University

  17. In article <d744m1-
    [email hidden]>,
    [email hidden] says...

    Quoted message said:

    in message <[email hidden]>,

    John Hearns (') said:
    paul said:

    >
    Get back under your bridge, you nasty troll

    I think you forgot a :-) there. Ian (may I call you
    Darth Ian?) rides a recumbent trike. Look at his URL...

    Smileys are for Merkins who don't understand irony. I feel
    sure paul was also being ironic.


    Indeed. I wouldn't waste words on a true troll. Real peeps
    wot make trollish comments though, need to have their errent
    ways pointed out. Especially blatent trollish like ians was.

    --
    .paul

    If at first you don't succeed... Skydiving is probably not
    the sport for you.

  18. Just zis Guy said:

    Among other absurdities it would have made it an offence
    to allow a child to ride a tricycle in the park without
    a helmet, while unicycling on a public road would have
    been exempt.

    To be fair, I would think one would be far more likely to
    hit one's head falling off a trike than off a yike.

    I still found it a trifle irritating when pushing Jenny to
    the letter box on her trike, holding onto the parent pole
    and the reins, to think that this would become illegal if
    Martlew's bill passed.

    --
    Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my
    reply address)
    <url:http://www.speedy5.freeserve.co.uk/danny/> "He who
    dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

  19. Danny Colyer <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    I still found it a trifle irritating when pushing Jenny to
    the letter box on her trike, holding onto the parent pole
    and the reins, to think that this would become illegal if
    Martlew's bill passed.

    But according to Fat Eric the police would have used common
    sense and not applied the law. It's a pity he didn't use
    some common sense himself and not tried to create a law that
    was not intended to be applied.

    --
    Dave...

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