TOOTHPASTE can kill?

"Todd Gastaldo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Are well-meaning DENTISTS poisoning the water supply as
well-meaning MDs close birth canals? See the postscript...

PREGNANT WOMEN For instructions on how to open your
birth canal an "extra" up to 30%, see the very end of
ths post...

TOOTHPASTE can kill?

"A family-sized tube of fluoridated toothpaste (7 oz.)
contains enough fluoride to kill a small child of up to 20
pounds if the entire tube is consumed."

So does a family size bottle or rum, if the ...........

Todd Gastaldo said:

Are well-meaning DENTISTS poisoning the water supply as
well-meaning MDs close birth canals? See the postscript...

PREGNANT WOMEN For instructions on how to open your
birth canal an "extra" up to 30%, see the very end of
ths post...

TOOTHPASTE can kill?

I like mine with fava beans and a fine
chianti....FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Steve
--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

In message <[email hidden]>, Todd

Gastaldo said:

TOOTHPASTE can kill?

"A family-sized tube of fluoridated toothpaste (7 oz.)
contains enough fluoride to kill a small child of up to 20
pounds if the entire tube is consumed." --Dr. John
Yiamouyiannis, Fluoride the Aging Factor, Second Edition,
Health Action Press, 1986, p. 16.
aquasafe.us20lbinfant.htmOpen ↗

QUICK fluoridation education slide show at:
www.AquaSafe.us

You can do the same with a bottle of mouthwash. The alcohol
content is quite high and drinking a bottle of mouthwash is
definitely not recommended. It can also upset breath
alcohol meters so be careful if driving shortly after
cleaning your teeth...

Dave
--
mail: da [email hidden] (without the space)
llondel.orgllondel.orgOpen ↗ So many gadgets, so little time...

THIS IS HOT!

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

IS FLUORIDATED WATER "HANNIBAL THE CANNIBAL" WATER?

Hannibal Lecter, MD said (in Silence of the Lambs):

"I ate his liver with some fava beans and a nice chianti."
proz.comproz.comOpen ↗

Steven Bornfeld, DDS said on the usenet:

"I like [my fluoride toothpaste] with fava beans and a fine
chianti....FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF".com/groups?selm=40846080.76772686%40dentaltwins.com&oe=UTF-
8&output=gplain

"Hannibal the Cannibal" Steve the Dentist was humorously
responding to my post, "TOOTHPASTE can kill?" health.groups.yahoo.comchiroOpen ↗
list/message/2480

OPEN LETTER

Steven Bornfeld, DDS [email hidden]

Steve,

Your humorous "Hannibal the Cannibal" "response" trivializes
fluoride toxicity.

Is fluoride toxicity really that trivial?

Hydrofluorosilicic acid is what is generally used in water,
yet you don't even mention it in your FAQ.
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on "Dental FAQ"😉

You infer in your FAQ that 1ppm fluoride in drinking
water is safe.

How do you know that 1ppm fluoride is safe?

How do you know that 1ppm fluoride from *hydrofluorosilicic
acid* is safe?

Look at the difference in solubility between Calcium
Fluoride (17ppm) and hydrofluorsilicic acid (miscible in
water)! fluoride.org.ukf03.htmOpen ↗

(I'm assuming "miscible in water" means HIGHLY soluble -
THOUSANDS of ppm - correct me if I'm wrong - my chemistry
knowledge is quite old.)

What is meant by "exotic" complexes from hydrofluorosilicic
acid, as in, "By definition, hydrofluorosilicic acid has 6
atoms of fluorine (H2SiF6). Of these six atoms, it is
sometimes assumed that all six will become simple fluoride
ions. However, there is no known published to demonstrate
thsi actually happens. In fact, the best available knowledge
suggests that only four of these atoms will become fluoride
ions and the remaining two will form more 'exotic' complexes
(depending on the quality of water the compound is mixed
with)." fluoride.org.ukf03.htmOpen ↗

