Canada walking?

[email hidden] (May Proj) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Has anyone any experiences of walking in Canada - anywhere in Canada. I'm looking for independent
walking in mountains, 20Km a day perhaps with small settlement (rather than camping) for
accommodation. I've done this sort of thing in UK, France and New Zealand, and thought Canada
could be good this year?

I have walked some short sections of the Bruce Trail in Ontario. It isn't mountainous, so maybe
doesn't meet your criteria, but it follows the Niagara escarpment. Advantage of Ontario, for your
requirements, is that it is a *relatively* densely populated part of Canada and therefore finding
trailside accommodation may be easier than further west.

Take a look at www.brucetrail.org for details.

Tim.

no spam please

May Proj wrote

Quoted message said:

Has anyone any experiences of walking in Canada

I've walked in the Rockies around Banff and Jasper.

Scary scary bears. Never again :-(

Call me a coward but I'd rather retain my life and my limbs.

Fabulous, beautiful country to enjoy from an SUV. Lovely folk too.

Chris

In message <[email hidden]>, Chris Gilbert
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

May Proj wrote

Quoted message said:

Has anyone any experiences of walking in Canada

I've walked in the Rockies around Banff and Jasper.

Scary scary bears. Never again :-(

Call me a coward but I'd rather retain my life and my limbs.

I've spent many months solo walking in the Canadian Rockies. There really is little to fear from
bears. Attacks are extremely rare. You're much more likely to drown in a mountain stream, fall off a
cliff or be struck by lightning - all of which can occur in our mountains. And as to the dangers
when travelling to the mountains ......

Of course you could avoid the bears by going in the winter and spring but then you'll need skis or
snowshoes and good winter skills.

Quoted message said:

Fabulous, beautiful country to enjoy from an SUV. Lovely folk too.

Fabulous, beautiful country to enjoy on foot, especially on long walks. The wilderness camping is
some of the best in the world.

The best trail guide to the Canadian Rockies in my opinion is:

Don't Waste Your Time In the Canadian Rockies: An Opinionated Hiking Guide by Kathy and Craig
Copeland (Voice In The Wilderness Press).

The best general guide is:

The Handbook of the Canadian Rockies by Ben Gadd (Corax Press)

Quoted message said:

Has anyone any experiences of walking in Canada - anywhere in Canada. I'm looking for independent
walking in mountains, 20Km a day perhaps with small settlement (rather than camping) for
accommodation. I've done this sort of thing in UK, France and New Zealand, and thought Canada could
be good this year?

Well I think you would need to be a tad more specific before anyone could hope to wade into a
question like that. Where in Canada, when are you going, type of terrain...?

Not trying to be picky, but it's a big country...;-)

JohnB

Small settlements are a l o n g way apart in Canada... Its like Douglas Adams' Universe, you dont
know just how mind bogglingly big it is.

You will probably have to carry a tent and a fair bit of grub with you.. And you will need to swot
up on the local hazards.. bears etc. Any travel off the infrequent beaten track will require a fair
bit of bush whacking in places..

These comments are a generalisation of my experiences of the coast of BC and the Northern Rockies.
In the national parks there are lots of very well cared for paths and frequent campsites with full
bear proof facilities (safes or pulleys) The scenery is as mind bogglingly beautiful as the country
is big. Once I am back in regular employment again, I will be over there very very frequently.... I
really miss the place..... Enjoy!

Richard Webb

On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 18:51:12 +0000 (UTC), johnbrewer@naespam_compuserve.com (John

Brewer) said:

Quoted message said:

Has anyone any experiences of walking in Canada - anywhere in Canada. I'm looking for independent
walking in mountains, 20Km a day perhaps with small settlement (rather than camping) for
accommodation. I've done this sort of thing in UK, France and New Zealand, and thought Canada
could be good this year?

Well I think you would need to be a tad more specific before anyone could hope to wade into a
question like that. Where in Canada, when are you going, type of terrain...?

Not trying to be picky, but it's a big country...;-)

JohnB

Anyone know where the best parts are?

Alex.

.

Quoted message said:

Scary scary bears. Never again :-(

Call me a coward but I'd rather retain my life and my limbs.

Fabulous, beautiful country to enjoy from an SUV. Lovely folk too.

Chris

When in bear country sew little bells to your clothes to warn bears of your approach.

Also be aware of bear poo. The best way to recognize bear poo is the presence of little bells.

