Why low-carb.

Ben A. Green said:

when digested put the following into the blood:

carbs - glucose fat - fatty acids protein - amino acids

resulting in

carbs - available energy BUT damage to kidneys, eyes, capillaries when glucose concentration is
too high

You absolutely must offer a cite for this beauty. Do all the vegans know this? I think we better
alert them especially those that wear glasses.

Quoted message said:

fat - available energy plus useful material (essential fats)

I notice for carbs you talk about excess, well what about excessive fat.

Quoted message said:

protein - available energy plus useful material (essential amino acids)

And again what about excessive proteins?

Hell, what about excessive calories in general regardless type. If One's body needs 2000 Kcal a day
and I import 2500 a day, regardless of whence they come, call Goodyear to size up their next blimp.

Quoted message said:

How? Avoid excess carbs, especially carbs that digest quickly. Or use up the glucose by intense,
prolonged exercise.

YOu can also try exercise and not necessarily prolonged (45-60) minutes days and then eat a
delicious balanced diet(less the simple carbs and bad fat)

Quoted message said:

If this is wrong, tell me about it.

Judging from the biasses/myths of your question are you really looking for valid info?

--
Doug Freese "Caveat Lector" [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

If this is wrong, tell me about it.

ok

Quoted message said:

carbs - available energy BUT damage to kidneys, eyes, capillaries when glucose concentration
is too high

Only happens in diabetes so way too paranoid and simplistic

Quoted message said:

(There are no essential carbs.)

The brain can only thrive on blood glucose thus CHO eventually becomes an essential nutrient. The
state of ketosis (arising from CHO deficiency) is not too healthy either

Quoted message said:

High glucose is a problem that the body solves with insulin. Insulin scavenges the excess glucose
out of the blood. What happens to the excess glucose? It gets stored in fat cells as fat.

Insulin helps drive Glu into cells for mitochondrial function and energy (calorie) utilization.
Saying it goes to fat cells for storage in totality is totally erroneous.

Every body is different and some do better on lower or moderate CHO because they are prone (likely
genetically) to syndrome x / insulin insensitivity / metabolic syndrome / pre diabetes. These
individuals should exercise daily, moderate CHO with protein at each feeding, supplement with
insulin sensitizers, medication if needed. The propaganda that every human being is better off on
"low carb" diet is a farce and spun to make money. Seems many are buying it.

Chuck Balzer, MS RD

"Doug Freese" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ben A. Green wrote:

............

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

fat - available energy plus useful material (essential fats)

I notice for carbs you talk about excess, well what about excessive fat.

According to my understanding of the body-builders' diets, a high-fat diet in the absence of carbs
does not lead to fat storage.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

protein - available energy plus useful material (essential amino acids)

And again what about excessive proteins?

It takes a huge amount of protein to damage the kidneys.

....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If this is wrong, tell me about it.

Judging from the biasses/myths of your question are you really looking for valid info?

Yes. Thanks for your comments.

Ben

"ShorThing7" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If this is wrong, tell me about it.

ok

Quoted message said:

carbs - available energy BUT damage to kidneys, eyes, capillaries when glucose concentration is
too high

Only happens in diabetes so way too paranoid and simplistic

Yes, because in diabetes, one's insulin production (if any) is insufficient. In normals, insulin is
what keeps the BG from getting too high. We have no disagreement.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(There are no essential carbs.)

The brain can only thrive on blood glucose thus CHO eventually becomes an essential nutrient. The
state of ketosis (arising from CHO deficiency) is

not

Quoted message said:

too healthy either

I believe this is wrong. The brain can also thrive on ketones. What is "not too healthy" is not
ketones but ketoacidosis. Two arctic explorers in the 1920's lived for a year on an eskimo diet of
protein and fat only under medical supervision for a year and suffered no ill effects (cited in
Atkins's book).

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

High glucose is a problem that the body solves with insulin. Insulin scavenges the excess glucose
out of the blood. What happens to the excess glucose? It gets stored in fat cells as fat.