Prof. Roger D. Masters of Dartmouth reportedly wrote in 2001
that EPA has NO data on the "health and behavioral effects
of fluorosilicic acid"...: "Although some early studies
showed differences between sodium fluoride and sodium
silicofluoride, to this day the substitution of
silicofluorides in public water treatment facilities has
never been subjected to appropriate animal or human testing.
Recently, the Assistant Administrator of the EPA admitted to
Congress that his agency had no data on SiF toxicity and the
Chief of the Treatment Technology Evaluation Branch at the
National Risk Management Research Laboratory confirmed that
the EPA has "no" data on the 'health and behavioral effects
of fluosilicic acid'...Despite claims of safety by oral
health officials, laboratory research in Germany revealed
that silicofluorides do not dissociate completely and have
important biological effects. To follow up on this issue, we
have compared children's blood lead levels in communities
using SiF treated water with communities using sodium
fluoride or with non-fluoridated water. In three separate
samples, totalling over 400,000 children, SiF treated
municipal water is ALWAYS significantly associated with
increased blood lead levels in children..." fluorideaction.orgsfOpen ↗
masters.htm

Your humorous "response" alluded to the fact that Hannibal
the Cannibal said he dined on a fellow's liver with fava
beans and a nice chianti...

Who knows but that hydrofluorosilicic acid causes
liver damage.

At least one doctor thinks it does:

"In the liver, fluoride caused fatty deposition and the
death of cells." drkaslow.comfluoride.htmlOpen ↗

Are we forcing children to drink "Hannibal the
Cannibal" water?

Steve, why not at least mention in your FAQ that what is
being put in our water supplies - hydrofluorosilicic acid -
may not be equivalent to what is in toothpaste?

Why not link to:

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation

John Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D.

Published in: Perspectives in Biology and Medicine Volume
41, page 29-44. 1997 slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗
(via www.aquasafe.us)

Just a thought.

Thanks for reading.

Sincerely,

Todd

Dr. Gastaldo [email hidden]

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS" <[email hidden]>
wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Todd Gastaldo said:

Are well-meaning DENTISTS poisoning the water supply as
well-meaning MDs close birth canals? See the
postscript...

PREGNANT WOMEN For instructions on how to open your
birth canal an

"extra"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

up to 30%, see the very end of ths post...

TOOTHPASTE can kill?

I like mine with fava beans and a fine
chianti....FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Steve
--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS Brooklyn, NY 718-258-5001
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

Steve the Dentist's fluoride FAQ:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

At about 0.15%, or 1500 ppm, most fluoride toothpastes
have a fluoride

concentration approximately 1500 times that of fluoridated
water (this presupposes an optimal concentration of 1 ppm,
which is the target level of fluoride in municipal water
systems in temperate climates). This can make the issue of
whether a person normally drinks fluoridated water
statistically insignificant if he eats toothpaste! The
smaller size of a child's body produces a proportionately
greater physiologic effect from a drug dose when compared
with that in the adult. Consequently, as would be the case
for any therapeutic substance or medication administered to
a young child, close supervision is in order when he brushes
with a fluoride toothpaste. The quantity of toothpaste used
should be limited to a very small amount. Dental fluorosis,
or aberrant enamel formation resulting from excessive
fluoride intake, manifests as yellow or brown intrinsic
staining of the teeth. It will only result if exposure to
excessive fluoride occurs before the age of five or six;
after that, any significant staining will only occur on the
back teeth, if at all...Keep in mind that public water
systems, if fluoridated, will have the fluoride
concentrations adjusted to an appropriate level; if you are
using "ground water" for drinking as you say, it would be
appropriate to test for bacterial and chemical impurities in
general, as well as fluoride levels in particular.<< --Mark
& Steven Bornfeld DDS dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on
"Dental FAQ"😉

In 1971, former Aston University chemist Malcolm Harris
investigated some fluoride compounds and determined the
following table of solubility (solubility: "... a critical
aspect of toxicity"😉;-

Calcium fluoride natural Solubility = 16 ppm at
18ºc and 17 ppm at 26ºC Sodium Fluoride artificial
42,200 ppm at 18ºC Sodium fluosilicate artificial
6,520 ppm at 17ºC Hydrofluorosilic acid artificial
miscible liquid

It can be clearly seen that sodium-fluoride compounds are
far more soluble than calcium fluoride. Hydrofluorosilic
acid (used to fluoridate water supplies in the UK and
[extensively] in the USA) is a "miscible" liquid. A miscible
liquid means something which can be mixed (in this instance,
with water).