Quoted message said:

When in bear country sew little bells to your clothes to warn bears of your approach.

Also be aware of bear poo. The best way to recognize bear poo is the presence of little bells.

I thought it went that Black bear poo contained little bells, while grizzly's contains little bells
and smells of pepper spray.

Grizzly and cub wandered through the site, during my first ever backcountry camp. I missed this, but
loads of folk were only too happy to tell me all about it.. Mind it was in Tweedsmuir Provincial
Park which is Bear Central.

Worth noting that the remoter areas are probably safer in that the bears are not acustomed to
people and have less chance orf associating folk with easy food. They tend to leg it out of your
way. Never seen a bear except from my truck.(may this continue). Popular parks may have more chance
of problem bears.

Never been totally terrified of them, but practice standard bearanoia. They do add an edge to those
woodland strolls. Get me back there ASAP......

Now about those campsite critters that chew your gear....

Richard Webb.

"gaza" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

.

Quoted message said:

Scary scary bears. Never again :-(

Call me a coward but I'd rather retain my life and my limbs.

Fabulous, beautiful country to enjoy from an SUV. Lovely folk too.

Chris

When in bear country sew little bells to your clothes to warn bears of your approach.

Also be aware of bear poo. The best way to recognize bear poo is the presence of little bells.

You also need to know what type of bear you are dealing with so you can react accordingly.

If you have a bear encounter, turn and run like hell, find a tree and climb up it. If the bear
chases after you and climbs the tree it's a black bear. If the bear chases after you and knocks the
tree down it's a Grizzly.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed so far. Its the fact that it such a big coubtry that
prompted asking the group. Limited to out of uni term times in summer (I'm a lecturer), can cope
with most terrains, just looking for fantastic scenery, peace and quiet and absence of infernal
combustion engine!

[email hidden] (May Proj) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Has anyone any experiences of walking in Canada - anywhere in Canada. I'm looking for independent
walking in mountains, 20Km a day perhaps with small settlement (rather than camping) for
accommodation. I've done this sort of thing in UK, France and New Zealand, and thought Canada
could be good this year?

I spent six weeks up and down the Ice Field Parkway between Jasper and Lake Louise (BC/Alberta) a
few years ago. Had a great time and never saw a bear - until the last day when I saw three. Hotel
accommodation is scarce and expensive. I stayed in YHs; the best one was Mosquito Creek. Some great
circulars from there to Fish Lakes, and to Lake Helen. I also did some guided trekking tours under
canvas and mountain club huts with a company I could recommend - email me if you want details.

There's a daily shuttle run of a bus connecting all the hostels between Calgary and Jasper; think
about working your way through a selection with a few days at each hostel. Otherwise hire a car;
don't try and do it on public transport.

I agree with the earlier post who recommended the 'Don't Waste your time in the Rockies' walk book,
but buy it here in the UK. It was hard to find a copy in the bookstores in the Rockies. Some
booksellers considered its sale to be unpatriotic as it could be construed as suggesting that it was
indeed possible to waste one's time in the Rockies. And that's bad for tourism, don't you know?

In message <[email hidden]>, Hedley Malloch
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

... (snip) ...

Quoted message said:

If you have a bear encounter, turn and run like hell, find a tree and climb up it. If the bear
chases after you and climbs the tree it's a black bear. If the bear chases after you and knocks
the tree down it's a Grizzly.

This is a common fallacy.

It's a common joke! And an old one.

Quoted message said:

A bear could give a race-horse a run for its money; you won't outrun them.

Up to 40mph apparently.

Quoted message said:

Similarly if it's a bell you want, make sure it is a big one from one of the old Canadian Pacific
steam locos. Anything else is a waste of time.

And tinkly little bells annoy other walkers and ensure you won't see much wildlife.

Running is reckoned to provoke a chase response. People running away have been mauled and killed by
bears that ran past a stationary person to get them.

My favourite of the old bears jokes is the one about two walkers who suddenly see a grizzly coming
towards them. One immediately takes off his boots and starts to put on running shoes. "What are you
doing that for, you can't outrun a bear", says the other. "I don't have to", comes the reply, "I
just have to outrun you".

Quoted message said:

You should post this up on rec.backpacking or one of the US/Canadian outdoor groups. The guys there
will give sound advice on how to handle the bear problem - like which type of collapsible pump-
action shot-gun to pack in your day-bag.

