Sue and Ban Atkins, not Supplements

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

STEVE BAYT

(Parma/Brook Park, Ohio)

While Illinois Senator Durbin and his SB 722 would create an unfathomable health crisis in
America, there already is one. And the FDA, FTC, and FCC should never have allowed The Atkins Diet
to even be marketed.

SB722 posits no threat whatsoever to America's health.

The FDA, FTC, and FCC have no juridiction over the publication of the Atkins Diet which is, after
all, free speech guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution.

Quoted message said:

Quite frankly, it is horrible that The United States Senate is proposing to regulate out of
business the most beneficial industry in America- that of nutritional supplements. Yet, Durbin etc
have done nothing to outlaw the Atkins Diet. The phenomenal dangers of The Atkins Diet can be
found at www.safediets.org and www.atkinsdietalert.org

SB722 will not regulate nutritional supplements out of business.

Quoted message said:

There are many other health problems associated with Atkins which I will try to figure out how to
interpret in non-jargon.

They pretty much describe what I was going to rant about this week. What is perhaps more
unacceptable than Durbin trying to outlaw supplements yet doing nothing to end The Atkins Diet, is
that the media ever accepted a single ad or commercial for what can only be described as a
nutritional death diet.

Senator Durbin and SB722 are not "trying to outlaw supplements."

Quoted message said:

Just like Randy Shilts was the most vocal warner (person who warns?) about AIDS (1981-10/3/85). I
am pretty much the only warner about S.B.
722.

Perhaps you whould read the bill.

Quoted message said:

This article offers a solution to stop The Atkins Diet, which apparently neither the media nor
government want to do.

The Atkins Diet is not a product, it is a book, which is protected free speech.

Quoted message said:

The solution to stop SB 722 is complicated involving politics and public opinion and the number of
votes each senator would lose. The solution to Atkins is fairly simple-litigation.

Anyone who has suffered the surreal amount of medical problems inevitable with Atkins should sue,
to a very large amount, Atkins. The regulations that Cigarette manufacturers face now are the
result of people's civil litigation. Quite frankly, preaching a low carb, high protein diet with
extreme nutritional deficiencies and nearly no fiber would have maybe worse medical hazards than
cigarettes.

Cigarettes are drug delivery devices. The Atkins Diet is a book.

Quoted message said:

McDonald's and their high fat, high protein diet has been successfully sued at the trial phase,
but has been able to get stays of execution pending appeal. And McDonald's does not claim to be a
medical program.

Atkins is being marketed as a medical way of losing weight, founded by a Doctor being prescribed
by Atkins doctors and health practioners. Although I am not a lawyer, I have taken some legal
courses. Atkins is dispensing diet and medical advice which has a higher legal standard of
liability then McDonald's which was just selling an unhealthy product.

The only Atkins product "being marketed" is a book. Free speech, remember?

Quoted message said:

A few multi-million dollar lawsuits and Atkins is out of business. And of course, the bazillion
people who have died on Atkins could sue for compensatory damages and punitive damages for the
suits would be negligence.

Readers of the Atkins book follow the diet (or not) of their own free will. It would be hard to
prove foundation for damages, even for the cleverest of lawyers.

Quoted message said:

In fact, the only nutrition that an Atkins dieter could get would be from Nutritional supplements-
which of course Senator Durbin wants to make illegal.

McDonald's has the money to appeal litigation until Plaintiff's die, Atkins dosen't have that
luxury. People who have suffered from this disaster diet can do much more than file a complaint
with the Atkins Diet Alert site, or contact the FDA to end Atkins.

They could consult a lawyer, or be pro se if they are lawyers, and file a lawsuit. For it's quite
terrifying to think of an America where the media runs ads for Atkins while health foods are being
pulled off the shelf.

So, to those bazillion former Atkins people with hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical
bills, call a local lawyer and get your money back that a diet program preached by quacks have
manifested.

Unfortunately, you can't sue any media outlet for running ads, because of what we call The First
Amendment. A newspaper can run an ad preaching well, I don't want to give any ideas and they
couldn't be sued by anyone harmed. But, Atkins can and should.

If Atkins isn't regulated out of business, maybe it can be litigated.

Fat chance.

--Rich

"Rich Shewmaker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

STEVE BAYT

(Parma/Brook Park, Ohio)

While Illinois Senator Durbin and his SB 722 would create an unfathomable health crisis in
America, there already is one. And the FDA, FTC, and FCC should never have allowed The Atkins
Diet to even be marketed.

SB722 posits no threat whatsoever to America's health.

The FDA, FTC, and FCC have no juridiction over the publication of the

Atkins

Quoted message said:

Diet which is, after all, free speech guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution.