By definition, hydrofluorosilic acid has 6 atoms of fluorine
(H2SiF6). Of these six atoms, it is sometimes assumed that
all six will become simple fluoride ions. However, there is
no known published to demonstrate thsi actually happens. In
fact, the best available knowledge suggests that only four
of these atoms will become fluoride ions and the remaining
two will form more 'exotic' complexes (depending on the
quality of water the compound is mixed with).
fluoride.org.ukf03.htmOpen ↗

Incidentally, according to www.drkaslow.com, cited above:
"Using a fluoride toothpaste makes sense, but drinking water
and children's multi-vitamins with added fluoride (Poly-Vi-
Flor, Tri-Vi-Flor, etc) doesn't."

EXCELLENT ARTICLE:

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

Also interesting (can this be true?)...

FLUORIDATION Mind Control of the Masses by Ian E. Stephen
[Extracted from his self-published booklet "The Dickinson
Statement: A Mind-Boggling Thesis" published in NEXUS
magazine August-September 1995 issue.]
whale.tostephen.htmlOpen ↗

Mind control - or population control?

Naw - it's just a way for corporations to make a buck
getting rid of waste products of aluminum and phosphate
fertilizer production...

Or is it?

With MDs getting away with closing birth canals up to 30%,
why shouldn't dentists get away with literally poisoning our
water supplies?

See again:

"TOOTHPASTE can kill?" health.groups.yahoo.comchiroOpen ↗
list/message/2480

Thanks for reading, everyone.

Sincerely,

Todd

Ds. Gastaldo [email hidden]

Todd Gastaldo said:

THIS IS HOT!

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

IS FLUORIDATED WATER "HANNIBAL THE CANNIBAL" WATER?

Hannibal Lecter, MD said (in Silence of the Lambs):

"I ate his liver with some fava beans and a nice chianti."
proz.comproz.comOpen ↗

Steven Bornfeld, DDS said on the usenet:

"I like [my fluoride toothpaste] with fava beans and a
fine chianti....FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF"om/groups?selm=40846080.76772686%40dentaltwins.com&oe=UTF-
8&output=gplain

"Hannibal the Cannibal" Steve the Dentist was humorously
responding to my post, "TOOTHPASTE can kill?" health.groups.yahoo.comchiroOpen ↗
list/message/2480

OPEN LETTER

Steven Bornfeld, DDS [email hidden]

Steve,

Your humorous "Hannibal the Cannibal" "response"
trivializes fluoride toxicity.

Is fluoride toxicity really that trivial?

No it's not. I've seen Dr. Strangelove.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

I said:

IS FLUORIDATED WATER "HANNIBAL THE CANNIBAL" WATER?

health.groups.yahoo.com2482Open ↗

I said to Steve Bornfeld, DDS:

Quoted message said:

Your humorous "Hannibal the Cannibal" "response"
trivializes fluoride toxicity.

Is fluoride toxicity really that trivial?

Steve Bornfeld, DDS replied:

"No it's not. I've seen Dr. Strangelove."

Steve,

What about FLUORIDATION toxicity?

You state in your "Dental FAQ":

"[P]ublic water systems, if fluoridated, will have the
fluoride concentrations adjusted to an appropriate level..."
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on "Dental FAQ" then on
"Toxic Conspiracies FAQ"😉

You seem to be saying that the usual "appropriate level" of
fluoridation is safe...

Is FLUORIDATION toxicity trivial?

Sorry to repeat myself but...

Hydrofluorosilicic acid is what is generally used in water,
yet you don't even mention hydrofluorosilicic acid in your
FAQ. dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on "Dental FAQ"😉

You infer in your FAQ that 1ppm fluoride in drinking
water is safe.

How do you know that 1ppm fluoride is safe?

How do you know that 1ppm fluoride from *hydrofluorosilicic
acid* is safe?