Insulin helps drive Glu into cells for mitochondrial function and energy (calorie) utilization.
Saying it goes to fat cells for storage in totality

is

Quoted message said:

totally erroneous.

Thank you.

Quoted message said:

Every body is different and some do better on lower or moderate CHO

because

Quoted message said:

they are prone (likely genetically) to syndrome x / insulin insensitivity

/

Quoted message said:

metabolic syndrome / pre diabetes.

Yes, but what causes people to become insulin-insensitive? What happened to millions of Americans in
the 1990's to change their cells to insulin-insensitive? Could it be excessive donuts, soda and
french fires?

These individuals should exercise daily,

Quoted message said:

moderate CHO with protein at each feeding, supplement with insulin

sensitizers,

Quoted message said:

medication if needed. The propaganda that every human being is better off

on

Quoted message said:

"low carb" diet is a farce and spun to make money. Seems many are buying

it.

Quoted message said:

You may be right. Time will tell. Thanks for your comments.

Quoted message said:

Chuck Balzer, MS RD

[email hidden] (ShorThing7) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If this is wrong, tell me about it.

ok

Quoted message said:

carbs - available energy BUT damage to kidneys, eyes, capillaries when glucose concentration is
too high

Only happens in diabetes so way too paranoid and simplistic

Wrong. It happens in everyone. The degree of insulin resistance and or inability to produce insulin
is a result of how much accumulated damage has been done to the islet tissues or the beta-cell
receptors. Same with kidneys, eye and capillary damage. Glucose damages them, the damage is gradual
until such time as a person is diagnosed as pre-diabetic or diabetic. You should be fully aware that
it is not a situation as to whether the tissues are damaged or not but is an issues as to how much
(what degree) of damage is done and does it produce visible or obvousl symptoms.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(There are no essential carbs.)

The brain can only thrive on blood glucose thus CHO eventually becomes an essential nutrient. The
state of ketosis (arising from CHO deficiency) is not too healthy either

[censored]. The body can produce the necessary carbs with no carb foods in the diet whatsoever. The
state of ketosis is not a dangerous state. It is a normal state. You are confusing ketosis with
ketoacidosis.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

High glucose is a problem that the body solves with insulin. Insulin scavenges the excess glucose
out of the blood. What happens to the excess glucose? It gets stored in fat cells as fat.

Insulin helps drive Glu into cells for mitochondrial function and energy (calorie) utilization.
Saying it goes to fat cells for storage in totality is totally erroneous.

[censored] again. Any basic bio-chemistry textbook will tell you in the first or second chapter that
excess carbs are converted to fat. Your statement is false, misleading, fraudulent and stupid.

Quoted message said:

Every body is different and some do better on lower or moderate CHO because they are prone (likely
genetically) to syndrome x / insulin insensitivity / metabolic syndrome / pre diabetes. These
individuals should exercise daily, moderate CHO with protein at each feeding, supplement with
insulin sensitizers,

[censored] again. Everybody is not different. We are of the same species and we metabolize and utilize
the three mmacro-nutrients in exactly the same way. If we were not the same, then all of our bio-
chemistry textbooks are completely wrong. Those with syndrome X / insulin insensitivity / metabolic
syndrome / pre diabetes are all the same as every one else except they have been damaged by a diet
with way to many refined carbs over too long a period.

When you say moderate CHO you are contradicting every thing you've said so far. The basis of a low-
carb diet is to moderate CHO, specifically the refined and High-GI-load carbs. Sugars, refined
grains and other high-GI-load foods.

And what exactly are insulin sensitizers?

Quoted message said:

medication if needed. The propaganda that every human being is better off on "low carb" diet is a
farce and spun to make money. Seems many are buying it.

Chuck Balzer, MS RD

The food and pharma industries has done a good job of creating the impression that carbs are the
best thing since sliced bread, even the heavily refined and/or sugar overloaded carbs. That is the
farce that we are dealing with here, they did it to make money. And you've bought into it.

Well Chuck, you've shown us just how misinformed a Registered Dietition can be. You really do not
have a clue. Next time you get an education, try learning with a bit of a critical mind and don't
just blindly accept everything that is being presented to you.

