Help with a slow buddy.

I same problem with a few buddies, they say they wanna get faster and when i pick up the pace they drop off after a few minutes saying it hurts so they sit back. i don't say anything but i feel like saying if you want to get better you have to suffer a little or you will never get faster. i hope to find a training partner who is equaly matched and motovated.

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by zaskar
I same problem with a few buddies, they say they wanna get faster and when i pick up the pace they drop off after a few minutes saying it hurts so they sit back. i don't say anything but i feel like saying if you want to get better you have to suffer a little or you will never get faster. i hope to find a training partner who is equaly matched and motovated.

Its very much the same. I have a little mantra, "you must suffer to improve." but they dont seem to get it. I know they have in the past, like I said, hes a good runner. Faster than me by far. He just backs off when the bike hurts. I dont know what to do.

Ride with more people. I have friends like that (who are so much faster than me that it bums me out, they blow my aerobic threshhold and my overall ride average is lower than when i ride alone), and so I started organizing a group ride of "fast people" and "slow people"

(a) you can ride at your own pace for more of the ride
(b) change your midpoint desinations to keep the group together at beginning, midpoint and end.
(c) if you make sure the ride starts uphill, the pokey ones can keep up more or less toward the end of the ride, that invariable leads to....

group beer fest...

ahh..... and, competition against someone who is closer to your speed can help your speed increase, while biking with someone who is SOO much faster might be depressing, depending on his personality.

good luck! and btw--i'm pokey, but still faster than i used to be when i used to bike only with my really fast friends.

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by brightgarden
Ride with more people. I have friends like that (who are so much faster than me that it bums me out, they blow my aerobic threshhold and my overall ride average is lower than when i ride alone), and so I started organizing a group ride of "fast people" and "slow people"

(a) you can ride at your own pace for more of the ride
(b) change your midpoint desinations to keep the group together at beginning, midpoint and end.
(c) if you make sure the ride starts uphill, the pokey ones can keep up more or less toward the end of the ride, that invariable leads to....

group beer fest...

ahh..... and, competition against someone who is closer to your speed can help your speed increase, while biking with someone who is SOO much faster might be depressing, depending on his personality.

good luck! and btw--i'm pokey, but still faster than i used to be when i used to bike only with my really fast friends.

I'm the total opposite on this one. The faster the group I'm with the more motivated I get. If I get dropped in the first 5 miles, I try to make it 10 the next time. Don't think anyone faster than me would ever "bum me out" it's just pure motivation for me.

Guess it would depend on what kind of person you are trying to motivate. Just have to see what makes em tick and cater to that.

C-

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by angrydave
Its very much the same. I have a little mantra, "you must suffer to improve." but they dont seem to get it. I know they have in the past, like I said, hes a good runner. Faster than me by far. He just backs off when the bike hurts. I dont know what to do.

Maybe its a technical setup problem with the bike; size, seat, bars, pedals, etc.

i had a friend who was just like what you guys are saying too.
it got really annoying because i would always have to wait up for him, and i could tell he wasn't pushing himself.

i guess it takes awhile for someone to get use to cycling and having to push themself. i have been riding/racing for about 5 years and suffering on the bike is just part of training.

on another note, i have finally found out what training works well for me, and i can not believe how much i have improved in just the past month or two. i just got my best race result ever, 2 days ago.

I train at 15mph..... I know alot of guys that train up to 20mph that drop me at will, funny thing is I can usually pound em on race day....go figure (actually I know why this is). Mabey your friend is just not a fast trainer, in my hayday I sometimes trained at 18mph, but not often.....

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by angrydave
Okay, I need advice here.

I have a buddy who says he wants to improve his performance at cycling. He runs very well, so I know his cardio base is solid, he rides the Mountain Bike with me, and while I can drop him at will, he stays with me fine if I ride a reasonable pace, but on the road bike, he dies.

We set off I usually warm up with up to 5 miles of 12 - 14 Mph. He hangs ok, but he sees this as his upper limit. When I take off, (Iusually ride around 18 - 20 when I'm training, at about 85 rpm.) he just drops off like a lead weight.

He can hang with me if I let him draft, but not for tooo long. I have yet to strap the heart monitor on him, so hard data is missing here, but he never seems out of breath, which leads me to believe his issue are mostly mental. BUT...


Motivation tips anyone?

We rode a century yesterday, he finished, averaged 14 mph over the course, with about an hour total between 6 rest stops. He says hes ok today with just a littl soreness, mostly in his rear.
All of this tells me hes fit enough to hang.

Suggestions?
TIA.

The training question is very interesting – I am with Brightgarden on this one.
Obviously, your buddy is fit (a runner).
However it does take time to adapt to a bike no matter how fit someone is.
Therefore you need to adopt that attitude that you are cycling with some who is only learning to ride and learning about their physical capabilities ON A BIKE.
It might help if you chat to your buddy and tell him this.