Prof. Roger D. Masters of Dartmouth reportedly wrote in 2001
that EPA has NO data on the "health and behavioral effects
of fluorosilicic acid"...: "Although some early studies
showed differences between sodium fluoride and sodium
silicofluoride, to this day the substitution of
silicofluorides in public water treatment facilities has
never been subjected to appropriate animal or human testing.
Recently, the Assistant Administrator of the EPA admitted to
Congress that his agency had no data on SiF toxicity and the
Chief of the Treatment Technology Evaluation Branch at the
National Risk Management Research Laboratory confirmed that
the EPA has "no" data on the 'health and behavioral effects
of fluosilicic acid'...Despite claims of safety by oral
health officials, laboratory research in Germany revealed
that silicofluorides do not dissociate completely and have
important biological effects. To follow up on this issue, we
have compared children's blood lead levels in communities
using SiF treated water with communities using sodium
fluoride or with non-fluoridated water. In three separate
samples, totalling over 400,000 children, SiF treated
municipal water is ALWAYS significantly associated with
increased blood lead levels in children..." fluorideaction.orgsfOpen ↗
masters.htm

Your humorous "response" alluded to the fact that Hannibal
the Cannibal said he dined on a fellow's liver with fava
beans and a nice chianti...

Who knows - maybe hydrofluorosilicic acid causes liver
damage.

At least one doctor thinks it does:

"In the liver, fluoride caused fatty deposition and the
death of cells." drkaslow.comfluoride.htmlOpen ↗

Are we forcing children to drink "Hannibal the
Cannibal" water?

Steve, why not at least mention in your FAQ that what is
being put in our water supplies - hydrofluorosilicic acid -
may not be equivalent to what is in toothpaste?

Why not link to:

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation by John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

DENTAL AMALGAM PATERNALISM...

Steve,

I see that in regard to MERCURY AMALGAM toxicity...

You use the old "Where did YOU go to dental school" gag:

"Beliefs, such as being 'anti-amalgam', are in the realm of
theology (to be charitable), and make truly dispassionate
and impartial observation impossible...[T]he dental
profession at large...like it or not, is in a better
position to acquire and interpret the available
epidemiologic data than Rodale Press, or anyone else who has
a deep emotional stake in promulgating conspiracy
theories...Don't be so quick to dismiss your dentist as
uninformed. He has spent many years training to be a
dentist, and has spent many years acquiring knowledge during
his practice. It is also mandated by law that he must
continue formally educating himself with courses and
seminars in order to maintain his license. If new knowledge
relating to mercury toxicity is forthcoming, he will be the
first to know; his patients will be the next..."
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on "Dental FAQ" then on
"Toxic Conspiracies FAQ"😉

I say again, Steve...

In regard to FLUORIDATION...

You state in your "Dental FAQ":

"[P]ublic water systems, if fluoridated, will have the
fluoride concentrations adjusted to an appropriate level..."
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on "Dental FAQ" then on
"Toxic Conspiracies FAQ"😉

You infer in your FAQ that 1ppm fluoride in drinking
water is safe.

How do you know that 1ppm fluoride is safe?

How do you know that 1ppm fluoride from *hydrofluorosilicic
acid* is safe?

I think you should change your "Dental FAQ/Toxic
Conspiracies FAQ" to reflect the **FAQT** that we simply
don't know that 1ppm fluoride is safe - or "appropriate."

Why are we putting fluoride, a known poison, in our
water supply?

Why not stick to promoting TOPICAL application of fluoride?

Why not give people a CHOICE as to whether they want
fluoride in their bodies?

Again quoting www.drkaslow.com, cited in "'Hannibal the
Cannibal' water?":

Fluoride toothpaste makes sense, but drinking water and
children's multi-vitamins with added fluoride (Poly-Vi-Flor,
Tri-Vi-Flor, etc) doesn't." health.groups.yahoo.comchiroOpen ↗
list/message/2482

And quoting Susan Stockton from my original
fluoridation post:

"[D]ental literature concedes that any decay-reducing
effects are the result of topical application of fluoride,
not ingestion of it through water. Well-meaning dentists and
newspaper writers aren't getting the true facts about
fluoride and fluoridation. Read them at www.aquasafe.us --
Susan Stockton, Clearwater sptimes.com1Open ↗
6/Pasco/Our_overexposure_to_f.shtml

Again...

Hydrofluorosilicic acid is what is generally used in water,
yet you don't even mention hydrofluorosilicic acid in your
FAQ. dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗ (Click on "Dental FAQ"😉

Why not link to:

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation by John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

Please change your fluoridation FAQ Steve.

Thanks for reading.

Sincerely,

Todd

Dr. Gastaldo [email hidden]

Todd Gastaldo wrote:

(snip)

Quoted message said:

Please change your fluoridation FAQ Steve.

Thanks for reading.

Sincerely,

Todd

Dr. Gastaldo [email hidden]

Dear Todd:

No.

