ENTRY FEES ?????

CritUSA said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH prize list of

$1000 ?

What the market will bear.

Quoted message said:

$2000 ?

What the market will bear.

Quoted message said:

$3000 ?

What the market will bear.

Quoted message said:

thanks Danny

You're welcome, Dan

(CritUSA) said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry fee
for a CASH prize list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

For what category. Except for a pro-1-2 race, (or pro-1,
just pro, and maybe 1-2-3 for women) there should be no
cash prizes.

JT

"John Forrest Tomlinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 27 Mar 2004 16:01:17 GMT, [email hidden]

(CritUSA) said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH

prize

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

For what category. Except for a pro-1-2 race, (or pro-1,
just pro, and maybe 1-2-3 for women) there should be no
cash prizes.

I'm glad you said that and not me. Now you'll hear
from all of those cat 5's who spend all summer winning
those big pots.

fair entry fees (via shameless promo) can be found at:
www.splen.com/mcc

Quoted message said:

Subject: ENTRY FEES ????? From: [email hidden] (CritUSA)
Date: 3/27/2004 11:01 AM Eastern Standard Time Message-id:
<[email hidden]>

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry fee
for a CASH prize list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

thanks Danny

[email hidden] (CritUSA) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH prize list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

thanks Danny

What kind of race? IIRC at Sea Otter the MTB short course is
$35-45 for sport and beginners for a 20-25 minute race and
hardly any prizes
- medals for top five and jersey for the winner.

Then let's take VeloPromo, a northern California race
promoter:

velopromo.comcopr ent.htmOpen ↗ Everyone except
juniors pays $20. Top six get t-shirts, and there's some
cash - it looks like about 600 guaranteed this year, with
most going to P/1/2 and the women, which seems appropriate.

Then you can compare it to a NRC race:

mclanepacificcyclingclassic.comgrandprix2004.htmOpen ↗

Are you considering promoting a race or just wondering
what's about par for the course?

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

On 27 Mar 2004 16:01:17 GMT, [email hidden]

(CritUSA) said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH prize list of

Quoted message said:

For what category. Except for a pro-1-2 race, (or pro-1,
just pro, and maybe 1-2-3 for women) there should be no
cash prizes.

Perhaps some actual promoters will speak up. I suspect what
prizelists there are, are a small part of the race budget. A
lot of it goes to municipal fees for using the road (or
facility for offroad races), paying cops, etc. As
municipalities get strapped for cash and taxes are a bad
word, charging higher fees for everything (bike races,
community facilities like a pool, etc) becomes a convenient
source of revenue.

Bike race entry fees are about the same as century entry
fees, and centuries don't have prizelists - added food
expenses, fewer permit fees, usually a modest fundraiser
for the promoting club ... Surely nobody's getting rich off
this stuff.

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your own web gateway! -- See
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"Tom Kunich" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"John Forrest Tomlinson" <[email hidden]> wrote
in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 27 Mar 2004 16:01:17 GMT, [email hidden] (CritUSA)

Quoted message said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH

prize

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

For what category. Except for a pro-1-2 race, (or pro-1,
just pro, and maybe 1-2-3 for women) there should be no
cash prizes.

I'm glad you said that and not me. Now you'll hear from
all of those cat

5's

Quoted message said:

who spend all summer winning those big pots.

I'll say it too. Unless you are a cat 2 or higher, you
shouldn't be deluded into thinking that you should be racing
for money; but to be fair, the lower categories shouldn't
have entry fees greater than about $10 either, and less for
training races.

Tom Kunich said:

I'm glad you said that and not me. Now you'll hear from
all of those cat 5's who spend all summer winning those
big pots.

Don't be delusional. I won a T shirt in a cat 5 race once.
No pots, though.

JT said:

For what category. Except for a pro-1-2 race, (or pro-1,
just pro, and maybe 1-2-3 for women) there should be no
cash prizes.

Quoted message said:

JT

I'll double that. I can't remember how many crits i used to
do that went ballistic in the sprint when there was a big
pot to win. never saw the point, obviously i wasn't racing
for the money - as if i even could.

On 27 Mar 2004 20:46:54 -0800, Benjamin Weiner <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

On 27 Mar 2004 16:01:17 GMT, [email hidden]

(CritUSA) said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH prize list of

Quoted message said:

For what category. Except for a pro-1-2 race, (or pro-1,
just pro, and maybe 1-2-3 for women) there should be no
cash prizes.

Perhaps some actual promoters will speak up. I suspect what
prizelists there are, are a small part of the race budget.

I'm sure it varies.

I'm involved in promoting three races a year. In one the
prize list is just under 20% of our costs. I don't know
much about the costs strcuture of the other two, but in
one the prize list is by far the largest cost and could
easily be half our total costs (I think photo finish
service is second).

JT

"Benjamin Weiner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Bike race entry fees are about the same as century entry
fees, and centuries don't have prizelists - added food
expenses, fewer permit fees, usually a modest fundraiser
for the promoting club ... Surely nobody's getting rich
off this stuff.

Don't centuries frequently have a charity that they donate
to (which, in theory, helps to persuade the municipal powers
that be to offer some form of support)?

