In article <[email hidden]>, TopCounsel
Quoted message said:Recent attempts to incorporate some slower running into my routine caused me to notice something I
have always done without giving it a second thought -- silently counting out my cadence in my head
-- while running, for me this is a constant 1-2-3, 1-2-3, 1-2-3, such that the starting foot
alternates right-to-left and back (helps keep symmetric running form, I'd bet).
For me, this is a vestige of the fact that my first sport was cycling, where keeping your cadence
nearly constant is a hallmark of good cycling, and is enabled by being pro-active with your gear
changes. While cycling, most people try to keep at about 60 rpm or higher, and folks like Lance
Armstrong or Greg Lemond may be at 80-90 rpm or more at times. While cycling, my count is always
1-2-3-4, 1-2-3-4, 1-2-3-4, different than the running count in that it always starts with the same
footstroke.
This habit has become so ingrained in my running and cycling that I never even notice it anymore;
nonetheless, I believe it is extremely helpful in maintaining pacing. I can invariably guess
within 30 seconds how long it has taken me to complete a given circuit, though I never run for
less than 45 minutes or so. Perhaps more important, counting my cadence reminds me to shorten my
stride and keep the same cadence on the uphill portions of my runs ("gearing down"😉.
The counting does not keep me from thinking about other things while running, as it takes up a
level of conciousness somewhere underneath real "thinking." As most NG regulars know, the
recommendations for distance-running cadence vary somewhat but seem generally to congregate around
160 -190 steps per minute, and this fits nicely with the 1-2-3 per second count.
Am I alone in doing this? Other interesting variations on this theme out there?
Top,
From a reply of mine to to Arthur Dent about 2+ years ago.
In health and on the run, Ozzie Gontang Maintainer - rec.running FAQ Director, San Diego Marathon
Clinic, est. 1975
Mindful Running: mindfulness.commr.aspOpen ↗ faqs.orgrunning faqOpen ↗
Arthur Dent said:I've been experimenting on recent long runs with different ways to keep from going too fast too
early, which invariably causes me to run much slower at the end.
My breathing experiment seemed to be quite successful. On my last long run, an 18-miler, I
consciously held myself to a 4-in, 4-out pattern for the first 6 miles. By only running as fast as
I could comfortably run with this pattern, my pace was a nice and slow 8-8.5 minutes/mile (MPM).
Then, at the 6-mile mark, I shifted to a 3-in, 4-out pattern for 3 miles. And, at 9 miles, I
shifted to a 3-in, 3-out for the next 4 miles. By this point, I was doing a steady 8 MPM. At mile
13, I shifted to 2-in, 3-out and, finally, for the last 3 miles, I kicked it into high gear
(i.e., 2-in, 2-out) and slowly accelerated to my hoped-for marathon race pace, doing my last mile
in 7:23. It was a good feeling to know that I could run a 7:23 mile, without killing myself,
after having already run 17 miles (and this was my first time running the 18-mile distance!).
All-in-all, I averaged 8 MPM, with first mile being 8:13, then gradually slowing to 8:40 at
mile 6, then gradually speeding up as I moved to faster breathing patterns. Is this a good
long-run pace for someone hoping to do a marathon at 7:20 pace?
Does anyone else use this technique? And what about for the race itself? For the race itself, I'd
like to do the first few miles at
7:50 pace, then accelerate to 7:20 by maybe the 4-5 mile mark, maintaining 7:20 until the half,
then pushing to 7:15 to make up for the early slowness, and, finally, for the last few miles
just hoping to hold onto 7:20....
I think that I can do the above negative splitting by consciously constraining myself to slower
breathing patterns at the start, but is this an inefficient way to control pace? Would I be better
off if I could hold the desired pace while freely allowing myself to move to faster breathing
patterns? Or does consciously sticking to slower breathing patterns at the start have the
favorable effect of not only limiting pace, but also of speeding the transition from glycogen-
burning to fat-burning? Does it take more oxygen to burn glycogen than it does to burn fat? AD
Arthur,
A man after my own lungs. Here's a post that I have grown into what I call Breathing Rhythms and
Patterns. Hopefully helping to increase your own folklore on breathing. As you allude to, the
breathing becomes the gears to keep fueling the body with enough O2 to keep the body metabolizing
its stores of energy.
Breathing Rhythms & Patterns
c.1999, 2000 Austin "Ozzie" Gontang, Ph.D.
Next to proper running form and style and an integral part of proper running is breathing and the
rhythms of breath.
Once good running form is achieved one can keep the same cadence and be running 30 seconds to 2+
minutes a mile faster. The issue is getting the leg through its cycle to touch the ground
maintaining the same cadence. This is where the concept of running is falling and catching oneself
gracefully comes into play.