Respectfully, Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Todd Gastaldo wrote:

(snip)

Quoted message said:

Please change your fluoridation FAQ Steve.

Thanks for reading.

Sincerely,

Todd

Dr. Gastaldo [email hidden]

Dear Todd:

No.

Respectfully, Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS Brooklyn, NY 718-258-5001
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation by John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

"Todd Gastaldo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

TOOTHPASTE can kill?

"A family-sized tube of fluoridated toothpaste (7 oz.)
contains enough fluoride to kill a small child of up to 20
pounds if the entire tube is consumed." --Dr. John
Yiamouyiannis, Fluoride the Aging Factor, Second Edition,
Health Action Press, 1986, p. 16.
aquasafe.us20lbinfant.htmOpen ↗

Ah, a 20-pound kid eating a whole tube of toothpaste has
got to be really, really rare. It's also true, that if a
kid drinks ammonia, or bleach, or turpentine, it'll kill
them, too.

My daughter (27 pounds) got ahold of the toothpaste, and
ate some of
it (adollop of the amount that they show on a toothbrush
in commercials for toothpaste - in reality too much
for most people) . I called poison control, and they
told me that unless she ate a really huge amount
(which she hadn't) that the main concern is that she
could get a stomach ache. They advised us to give her
some milk (evidently the calcium helps prevent the
stomach ache).

Needless to say, it's now out of her reach. Just like the
booze, the bleach, and the ammonia, all of which are FAR
more likely to kill her than toothpaste is.

Advising people to get rid of toothpaste because eating a
whole tube might kill a kid, is a bit like throwing the baby
out with the bathwater.

Cathy Weeks Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

Cathy Weeks said:

Ah, a 20-pound kid eating a whole tube of toothpaste has
got to be really, really rare. It's also true, that if a
kid drinks ammonia, or bleach, or turpentine, it'll kill
them, too.

My daughter (27 pounds) got ahold of the toothpaste, and
ate some of
it (adollop of the amount that they show on a toothbrush
in commercials for toothpaste - in reality too much
for most people) . I called poison control, and they
told me that unless she ate a really huge amount
(which she hadn't) that the main concern is that she
could get a stomach ache. They advised us to give
her some milk (evidently the calcium helps prevent
the stomach ache).

Needless to say, it's now out of her reach. Just like the
booze, the bleach, and the ammonia, all of which are FAR
more likely to kill her than toothpaste is.

Advising people to get rid of toothpaste because eating a
whole tube might kill a kid, is a bit like throwing the
baby out with the bathwater.

Cathy Weeks Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

I once read a book written in the 1930s called
"100,000,000 Guinea Pigs" (I forget the author). It was
apparently a fairly well-known piece of muckraking
reportage at the time. I remember the account of a
German army officer during the first world war who
supposedly committed suicide by eating a tube of
toothpaste. Of course, the poison at the time was not
fluoride. It was potassium chlorate, IIRC. Well, they
don't put some form of chlorine bleach in toothpaste
anymore. However, the commercials do show them covering
the entire brush with paste, which can be a problem,
esp. for young children who cannot rinse out too
efficiently. You should use only a small (pea-size or
smaller) bit of toothpaste. Fluoridation levels in
treated municipal water supplies should be about 1 ppm.
of fluoride. Toothpaste is about 1 part per thousand, so
it isn't hard to overdo the fluoride. Too much fluoride
can cause mottling and discoloration of the enamel of
the teeth forming at the time of ingestion, so for all
the hubbub about fluoride being a communist plot, it
should be used sparingly.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

"Cathy Weeks" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Todd Gastaldo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

TOOTHPASTE can kill?

"A family-sized tube of fluoridated toothpaste (7 oz.)
contains enough fluoride to kill a small child of up to
20 pounds if the entire tube is consumed." --Dr. John
Yiamouyiannis, Fluoride the Aging Factor, Second
Edition,

Health

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Action Press, 1986, p. 16.
aquasafe.us20lbinfant.htmOpen ↗

Ah, a 20-pound kid eating a whole tube of toothpaste has
got to be really, really rare. It's also true, that if a
kid drinks ammonia, or bleach, or turpentine, it'll kill
them, too.