Some will give sound advice, some will start discussing which types of guns and ammunition are best,
some will attack the idea of carrying guns at all, a flame war on guns will start. Some will give
advice even though their experience of walking in bear country is minimal or non-existent. (For the
record I've spent well over two years in total walking and camping in bear country, including over a
year in grizzly country, most of it solo. The only time I've carried a gun was in Spitsbergen, where
there are polar bears).

Note that guns aren't allowed in Canadian national parks and that none of the books to the Rockies
advise carrying them. You could carry bear deterrent pepper spray, though I never have.

There are sensible precautions you can take - the main being not to cook and store food in your tent
or where you sleep. Set up a kitchen 100 yards away. On the trail keep an eye open for bears and
bear sign (dung, scratch marks on trees, diggings). Bears will generally smell or hear you and move
away without you even knowing they were there. If the wind is in your face, you are in dense brush
or forest and next to a noisy stream then making an occasional noise - shouting or singing - will
let any bears ahead know you are there.

Remember that the chances of even seeing a bear are unlikely and that most of the rare encounters
don't result in an attack. In over a year in grizzly country I've seen just three grizzly bears,
only one of which was fairly close.

A good book on bears is Backcountry Bear Basics:The Definitive Guide to Avoiding Unpleasant
Encounters by Dave Smith (The Mountaineers).

Quoted message said:

If shot-guns aren't your scene (and I could well understand that) then try and be philosophical
about it. It probably won't happen, but if it does, then what the hell. There are worse things than
being eaten by a bear - such as staying safe in your campsite, hotel or hostel, bored and listening
to your arteries hardening.

LOL :-)

In message <[email hidden]>, AndyP <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

"Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Remember that the chances of even seeing a bear are unlikely and that most of the rare encounters
don't result in an attack. In over a year in grizzly country I've seen just three grizzly bears,
only one of which was fairly close.

What about Mountain Lions? Are they anything to worry about? One opinion that I remember from
somewhere (probably rec.backcountry) is that it was a stupid idea and asking for trouble to go
running alone in mountain lion territory.

I did some research into this a year or so ago and no there is nothing to worry about. Mountain Lion
attacks are extremely rare. Even seeing one is very unlikely. I've never seen one.

According to the book Cougar Attacks, by Kathy Erling, there were 284 attacks between 1800 and 2001
of which 42 were fatalities. Putting this in perspective around 12 people are killed by domestic
dogs in the USA and 800,000 need medical attention every year.

Mountain lion attacks have increased slightly in recent years and there have been a number of high
profile cases of runners being attacked, usually in areas where housing developments have spread
into mountain lion territory. It's still a tiny risk though.

In article <[email hidden]>, one of infinite monkeys

at the keyboard of 'AndyP said:

Quoted message said:

steep. Apparently bears aren't well suited to running downhill, something to do with having
shorter front legs I think, makes them topple over.

You might be confusing that with the accepted practice for catching Haggis in the Highlands.

Are you sure you're not both confused? It's Yetis who can't run downhill, and Haggises who have left
legs shorter than the right for contouring. A haggis wouldn't give chase in any case.

--
Hutton: Nobody is asking why Blair was so keen to have a damaging inquiry into a minor side-issue of
going to war.

So, what has he successfully deflected media attention from?

In message <[email hidden]>, Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

John Laird said:

Being able to go fast (30-35mph in bursts against 20 for humans) would be completely useless
without the acceleration to reach top speed quickly.

No it wouldn't, why do you make that assumption? I'm not saying that a bear can't accelerate
quickly, but it certainly couldn't accelerate as quickly as a human. It's a fact of physics that a
big heavy creature can't accelerate as quickly as a small light creature. Look how quickly a cat
can accelerate compared to a human.

All the studies show that bears can accelerate faster than humans. They can sprint at 35-40 mph,
twice as fast as a fit human.

There's also the problem that if you see a bear and start to run that may provoke a charge. All the
experts say you should not run. Most bear encounters don't result in an attack anyway. You don't
want to provoke a chase response.

I once came round a blind corner on a wooded trail and met a black bear coming the other way. It was
maybe ten feet away. We both stopped and then the bear took off, running uphill at amazing speed. If
it had charged I would have had no time to even start running.