The size of the prize list is only one of several items to
be considered when judging the value of the race and the
"fairness" of the entry fee. The prize list may be a large
portion or a small portion of the costs that the organizers
bear to put on the event depending on the event. There may
or may not be other sources of revenue besides entry fee.
Rarely is there much money left over to create profit for
the organizer. The value of the event, in terms of what you
would pay to enter it, also depends on how unique the event
is, when it is scheduled, how many other races there are in
the area, other amenities, etc. In addition, the value of
the event varies from individual to individual. I may be
willing to pay a high price for some events that you
wouldn't do if you were paid and vice versa.

All that said, here in Oregon entry fees vary between $10
and $20 for single day races. There is no consistent
relationship between prize list and entry fee (or attendance
for that matter, although here is a reverse relationship
between entry fee and attendance). Costs to the organizer
are lower here compared to the rest of the country for
several reasons but there are also many races so the value
of each race is lower (the supply being higher).

Mike Murray

"CritUSA" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:20040327110117.04343.00000171@mb-
m29.aol.com...

Quoted message said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH

prize

Quoted message said:

list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

thanks Danny

"Tim Lines" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:r2s9c.109327$1p.1545893@attbi_s54...

Quoted message said:

Tom Kunich said:

I'm glad you said that and not me. Now you'll hear from
all of those cat

5's

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

who spend all summer winning those big pots.

Don't be delusional. I won a T shirt in a cat 5 race once.
No pots, though.

What did you stretch that t-shirt over?

Quoted message said:

"CritUSA" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH

prize

Quoted message said:

list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

thanks Danny

Danny,

I always feel un-ripped off if the entry fee is equal to the
last place of prize money.

Mike's big race has a better ratio than that, and that
it why so many of us trackies fly across the country
to do it...

Joey D

cat 1-2 $20-50 all others except juniors, $12-25

your welcome.

"CritUSA" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:20040327110117.04343.00000171@mb-
m29.aol.com...

Quoted message said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH

prize

Quoted message said:

list of

$1000 ?

$2000 ?

$3000 ?

thanks Danny

Carl Sundquist said:

"Benjamin Weiner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bike race entry fees are about the same as century entry
fees, and centuries don't have prizelists - added food
expenses, fewer permit fees, usually a modest fundraiser
for the promoting club ... Surely nobody's getting rich
off this stuff.

Quoted message said:

Don't centuries frequently have a charity that they donate
to (which, in theory, helps to persuade the municipal
powers that be to offer some form of support)?

Yup. So do some races (I can think of a couple in Norcal,
and Myerson does a cross race for a good cause). I don't
know if it actually gets in-kind municipal support, or it's
more that the good cause provides leverage to help persuade
the community to grant the permit.

I didn't really intend to compare race and century budgets,
rather point out that people are willing to pay similar fees
to ride events with no prizes, (albeit a bit more
support/food) and on roads that anyone can ride for free
anyway. For me personally, despite my low budget, the entry
fee is much less of a cost than the mental cost for races
that require getting up way too early in the morning and
driving long distances.

I don't know about that. I've seen plenty of races that were
put on because people thought it was a good thing to have
bicycle races. If you're not in it to make a profit, you
kind of mess up the free market.

For example, juniors often pay less. Is that really because
they can't cough up the money or is it because getting
juniors racing is seen as a Good Idea?

-Dion

"Dan Connelly" <d_j_c_o_n_n_e_l@i_e_e_e.o_r_g> wrote in
message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

CritUSA said:

Entry fees keep going up each year.What is a FAIR entry
fee for a CASH

prize

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

list of

$1000 ?

What the market will bear.

Quoted message said:

$2000 ?

What the market will bear.

Quoted message said:

$3000 ?

What the market will bear.

Quoted message said:

thanks Danny

You're welcome, Dan

i think it is the smartest thing to first figure out what
the point of your race is...if it is as a fundraiser for you
club, then you have the max amount of categories and charge
the highest entry fee you can get away with, then offer a
discount to masters and juniors who want to do more than one
race... i hate this way of promoting races by the way...

if your goal is to grow an important event that showcases
cycling in the community, then it is a lot trickier... you
have to go the extra mile to to service your cleints (the
riders and sponsors) and find ways to give them value...
maybe you take a hit in the begining hoping to develop your
event into something that is financially viable in a number
of years... from the standpoint of the riders you have to
charge a reasonable entry fee so that they will be happy and
come back... if your race has a bad rep then riders will
stay away... $20 for a $1000 purse is a place to start, $25
for a race that has up to $5000... if you need to pump up
the entry for a race then you maybe need to re-think your
purse.... if you dont have the sponsorship to cover it you
shouldnt ask the riders to put up big huge fees to support
their own purse...

pro races are different because the teams pay the entry
fees and there is an enormous opportunity for them to get
advertising exposure... the level of support from the
promoter is high, so there is value even though the entry
fees are big... they usually offer media support and
opportunities for the teams to get into local and national
publications through the help of PR firms... if you cant
provide that level of support then keep your entries
down... it is usually the privateers and local strong guys
who are paying out of their own pockets to come to these
races... they will be the back bone of a race that develops
into a great event, so you should take care of them from
the start...