My daughter (27 pounds) got ahold of the toothpaste, and
ate some of
it (adollop of the amount that they show on a toothbrush
in commercials for toothpaste - in reality too much
for most people) . I called poison control, and they
told me that unless she ate a really huge amount
(which she hadn't) that the main concern is that she
could get a stomach ache. They advised us to give
her some milk (evidently the calcium helps prevent
the stomach ache).

Needless to say, it's now out of her reach. Just like the
booze, the bleach, and the ammonia, all of which are FAR
more likely to kill her than toothpaste is.

Advising people to get rid of toothpaste because eating a
whole tube might kill a kid, is a bit like throwing the
baby out with the bathwater.

Cathy Weeks Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

Cathy, Good points. I did not advise anyone to get rid of
toothpaste. The toothpaste fluoride warning is an excellent
segueway to discussion of water fluoridation. See the QUICK
fluoridation education slide show at: www.AquaSafe.us Todd

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS said:

I once read a book written in the 1930s called
"100,000,000 Guinea

Pigs" (I forget the author). It was apparently a

Quoted message said:

fairly well-known piece of muckraking reportage at the
time. I remember

the account of a German army officer during the

Quoted message said:

first world war who supposedly committed suicide by eating
a tube of

toothpaste.

Steve,

Maybe this is the relevant 100,000,000 Guinea Pigs
excerpt...

"'The Pebeco Toothpaste with which you brush your teeth
twice every day-do you know that a tube of it contains
enough poison if eaten, to kill three people; that, in fact,
a German army officer committed suicide by eating a tubeful
of this particular toothpaste?" --Frederick Schlink and
Arthur Kallet. 100,000,000 Guinea Pigs: Dangers in Everyday
Foods, Drugs, and Cosmetics [1933]
historymatters.gmu.edu5090Open ↗

Quoted message said:

Of course, the poison at the time was not fluoride. It
was potassium

chlorate, IIRC.

Quoted message said:

I saw no name given for the poison, but it could have been
fluoride...if the tube was big enough... : )

Anyway, there was a relevant sodium fluoride patent around
that time... US:1,464,990 "Manufacture of sodium fluoride"
Henry Howard - Grasselli Chemical Co.(-> IG Farben)
(1922/1923) 64.177.90.157patents i.htmlOpen ↗

US: 1,943,856 Roy Cross -Silica Company, Kansas (1929/1934)
Sodium fluoride in toothpaste, as hardener, and to "prevent
decay". 64.177.90.157patents i.htmlOpen ↗

DENTISTS WERE OPPOSED TO SODIUM FLUORIDE

"...the foregoing formula contains about 0.8 per cent sodium
fluoride before water is added to form a paste. The proposal
to apply such a concentration of sodium fluoride to the
mouth one or more times daily is not to be considered
lightly, in view of the known toxic actions of fluorine.
Hence, this investigation of the possibility of chronic
fluorine poisoning was undertaken. That fluorine can cause
chronic poisoning has been amply demonstrated...COMMENT In
spite of the failure to produce bleaching of rat incisors
with reasonable amounts of the poisoned tooth powder in the
diet, the inclusion of sodium fluoride in the formula is
irrational and should be discouraged. The claims that sodium
fluoride in the preparation bleaches the teeth is based on
false premises. Bleaching of human teeth by fluoride occurs
only in children prior to eruption of the permanent teeth.
The mechanism depends on an internal physiologic action. No
effect is produced on the enamel of permanent teeth
subsequent to eruption [??? - TDG]...fluorine is not an
essential element in tooth structure, and even if it were
essential, it could not be supplied by rubbing on the tooth
surface. [??? - TDG] A rational scientific basis for the use
of sodium fluoride in tooth paste does not exist. Despite
the fact that the results as to toxicity of this commercial
product were essentially negative, it does not follow that
the product is necessarily innocuous or at least free from
toxic potentialities under all possible dental conditions.
For example, local absorption of the fluoride might be
promoted by massage of the gums with the aid of a
toothbrush, and by the presence of pathologic conditions,
such as ulcers, inflammatory states, pus pockets and the
like. In other words, uncontrolled usage of the product by
the laity might still result in undesirable systemic
reactions, especially in children. CONCLUSIONS

1. The fact that a patented fluoride dentifrice was not
demonstrably toxic when tested for typical fluoride
toxicity in feeding experiments on rats does not mean
that this dentiifrice is not potentially toxic under all
dental conditions.