Quoted message said:

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If you can accelerate in a straight line, you can likely change direction just as easily

Sorry, I just don't accept that. The heavier the weight the stronger the momentum and the more
difficult it would be to change direction. And I don't believe a bear could accelerate as quickly
as a human. (I am of course talking about a fit, agile human, not an office worker out for a stroll
carrying a few stones of lard around his belly.)

I've seen bears running fast uphill and dodging rocks and trees. They are surprisingly agile.

Quoted message said:

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While the momentum at 35mph will be greater, this will have no bearing if the bear is only doing
25 to catch dinner :-)

Rubbish. At any given speed, a heavy creature will have more difficulty turning than a light
creature. Size, strength and weight do not convey agility, quick acceleration and manoeuvrability.
These characteristics are mutually incompatible. The same is true in all areas of life -
aeroplanes, tanks, racing cars, animals, birds and so on. Bears are big and strong, humans are
light and manoeuvrable, not to mention more ingenious. If a bear catches the human, the human
doesn't stand a chance, but given a suitable tactical situation, a human could out-manoeuvre a
bear. It all depends on the nature of the battlefield (and the type of human - overweight
accountants need not apply). The outcome is not pre-determined.

The outcome isn't predetermined but in most cases where a bear charges and the charge isn't a bluff
(which most are) the bear catches the human.

Check Mount Assiniboine Lodge in Rockies. They are very busy and it may be difficult to find
accommodation with them but it fits your need. There are great trails out from this isolated lodge
with some of the most incredible scenery in all the Rockies. The area is so special that it is a
World Heritage Site.

I am a guide for a company that does wilderness trips and I know this area. [I do not work for
the lodge]

Len

"May Proj" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Thanks to everyone who has contributed so far. Its the fact that it such a

big

Quoted message said:

coubtry that prompted asking the group. Limited to out of uni term times

in

Quoted message said:

summer (I'm a lecturer), can cope with most terrains, just looking for fantastic scenery, peace
and quiet and absence of infernal combustion

engine!

Quoted message said:

Anyone know where the best parts are?

Well for me, I've had just six weeks and a couple of trips to BC/Alberta. It's barely enough to even
start appreciating the grandeur of the place. Truly breathtaking.

I would strongly suggest doing a lot of research before you go. Distances are so vast and the choice
is so great that it's a good idea to have a general plan for whatever you want to do. Get maps and
guide books. Rocky Mountain Books in Calgary (from memory?) have a wide range and a good service.

I don't know how you plan to travel so maybe access by rail is a factor. I would also consider
hiring a small plane or helicopter to fly you in to remote areas. I've done that and it really isn't
as horrendously expensive as you might think. Float planes will land you on lakes that might take
days to walk to. You'll likely have the place to yourself and access to more mountains than you can
shake a stick at! Arrange to get picked up a few days later and that can turn into an experience
that will stay with you a good number of years.

Really, the possibilities are endless. I think the trick is to narrow them down and plan to make the
best possible use of the limited time that you'll have.

Now I must go away, lie down and let the jealousy wear off....;-)

John B

... (snip) ...

Quoted message said:

If you have a bear encounter, turn and run like hell, find a tree and climb up it. If the bear
chases after you and climbs the tree it's a black bear. If the bear chases after you and knocks
the tree down it's a Grizzly.

This is a common fallacy. A bear could give a race-horse a run for its money; you won't outrun them.
Similarly if it's a bell you want, make sure it is a big one from one of the old Canadian Pacific
steam locos. Anything else is a waste of time.

You should post this up on rec.backpacking or one of the US/Canadian outdoor groups. The guys there
will give sound advice on how to handle the bear problem - like which type of collapsible pump-
action shot-gun to pack in your day-bag.

If shot-guns aren't your scene (and I could well understand that) then try and be philosophical
about it. It probably won't happen, but if it does, then what the hell. There are worse things than
being eaten by a bear - such as staying safe in your campsite, hotel or hostel, bored and listening
to your arteries hardening.

"Hedley Malloch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

... (snip) ...

Quoted message said:

If you have a bear encounter, turn and run like hell, find a tree and climb up it. If the bear
chases after you and climbs the tree it's a black bear. If the bear chases after you and knocks
the tree down it's a Grizzly.

This is a common fallacy. A bear could give a race-horse a run for its money; you won't outrun
them. Similarly if it's a bell you want, make sure it is a big one from one of the old Canadian
Pacific steam locos. Anything else is a waste of time.

I see humour isn't your thing then? Honestly, I do wonder sometimes!

KRO