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Race and the Invisible Hand

Started by Tim Tyler · · Last activity · 9 posts · 285 views

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
30 December 2003
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30 December 2003
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Tim Tyler
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  1. Publisher's review and description of the book:

    "Race and the Invisible Hand"

    - ucpress.edu9439.html

    The book is subtitled:

    ``How White Networks Exclude Black Men from Blue-Collar Jobs''

    It apparently concludes that the biggest difference responsible for lower black earnings and status
    has to do with an existing network of white social contacts that stands between the black men and
    their potential jobs.

    The existence of racism as a widespread biological phenomenon raises interesting questions about the
    power of percieved group membership to influence reproductive success. Hopefully a good
    understanding the basis of the phenomenon will help to deal with some of the conflicts it causes.
    --
    __________
    |im |yler timtyler.orgtimtyler.org [email hidden] Remove lock to reply.

  2. Tim Tyler said:

    Publisher's review and description of the book:

    "Race and the Invisible Hand"

    - ucpress.edu9439.html

    The book is subtitled:

    ``How White Networks Exclude Black Men from Blue-Collar Jobs''

    It apparently concludes that the biggest difference responsible for lower black earnings and status
    has to do with an existing network of white social contacts that stands between the black men and
    their potential jobs.

    The existence of racism as a widespread biological phenomenon raises interesting questions about
    the power of percieved group membership to influence reproductive success. Hopefully a good
    understanding the basis of the phenomenon will help to deal with some of the conflicts it causes.

    I wonder... would the moderator of this group have allowed a book review had the authors concluded
    that there really exists difference between the races responsible for lower black earnings?

    [moderator's note: Yes, with the same pained grimace, and I am wondering what you are implying, sir.
    Clearly, this newsgroup is not the best for any aspect of human evolution in particular, since this
    should fall into the sci.anthropology or .sociology hierarchies, but it is at least tangentially
    related to our topic as a whole, so I allow it as long as the threads do not devolve into mere
    vituperation. - JAH]

  3. Publisher's review and description of the book: "Race and the Invisible Hand"   -
    ucpress.edu9439.html The book is subtitled: ``How White Networks Exclude
    Black Men from Blue-Collar Jobs´´ It apparently concludes that the biggest difference responsible
    for lower black earnings and status has to do with an existing network of white social contacts that
    stands between the black men and their potential jobs. The existence of racism as a widespread
    biological phenomenon raises interesting questions about the power of percieved group membership to
    influence reproductive success. Hopefully a good understanding the basis of the phenomenon will help
    to deal with some of the conflicts it causes.
    --
    __________
      |im |yler timtyler.orgtimtyler.org [email hidden]

    It's difficult for me to "personally" evaluate this study. If I walked
    down the street a person would likely label me as a "white person". In
    terms of the socio-economic class I have occupied that would be middle
    class. But as you indicate the existence of racism is a widespread
    biological phenomenon. Despite the ethnic diversity of the U.S. the
    majority of Congress is "white" and "male". There is no question there
    are ghettoes in the U.S. of largely minority populations. Let's assume
    the author's premise is correct...that white networks exclude
    African-Americans from blue collar jobs. This study focused on racism as
    it applies to African-American black earnings and status. I think this
    is fine but I wonder if the author offered any possible solutions. In
    all honesty I don't think there are any real solutions at the moment.
    There may be ways to mitigate such racism through laws, education, etc.
    but that is not a lasting solution.

    You write, "The existence of racism as a widespread biological
    phenomenon raises interesting questions about the power of percieved
    group membership to influence reproductive success." I could be very
    mistaken but my recollection of statistics is African-Americans
    generally have more children than European-Americans. I'm pretty certain
    they have more children out of wedlock. There are important reasons for
    these statistics if they are accurate. So there is the possibility that
    racism against African-Americans has not hindered their reproductive
    success. Until recently they were the largest minority population. Now
    Hispanics are the largest minority population in the U.S. Part of this
    is due no doubt to the border between the U.S. and Mexico.

    The Europeans came to North America and wiped out most of the indigenous
    population. The United States was born. There were eventually
    African-American slaves, Jews, Chinese immigrants, etc. but the
    demography of the U.S. was primarily descended from Europeans.

    Today the demographic picture of the U.S. is much different. Most
    immigration is non-European. There have been several studies which
    project European-Americans becoming a minority in the U.S. by 2100.
    History has repeatedly shown minorities are frequently subject to
    oppression and in some cases genocide.

    The U.S. is not a melting pot. It may be easier for immigrants to come
    to the U.S. and live than it would be in other countries but that
    doesn't make it a melting pot. Racism exists among all groups in the
    U.S. African-American, Asian-American, European-American, Hispanics,
    etc. In terms of dominance in the workplace and elsewhere
    European-American racism predominates but this does not mean it always
    will. As previously mentioned demographic projections point to dwindling
    European-American numbers and eventually this will translate into
    diminishing European-American influence.

    I don't see how this can be prevented from occurring short of a
    balkanized totalitarian genocidal state. Does this mean
    European-Americans will ultimately become a minority in the U.S. largely
    cut off from powers of industry and governance and subject to oppression
    and possibly even genocide? Of course, [censored] remarked how "Aryans"
    (that nonsensical term) were absurdly small in numbers and subjugated
    much larger "races" but that was in the context of colonialism not the
    present day globalized world. Alas, within definite geographic
    boundaries demographic trends will result in changes.