Bayt has been told that SB722 does not do what he claims, but, like a posting bot, he perpetuates
his baloney.

"Mark Probert-February 20, 2004" <Mark [email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Rich Shewmaker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

STEVE BAYT

(Parma/Brook Park, Ohio)

While Illinois Senator Durbin and his SB 722 would create an unfathomable health crisis in
America, there already is one. And the FDA, FTC, and FCC should never have allowed The Atkins
Diet to even be marketed.

SB722 posits no threat whatsoever to America's health.

The FDA, FTC, and FCC have no juridiction over the publication of the

Atkins

Quoted message said:

Diet which is, after all, free speech guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution.

Bayt has been told that SB722 does not do what he claims, but, like a posting bot, he perpetuates
his baloney.

First of all ATkins isnt't just a book. The company sells super high fat foods, such as bars, shakes
so it is not protected by Free Speech. Second SB 722 would eliminate systematically all health
foods, the bill can be found at a link to www.vitaminworld.com

It has 5 co-sponsors already.

Third this replier has the stupidity to post these stupid one-line brain dead flames in many
other sites. These people should do research and instead of doing mass stupidity try doing one
good posting.

If I were to post that gravity exists, he would state no it dosen't. This person or people need to
take some classes in analytical thinking.

The fact is that SB722 would create do more harm than ATkins could ever.

But, it would take only a handful of lawsuits against Atkins to close it down. Because unlike suits
against fast food joints (Consumer Reports January 2004 page 13 paragraph 5) ATkins plaintiffs could
include punitive damages in their relief. For Fast Food Joints aren't trying to market their menus
as healthy, just good tasting.

Atkins, despite being told by virtually every source, including an interview on MSNBC's Deborah
Norville Tonight that their diet and products are endangering American's health. Thus, Atkins can't
claim it doesn't know how bad their products and diets are.

The 1994 DSHEA disclaimer needed on supplements provides legal protection and responsibility to
consumers. Before DSHEA supplement raids were common, production and marketing without FDA approval
was in some cases illegal. That is what SB 1532 is all about.

The fact is that any Atkins sufferer should contact a lawyer willing to work on commission. It would
take but a few suits complete with milions of dollars in punitive damages to shut down Atkins.

Sort of like these two flamers with their one-line generic responses should be.

Atkins is a product of which a book is only a small part of. First Amendment rights would only apply
if it were only a book.

As for foods which are claiming to be "Atkins Friendly" that would be up to a debate about what
lawyers call legal privity. Foods which claim to be low carbs can't really be sued unless those
manufacturers are marketing that Low Carb is good.

The only legal debate about Atkins is whether it would take under 20 lawsuits to close it down, or
if 30 would be requried.

The only debayt about SB722 is up to the hope that idiot responses like these two flamers aren't
representative of the whoele electorate.

(This posting is not yet approved by any Bar Association, I am not YET a lawyer, and is not intended
to be legal advice in and of itself. But merely an encouragement of Atkins sufferers to get
professional legal advice.)

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Mark Probert-February 20, 2004" <Mark [email hidden]>

wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Rich Shewmaker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:J7SdnQS_m5E-JKjdRVn-
[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
> STEVE BAYT
>
> (Parma/Brook Park, Ohio)
>
> While Illinois Senator Durbin and his SB 722 would create an unfathomable health crisis in
> America, there already is one. And the FDA, FTC, and FCC should never have allowed The
> Atkins Diet to even

be

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> marketed.

SB722 posits no threat whatsoever to America's health.

The FDA, FTC, and FCC have no juridiction over the publication of the

Atkins

Quoted message said:

Diet which is, after all, free speech guaranteed by the U.S.

Constitution.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bayt has been told that SB722 does not do what he claims, but, like a posting bot, he
perpetuates his baloney.

First of all ATkins isnt't just a book. The company sells super high fat foods, such as bars,
shakes so it is not protected by Free Speech. Second SB 722 would eliminate systematically all
health foods, the bill can be found at a link to www.vitaminworld.com

I have read the bill, and your interpretation of it is utterly absurd. No one with a reading
comprehension level of second grade would think that it means what you say.

Quoted message said:

It has 5 co-sponsors already.

It needs a 100 in the Senate and 435 in the House.

Quoted message said:

Third this replier has the stupidity to post these stupid one-line brain dead flames in many other
sites. These people should do research and instead of doing mass stupidity try doing one good
posting.

Listen, numbnuts, I have read the bill. and it does not say what you claim. As I said, supra, one
needs only a 2nd grade education to know that.

Quoted message said:

If I were to post that gravity exists, he would state no it dosen't. This person or people need to
take some classes in analytical thinking.

I was thinking analytically before your first diaper analysis.