To that end, breathing becomes the next important factor in maintaining an oxygen uptake to support
the increased speed while maintaining the same cadence turnover.
This is where I teach breathing at slower speeds to a 4 steps in and 4 to 8 steps out. The idea is
that I am never panicked and that my breathing sequences are always enough to sustain the rate of
turnover...which maintains at the same cadence be it a 9 or 10 minute mile or a 5 minute or better
mile. For the young and for top runners, most never think about breathing. However thinking about
breathing patterns and rhythms and practicing them will allow someone who has played with or
practiced them a possible advantage if it allows them to stayed relaxed, concentrated and focused
under extreme stress.
So running slow, I do a 4 in and 6 or 8.. Then as I need more air I go to a 4in/8out; 1 cycle of air
every 12 steps 2 cycles every 24 steps 4in/7out; 1 cycle of air every 11 steps 4in/6out; 1 cycle of
air every 10 steps 4in/5out; 1 cycle of air every 9 steps 4in/4out; 1 cycle of air every 8 steps 3
cycles every 24 steps 3in/4out; 1 cycle of air every 7 steps 3in/3out; 1 cycle of air every 6 steps
4 cycles every 24 steps 2in/3out; 1 cycle of air every 5 steps 2in/2out; 1 cycle of air every 4
steps 6 cycles every 24 steps 1in/2out; 1 cycle of air every 3 steps 8 cycles every 24 steps
1in/1out/1in/1out/2in/2out 9 cycles every 24 steps 1in/1out/1in/1out/1in/1out/1in/1out 12 cycles
every 24 steps
The ideal one goes for is the same volume at all rhythms. Remember you're always breathing though
the nose even when the mouth is open...unless your nose is blocked, i.e. nasal congestion.
All of these patterns are breathed at a rate so that the mind stays calm and does not let any of the
body unnecessarily tighten up from a perceived stress beyond one's capability.
The other aspect of breathing cycles is that an even (symmetric) breathing pattern, which means when
the steps in & steps out total an even number, the runner is always running on the same foot at
intake and also at exhale.
With an odd (asymmetric) breathing pattern, which means when the steps in & steps out total an odd
number, the runner is running off the opposite foot at initial intake step of each breathing cycle
in-three-steps/out-four-steps; in-three-steps/out-four-steps:
in-two-three out-two-three-four in-two-three out-two-three-four LFT-2 - 3--RT -two-three-four RT-two-
three LFT-two-three-four LFT-two-three... L 2 3 4 5 6 7 R 2 3 4 5 6 7 L 2 3...
In animals there is a breathing pattern which is called phase locking. It has been photographed at
high speeds in horses, cheetahs, ostriches where at full speed there is one pattern into which
they fall. In humans, if I remember from the research, there were found two phase lock patterns at
top speed.
So you can see if you breathe 2in/2out all the time and we speed up you can only continue to do
what you do. You only get 6 cycles of air every 24 steps. Whereas I can pick up the speed and get
8 cycles or even 9 cycles of air every 24 steps...and if I practice I can get 10 or 12 cycles
every 24 steps.
You may begin to realize that running a marathon during the later part of the run from 15 onwards is
a matter of running in a trance state. It is through these breathing patterns I have taught people
to play with the rhythms of their breath to keep on going. So for someone whose muscles are glycogen
depleted I need to maintain the same running pace but increase the amount of oxygen to those
muscles...and that is where the breathing patterns come in.
Some people begin to realize the power of rhythm. When I run with a partner and we are doing
symmetric breathing of 2in/2out or 3in/3out or 4in/4out, I do reciprocal breathing so that after 3
or 4 minutes as they breathe out I am breathing in and as they breathe in I am breathing out. The
sound can be heard. The experience is that the other person's out breath is breathing me. On the
next cycle my out breath is breathing his/her in breath.
Eyes on the horizon, breathing reciprocally with my partner, the miles covered in trance are an
experience to remember.
When into the breathing and at different breathing patterns both symmetric and asymmetric and some
being reciprocal, the breathing patterns of 3 or 4 or 5 of us mixed with the foot touch (rather than
foot fall) can carry a group of runners easily for miles where the mind scans the body to relax any
tension as it arises and lets it go...going back to the sound of the feet running together and the
breathe of the pack. If you've seen Stomp you know the power of rhythm!
In article said:How are you supposed to breathe when you run? I have no problem doing this when jogging, but when
running or doing anything else (like crunches), I never get to the point where my muscles are
sore, simply because I always stop when I'm gasping for air. I've tried doing searches on how
you're supposed to breathe, but I don't quite understand the notation that people use (such as
8/4) and how do you breathe in-in/out-out? Does this just mean to take a deeper breath? Thanks.