2. Conditions of dental usage and pathologic states in the
mouth might promote absorption of fluoride and toxicity.

3. The use of fluoride in dentifrices is unscientific and
irrational, and therefore should not he permitted.
COUNCIL ON DENTAL THERAPEUTICS (1937) "TOXIC
POTENTIALITIES OF A FLUORIDE DENTIFRICE " JADA 24:3-7-309
(1937) 64.177.90.157toxic paste.htmlOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Well, they don't put some form of chlorine bleach in
toothpaste

anymore.

Quoted message said:

Chlorine dioxide in CloSYSII Toothpaste might count as "some
form of chlorine bleach"...

"...the complex chemistry of bleaching with chlorine
dioxide..."
aet.orgrchlorine.htmlOpen ↗

"How CloSYSII Toothpaste Works...the active chlorine dioxide
in CloSYSII toothpaste destroys these compounds on
contact....This same ingredient has been used to safely
sanitize city water supplies for years....CloSYSII
Toothpaste Call 1-888-891-1326..." saveyoursmile-saveyoursmile-Open ↗
.com/products/fb/closystoothpaste.html

"Many dentists and hygienists use CloSYSII Toothpaste as a
professional polishing agent..."
rowpar.comindex.htmlOpen ↗

"...Chlorine Dioxide: The 'Ideal' BiocideUnlike chlorine,
chlorine dioxide remains a true gas dissolved in solution.
The lack of any significant reaction of chlorine dioxide
with water is partly responsible for its retaining its
biocidal effectiveness over a wide pH range."
clo2.comcorrosion.htmlOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

However, the commercials do show them covering the entire
brush with paste, which can be a problem, esp. for

young children who cannot rinse out too

Quoted message said:

efficiently. You should use only a small (pea-size or
smaller) bit of

toothpaste.

Quoted message said:

"As reported in the Washington Post, June 16, 1997; page C5,
The Food and Drug Administration requires this new warning
label on all fluoride toothpaste and dental care products
shipped after April 7, 1997: 'If you accidentally swallow
more than used for brushing, seek professional help or
contact a poison control center immediately'..."
sonic.netnews97.htmOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Fluoridation levels in treated municipal water supplies
should be about 1 ppm. of fluoride.

"EPA scientists, engineers and attorneys...have gone on
record against the practice of adding fluoride to public
drinking water...On Wednesday, July 2, 1997...professionals
at EPA headquarters in Washington, D.C., voted unanimously
to co-sponsor the California Safe Drinking Water Initiative
that would reverse the State Legislature's 1995 law
mandating fluoridation...
sonic.netnews97.htmOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Toothpaste is about 1 part per thousand, so it isn't hard
to overdo the fluoride. Too much fluoride can cause
mottling and

discoloration of the enamel of the teeth forming at the time

Quoted message said:

of ingestion, so for all the hubbub about fluoride being a
communist plot,

it should be used sparingly.

Quoted message said:

Why I Changed My Mind About Water Fluoridation John
Colquhoun, D.D.S., Ph.D. Published in: Perspectives in
Biology and Medicine Volume 41, page 29-44. 1997
slweb.orgcolquhoun.htmlOpen ↗ (via www.aquasafe.us)

Thanks for reading.

Sincerely,

Todd

Dr. Gastaldo [email hidden]

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Well, they don't put some form of chlorine bleach in
toothpaste anymore. However, the commercials do show
them covering the entire brush with paste, which can
be a problem, esp. for young children who cannot rinse
out too efficiently. You should use only a small (pea-
size or smaller) bit of toothpaste.

<laugh> I use a pea-sized amount of toothpaste for *me*.
My daughter uses a flouride-free toddler toothpaste. I
should probably switch her to regular toothpaste, since
I'm not giving her the flouride supplements anymore (we're
on well-water).

Quoted message said:

Too much fluoride can cause mottling and discoloration of
the enamel

of the teeth forming at the time

Quoted message said:

of ingestion, so for all the hubbub about fluoride being a
communist plot, it should be used sparingly.

Sure, I can live with that. But you know, I've never
actually seen a case of flourosis. I tend to notice teeth
(my parents are dentists, so I've grown up in a teeth-
centered culture, and I notice teeth almost first thing when
I meet someone). It can't be all that common?

Cathy Weeks