Quoted message said:

The fact is that SB722 would create do more harm than ATkins could ever.

Who cares about Atkins? Not me. The bill would require that supplement manufacturers submit all
reports of adverse events to the FDA for the FDA to review. What is so wrong about that? What has
the supplement industry got to hide? Who is paying you to post this [censored]?

Atkins BS snipped. Lets focus on the bill....

Quoted message said:

The 1994 DSHEA disclaimer needed on supplements provides legal protection and responsibility to
consumers. Before DSHEA supplement raids were common, production and marketing without FDA
approval was in some cases illegal. That is what SB 1532 is all about.

What it was all about was Orrin Hatch paying back one of Utah's largest industries for supporting
him over the years. He even owned stock in some of the companies.

snip atkins

Quoted message said:

Sort of like these two flamers with their one-line generic responses should be.

snip of atkins

Quoted message said:

The only debayt about SB722 is up to the hope that idiot responses like these two flamers aren't
representative of the whoele electorate.

Actually, I hope we are since we read the bill and know what it says.

"Mark Probert-February 21, 2004" <Mark [email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Mark Probert-February 20, 2004" <Mark [email hidden]>

wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Rich Shewmaker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:J7SdnQS_m5E-JKjdRVn-
[email hidden]...
>
> "Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> "]news:[email hidden]...
> > STEVE BAYT
> >
> > (Parma/Brook Park, Ohio)
> >
> > While Illinois Senator Durbin and his SB 722 would create an unfathomable health crisis in
> > America, there already is one. And the FDA, FTC, and FCC should never have allowed The
> > Atkins Diet to even

be

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > marketed.
>
> SB722 posits no threat whatsoever to America's health.
>
> The FDA, FTC, and FCC have no juridiction over the publication of the

Atkins

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Diet which is, after all, free speech guaranteed by the U.S.

Constitution.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bayt has been told that SB722 does not do what he claims, but, like a posting bot, he
perpetuates his baloney.

First of all ATkins isnt't just a book. The company sells super high fat foods, such as bars,
shakes so it is not protected by Free Speech. Second SB 722 would eliminate systematically all
health foods, the bill can be found at a link to www.vitaminworld.com

I have read the bill, and your interpretation of it is utterly absurd. No one with a reading
comprehension level of second grade would think that it means what you say.

Quoted message said:

It has 5 co-sponsors already.

It needs a 100 in the Senate and 435 in the House.

Quoted message said:

Third this replier has the stupidity to post these stupid one-line brain dead flames in many
other sites. These people should do research and instead of doing mass stupidity try doing one
good posting.

Listen, numbnuts, I have read the bill. and it does not say what you claim. As I said, supra, one
needs only a 2nd grade education to know that.

Quoted message said:

If I were to post that gravity exists, he would state no it dosen't. This person or people need
to take some classes in analytical thinking.

I was thinking analytically before your first diaper analysis.

Quoted message said:

The fact is that SB722 would create do more harm than ATkins could ever.

Who cares about Atkins? Not me. The bill would require that supplement manufacturers submit all
reports of adverse events to the FDA for the FDA to review. What is so wrong about that? What has
the supplement industry got to hide? Who is paying you to post this [censored]?

Atkins BS snipped. Lets focus on the bill....

Quoted message said:

The 1994 DSHEA disclaimer needed on supplements provides legal protection and responsibility to
consumers. Before DSHEA supplement raids were common, production and marketing without FDA
approval was in some cases illegal. That is what SB 1532 is all about.

What it was all about was Orrin Hatch paying back one of Utah's largest industries for supporting
him over the years. He even owned stock in some of the companies.

snip atkins

Quoted message said:

Sort of like these two flamers with their one-line generic responses should be.

snip of atkins

Quoted message said:

The only debayt about SB722 is up to the hope that idiot responses like these two flamers aren't
representative of the whoele electorate.

Actually, I hope we are since we read the bill and know what it says.

STEVE BAYT Parma/Brook Park, Ohio

Below is directly from a nutritional supplement website. Along with a link directly to the text
bill. There is also a H.R. 3377 which was introduced a few months ago. For information on both and a
list of fax numbers already compiled to all Senators go to your local Vitamin World, for one of many
fliers they have been handing out.

If there was no threat to supplements, why would a national franchise be soliciting their customers
to activism. For the first rule of business is not to spread rumors of your own business or
industries death. If there was no threat, then VW wouldn't be telling their customers they might not
be in business much longer. For customers always await dime on the dollar discount going out of
business sales, when they hear of closings.

In a recent mass e-mail and harvesting to a few hundred other manufacturers and direct sellers, most
have links to the TAKE ACTION NOW site.