Also, like Fixey suggests, there is no real need to train at a set speed.
Try training at 15 mph for 3 hours – rather than 18 mph for 2 hours.
This would benefit your friend and it would also benefit you too.
Slower, longer distances is much more beneficial in building stamina than shorter, faster distances.
And as Tack suggests, perhaps the bike setup for your friend needs to be looked at.

In summary, it is frustrating to have to cycle with someone who is not at your level.
But we were all novice cyclists at some point – and no doubt we frustrated other cyclists with our clumsy cycling.
However because we received the right encouragement at that time, it’s important for us
to show the same patience with our less competent companions now.

I can relate to your slow buddy. Recently I rode for 2.5 hrs with a Cat 1 and others who were between him and my brand new Cat 5 status. When I got dropped on flats/rollers, I more or less TT'd to catch back up as soon as their pace slackened at all. I refused to let myself get dropped on climbs, so I stuck to the front and just suffered.

All in all, it was very painful and today my eyelids are sagging and my whole body worked over! It took some serious stubborness to not just cave in or ask for a slower pace. I can easily see how only the sickest among us would just suck it up like that. I need therapy.

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by angrydave
Okay, I need advice here.

I have a buddy who says he wants to improve his performance at cycling. He runs very well, so I know his cardio base is solid, he rides the Mountain Bike with me, and while I can drop him at will, he stays with me fine if I ride a reasonable pace, but on the road bike, he dies.

We set off I usually warm up with up to 5 miles of 12 - 14 Mph. He hangs ok, but he sees this as his upper limit. When I take off, (Iusually ride around 18 - 20 when I'm training, at about 85 rpm.) he just drops off like a lead weight.

He can hang with me if I let him draft, but not for tooo long. I have yet to strap the heart monitor on him, so hard data is missing here, but he never seems out of breath, which leads me to believe his issue are mostly mental. BUT...


Motivation tips anyone?

We rode a century yesterday, he finished, averaged 14 mph over the course, with about an hour total between 6 rest stops. He says hes ok today with just a littl soreness, mostly in his rear.
All of this tells me hes fit enough to hang.

Suggestions?
TIA.

Seems like your buddy would be good to take on rides when you plan on doing 14-15mph average........., over 2-3 hours . Dont take him on interval rides......., until he is truely up for it........ and that might not be for a while.

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by limerickman
The training question is very interesting – I am with Brightgarden on this one.
Obviously, your buddy is fit (a runner).
However it does take time to adapt to a bike no matter how fit someone is.
Therefore you need to adopt that attitude that you are cycling with some who is only learning to ride and learning about their physical capabilities ON A BIKE.
It might help if you chat to your buddy and tell him this.

Also, like Fixey suggests, there is no real need to train at a set speed.
Try training at 15 mph for 3 hours – rather than 18 mph for 2 hours.
This would benefit your friend and it would also benefit you too.
Slower, longer distances is much more beneficial in building stamina than shorter, faster distances.
And as Tack suggests, perhaps the bike setup for your friend needs to be looked at.

In summary, it is frustrating to have to cycle with someone who is not at your level.
But we were all novice cyclists at some point – and no doubt we frustrated other cyclists with our clumsy cycling.
However because we received the right encouragement at that time, it’s important for us
to show the same patience with our less competent companions now.

Couldn't agree more - as a newbie to cycling as an adult, and never having ridden a 'road' bike with drops etc before, it's taken a long time for me to feel confident and happy enough to push myself out riding. Initially I *had* to push beyond what I could do just to keep up, even though that was at very slow paces, with people I was riding with taking my lack of fitness etc into account... it was very frustrating and NOT enjoyable for me.

However, after putting in the miles off and on, putting my foot down and refusing to be pushed into cycling faster than I feel happy with at the time, I'm actively enjoying it now, and have been known to yell 'faster, faster' to my other (much fitter) half cycling ahead of me as we approach and attack a hill....

Yes... mentally before I was grinding my way up hills (my idea of hills are little things, but I don't care), suffering physically... wasn't enjoyable...

Now, although hills really take it out of me still, I know how to pace myself up them to make it up slowly but surely, and how to read a hill and work out the ones I can power my way up (yelling faster faster - I climb faster up them than t'other half thinks I should!) - and being able to do that is a BIG reward for trying it.. MUCH more enjoyable.

I think the OP needs to work out if his buddy's cycling for himself or cos the OP wants him to - there's a world of difference there. It might just be that his buddy just isn't ready to push the limits yet. Frustrating though it might be, if he's cycling and enjoying it as he's doing it, surely that's all that matters, not whether he is putting in as much as you think he's capable of?