    I've maintained for quite some time racism is sociobiological. In other
    words it is biological and that aggression is an extremely important
    part of it. I've also maintained our scientific and technological
    evolution has far outpaced our biological evolution. To reiterate what
    I've previously stated we can't wait for Darwinian evolution to catch
    up. The earth is full of nuclear weapons, biological weapons, explosive
    population growth, etc.

    The only solution is genetic engineering but the problem with this is it
    will be a century or longer before genetic engineering advances to the
    point where traits such as aggression can be modified. This, however, is
    the only solution. As Hawking states, "We won't change much in the next
    100 years". Do you feel comfortable Mr. Tyler?

    Michael Ragland

  4. Then... good for you and us, Mr. JAH!

    [moderator's note: Irie, irie bro. Weh ya say, I and I speaka truth. - JAH]

    James Michael Howard said:
    Tim Tyler said:

    Publisher's review and description of the book:

    "Race and the Invisible Hand"

    - ucpress.edu9439.html

    The book is subtitled:

    ``How White Networks Exclude Black Men from Blue-Collar Jobs''

    It apparently concludes that the biggest difference responsible for lower black earnings and
    status has to do with an existing network of white social contacts that stands between the black
    men and their potential jobs.

    The existence of racism as a widespread biological phenomenon raises interesting questions about
    the power of percieved group membership to influence reproductive success. Hopefully a good
    understanding the basis of the phenomenon will help to deal with some of the conflicts it causes.

    I wonder... would the moderator of this group have allowed a book review had the authors concluded
    that there really exists difference between the races responsible for lower black earnings?

    [moderator's note: Yes, with the same pained grimace, and I am wondering what you are implying,
    sir. Clearly, this newsgroup is not the best for any aspect of human evolution in particular, since
    this should fall into the sci.anthropology or .sociology hierarchies, but it is at least
    tangentially related to our topic as a whole, so I allow it as long as the threads do not devolve
    into mere vituperation. - JAH]

  5. Quoted message said:

    [moderator's note: [...] Clearly, this newsgroup is not the best for any aspect of human evolution
    in particular, since this should fall into the sci.anthropology or .sociology hierarchies, but it
    is at least tangentially related to our topic as a whole, so I allow it as long as the threads do
    not devolve into mere vituperation. - JAH]

    I don't think this sort of zenophobia is a specifically human trait.

    Of course it is convenient to give human examples - since we are human beings - and our own biology
    is of particular interest to us.

    More generally, I would be loathe to see all discussion of human evolution directed into
    anthropology or sociology groups.

    Aside from making convenient examples, humans may have a pivotal role to play in the future of the
    evolutionary process - since they are quite likely to be the means by which life masters space,
    intelligent design, matter and energy - not insignificant steps in life's ascent.
    --
    __________
    |im |yler timtyler.orgtimtyler.org [email hidden] Remove lock to reply.

  6. "James Michael Howard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

    Quoted message said:

    [moderator's note: Yes, with the same pained grimace, and I am wondering what you are implying,
    sir. Clearly, this newsgroup is not the best for any aspect of human evolution in particular,
    since this should fall into the sci.anthropology or .sociology hierarchies, but it is at


    least

    Quoted message said:

    tangentially related to our topic as a whole, so I allow it as long as the threads do not devolve
    into mere vituperation. - JAH]


    IMO the post was only topical in so far as any aspect of human behaviour is the result of evolution.
    There seems to be a tendency to favour the "in" group in important decisions such as hiring. The
    question is whether there is an innate tendency to define that "in" group by race, or whether the
    selected trait is arbitrary - now race, now social class, now religion. I would also want to see
    whether the white hirers favour whites indiscriminately, or whether they favour friends and family,
    who happen to be mostly white.

    However this is really much more sociological than biological. In biological terms, as someone
    pointed out, African Americans don't seem to be suffering any reproductive disadvantage for being at
    the bottom of the social heap.

  7. Michael Ragland said:

    I don't think this sort of zenophobia is a specifically human trait.

    It is usually spelled xenophobia


    Unless you mean a fear of mathematical paradoxes... or perhaps of arrows in flight.
    --
    John Wilkins DARK IN HERE, ISN'T IT? wilkins.id.au

  8. John Wilkins said:
    Michael Ragland said:

    I don't think this sort of zenophobia is a specifically human trait.

    It is usually spelled xenophobia

    Unless you mean a fear of mathematical paradoxes... or perhaps of arrows in flight.

    Why be afraid of arrows in fight? They'll never hit you.

    Bob

    --
    Bob O'Hara

    Rolf Nevanlinna Institute
    P.O. Box 4 (Yliopistonkatu 5) FIN-00014 University of Helsinki Finland Telephone: +358-9-191 23743
    Mobile: +358 50 599 0540 Fax: +358-9-191 22 779 WWW: rni.helsinki.fi~boh

  9. Anon. said:
    John Wilkins said:
    Michael Ragland said:

    I don't think this sort of zenophobia is a specifically human trait.

    It is usually spelled xenophobia

    Unless you mean a fear of mathematical paradoxes... or perhaps of arrows in flight.

    Why be afraid of arrows in fight? They'll never hit you.


    I feel a gradualism versus puncturationism debate coming on, to get back on-topic.
    --
    John Wilkins DARK IN HERE, ISN'T IT? wilkins.id.au

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