So, stop in to a Vitamin World,or find one nearby at vitaminworld.com for many fliers supporting all
of my claims. And no I don't work for them. I actually spend a great deal of money there. For anyone
in the Cleveland area there is one at the front entrance of Parmatown, Great Northern, Erieview.

This is the last response to this Mark Roberts person, who needs to learn what supra means. By the
way the Vitamin World fliers and articles in their vertical trade publication are wrote by people
with MBA's and even more advanced degrees.

I would demand an apology from "Mark Roberts". But being a huge Jamie Sale' and David Pelletier fan
supra their Love Story performance, along with tomorrow infra being Nancy Kerrigan's Llilenhammer
10th Anniversary, I won't for this stopping an American Health Crisis is not just a cause but a
raison d'etre. And Kerrigan didn't want an apology from Harding. Because to her, Sale'/Pelletier and
me with my causes. "Love Means Never Having To Say. You're Sorry."

I do though feel sorry for anyone on Atkins who might not be able to buy supplements upon SB 722
or HR 3377.

**********TEXT FROM VITAMIN WORLD SITE***********

PROTECT YOUR ACCESS TO VITAMINS AND NUTRITIONAL SUPPLEMENTS THE GOVERNMENT MUST NOT BE ALLOWED TO
LIMIT THE FREEDOM OF CHOICE OF AMERICAN CONSUMERS WHEN IT COMES TO THEIR HEALTH.

Don't Let Congress Overturn the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act of 1994

Support S. 1538 and Oppose S. 722 Because the Food and Drug Administration has failed to fully
uphold the law, Congress is looking into making changes that will undermine many of the freedoms
that American consumers of dietary supplements hold dear.

SUPPORT S. 1538 No more excuses from the Food and Drug Administration! Give the FDA the resources it
needs to implement DSHEA!

This bill will eliminate the Food and Drug Administration's favorite excuses that it doesn't have
enough staff, money or power to regulate supplements. The FDA has fallen short when it comes to
enforcing the law.

Support research that validates the safety, effectiveness and quality of dietary supplements.

Because dietary supplements come from natural ingredients, they can't be patented. While this
insures that these products are readily—and affordably — available, it takes away the ability of
manufacturers to recoup research costs.

The bill doubles the funding given to the Office of Dietary Supplements to expand research and
consumer information about these products. Hold the government accountable for its actions.

This bill will require the FDA to file annual reports to Congress about how they're regulating
dietary supplements. If they fail in their responsibilities to fully implement the law, they'll be
held accountable.

OPPOSE S. 722

The Food and Drug Administration must not be granted new and unprecedented authority to subject safe
and beneficial products to additional and unnecessary scrutiny.

This bill would subject nearly all vitamins, minerals, herbal products and other supplements to a
level of scrutiny that is both unwarranted and unnecessary. Products that have been used safely for
hundreds ­ and in some cases, thousands ­ of years would be subject to clinical evaluation using
standards that are at the complete discretion of the FDA. Click here to view S. 722.

nnfa.orgs722.pdfOpen ↗

The government must not be allowed to limit the freedom of choice of American consumers when it
comes to their health.

By questioning the safety of any dietary supplement that receives even one complaint, hundreds of
products that have been safely and beneficially used could be removed from the marketplace. Under
this new legislation, the FDA has complete discretion to make this determination, regardless of
whether the product was used under conditions cautioned against by the manufacturer on the label.

The government must not be allowed to single-out dietary supplements. By almost every measure, and
by a wide margin, dietary supplements can be used more safely than conventional foods and OTC drugs.
Yet this legislation exempts foods in these product categories from being classified as stimulants.
Specifically, the bill unfairly excludes the most common "stimulant" ingredient in foods ­ caffeine.

TAKE ACTION NOW! This bill could be added to existing Senate legislation at any time. We need you to
take two vital steps: 1) immediately let your Senators know that you support S. 1538 and ask them to
co-sponsor the bill, and
2) ask them to oppose S. 722.

E-MAIL YOUR SENATORS NOW To email your Senators simply go to:
capwiz.comalertOpen ↗ Enter your ZIP code in the "Take
Action Now" box.

Make any changes you feel necessary to the sample letter, and click "submit." A copy of your letter
will be sent to the two U.S. Senators from your state. A copy of the letter will also be sent to you
confirming which Senators received the letter.

Call your Senators now. To reach your Senators' offices, call them either through the Capitol Hill
switchboard at (202) 224-3121 or directly at their Washington, D.C. or local offices. When you reach
your Senator's office, ask to speak with the staff member in charge of health-related issues. To
find contact information for your elected officials, simply click on
capwiz.comofficialsOpen ↗

"Steve Bayt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Do no post sales [censored] in response to me.