TC

"ShorThing7" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, because in diabetes, one's insulin production (if any) is

insufficient.

Quoted message said:

Wrong. In fact most diabetics (type2) produce plenty of insulin but the

cell

Quoted message said:

receptivity is altered (obesity or other malfunctions)

And BECAUSE the cell receptivity is altered, even "plenty" of insulin is insufficient.

Quoted message said:

...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I believe this is wrong. The brain can also thrive on ketones

Without glucose the brain will eventually die.

Quoted message said:

suffered no ill effects (cited in Atkins's book).

Now there is a scientific source without bias

This can be settled by following up Atkins's references.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, but what causes people to become insulin-insensitive?

Theories abound but the strongest are obesity, genetic predisposition,

reduced

Quoted message said:

activity, increased refined CHO. I have my own additions to that such as

heavy

Quoted message said:

metal toxicity both minute and severe thus altering hormonal and endocrine balances as well as
stresses of our modern world. Likely a combination of

all

Quoted message said:

of the aforementioned.

Quoted message said:

Could it be excessive donuts, soda and french fires?

Certainly exacerbates the obesity part of the equation or actually the "overfat" part which
interferes with insulin function.

Quoted message said:

You may be right. Time will tell. Thanks for your comments.

Your welcome. Good discussion.

Chuck

Quoted message said:

"ShorThing7" <[email hidden]> wrote in message (to me)
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, because in diabetes, one's insulin production (if any) is

insufficient.

Quoted message said:

Wrong. In fact most diabetics (type2) produce plenty of insulin but the

cell

Quoted message said:

receptivity is altered (obesity or other malfunctions)

And I replied

Quoted message said:

And BECAUSE the cell receptivity is altered, even "plenty" of insulin is insufficient.

My further comment:

The experience of diabetics gives a clue to the role of insulin in obesity.

Type 2 diabetics produce abundant (although insufficient) insulin. They typically are very
overweight.

Type 1 diabetics produce little or no insulin. They are typically wasting away no matter how
much they eat.

Ben

In article <[email hidden]>, Doug Freese

Quoted message said:

Ben A. Green wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

carbs - available energy BUT damage to kidneys, eyes, capillaries when glucose concentration is
too high

You absolutely must offer a cite for this beauty. Do all the vegans know this? I think we better
alert them especially those that wear glasses.

I think he meant when the person was diabetic -- diabetic retinopathy isn't so much a direct
relationship to sugar, but rather to circulatory damage from sugar.

During times of darkness, the oxygen requirement of the eyes increases (rather than decreases) and,
in diabetics, they can't get the oxygen to the eyes. The consequence is hemorrhaging.

newscientist.comnews.jspOpen ↗

--
_Deirdre deirdre.netdeirdre.netOpen ↗ "Dogs may have kept us company on the hunt, but it was the cats who
insisted we invent houses and discover fire." -- Khiem Tran

On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 15:50:39 GMT, "Ben A. Green" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

receptivity is altered (obesity or other malfunctions)

And BECAUSE the cell receptivity is altered, even "plenty" of insulin is insufficient.

there are several ways that make a cell insensible toward insuline. Lack of chromium bound
chromomoduline being one, too much glucagon (tnf-alfa increases glucagon release and increase
sensitivity toward glucagon in liver cells and diminish insuline sensitivity, tnf-alpha is a cytokin
released in disease, infections etc.

It reminds me that also adipocytes may produce tnf-alpha under certain circumstances.

"Alf Christophersen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ben A. Green said:

Quoted message said:

receptivity is altered (obesity or other malfunctions)

And BECAUSE the cell receptivity is altered, even "plenty" of insulin is insufficient.

there are several ways that make a cell insensible toward insuline. Lack of chromium bound
chromomoduline being one, too much glucagon (tnf-alfa increases glucagon release and increase
sensitivity toward glucagon in liver cells and diminish insuline sensitivity, tnf-alpha is a
cytokin released in disease, infections etc.

It reminds me that also adipocytes may produce tnf-alpha under certain circumstances.

I hate it when adipocytes do that.