Voeckler

The course might suit Voeckler's all-arounder talents and I agree that it would be a hoot to see him win. My reservation would center on his tactical acumen and aggressiveness.Short, low-profile stage races where he can combine stealth, endurance, and attrition seem to be more to his liking. But if he could pull off something like Claude Criequelion did at Barcelona in 1984, it would certainly be refreshing.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by oldbobcat [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

The course might suit Voeckler's all-arounder talents and I agree that it would be a hoot to see him win. My reservation would center on his tactical acumen and aggressiveness.Short, low-profile stage races where he can combine stealth, endurance, and attrition seem to be more to his liking. But if he could pull off something like Claude Criequelion did at Barcelona in 1984, it would certainly be refreshing.

Yup on all counts. I do like seeing any but the "regulars" winning, and I also mourn the loss of the big breakaway in most races. I'm not sure which did more damage to the successful and surprising breakaway: radios or team tactics. Who doesn't enjoy seeing a breakaway, say like Thierry Marie's 200+km adventure in '91 survive?

On a completely unrelated note, I just read that Cadel Evans and his wife have adopted or are in the process of adopting a kid. Good for them. I'd say Cadel's had about the best 18 month stretch that he's ever had.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by alienator [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

Yup on all counts. I do like seeing any but the "regulars" winning, and I also mourn the loss of the big breakaway in most races. I'm not sure which did more damage to the successful and surprising breakaway: radios or team tactics. Who doesn't enjoy seeing a breakaway, say like Thierry Marie's 200+km adventure in '91 survive?

Total agreement here. It seems like technology and defensive tactics have drained the sport of a lot of its excitement. Cool breaks still happen, though, like the Boonen-Cancellara-Ballan finish of the 2008 Paris-Roubaix. It doesn't require underdogs or dark horses to make a great race.

My epitome of a solo win, though, is LeMond's Worlds win in 1983. It was the perfect example of the strongest rider in the peloton that day taking control of the race and leaving nothing to chance.

The LeMond escape was a great one.

There was a TdF winner who was leading and was on their way to winning who didn't sit back but won one of the closing stages on a big breakaway. I can't remember who the hell it was. At any rate, it's the unpredictability I love about watching bike races, and that's just a bit too lacking lately.

according to Fignon's book, it was Cyrille Guimard in the late 70's and 80's who created the tactic of controlling the breakaway distance to catch them as close to the finish as possible,

Man, I SO agree on the hate for latter-day tactics....basically any race I'm fortunate to watch, I'm pretty much rooting for the breakaway to stick, I don't care if it's a breakaway with [censored], Stalin, and Pol Pot in it.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by vspa [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

according to Fignon's book, it was Cyrille Guimard in the late 70's and 80's who created the tactic of controlling the breakaway distance to catch them as close to the finish as possible,

I hate him for that.

Voeckler certainly stepped it up last year, I find it hard to to be cynical though.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by alienator [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

There's an article in Cycling News in which Jalabert claims that the Worlds course in Valkenburg is one on which Voeckler could win in September. I've gotta admit, I've got a soft-spot for Voeckler after his his spunky performances this past year in the TdF and in earlier TdFs. I think it be a hoot for him to wind worlds. That'd be a great underdog story

I hope JaJa is calling this correctly.

I'd love to see Thomas Voeckler win a world road race title.
As always the winner needs a good strong team to ride for him on the day.
France will be up against strong teams in the form of GB, Holland, Spain, Italy, Australia,

A French road race champion - that would be nice[IMG]/img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]

It would be nice, but Voeckler will have to not only surmount other national teams but also the weird interplay of riders with others on their trade teams. I'm sure the French would love to have a cycling champion again.....someone of a different gender than Jeannie Longo.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by alienator [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

It would be nice, but Voeckler will have to not only surmount other national teams but also the weird interplay of riders with others on their trade teams. I'm sure the French would love to have a cycling champion again.....someone of a different gender than Jeannie Longo.

[IMG]/img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

watching the boring paris nice tt and the announcer was making comments when thomas vockler was racing how he is the most hated man in the pro peloton. this is what thomas vockler says himself.." nobody likes me"
the commentator was quoting thomas, but he agreed it to be true.. saying the reason is, thomaswill attack in wierd places, and is a little bit like claudio chiappeuchie.. WTF!!!! there are so many unwritten rules in racing..nobody [censored] at eddy m when he attacked in the feed zone in races!!!! tom boonan smacked thomas v on the back real hard its said, cause thomas attacked when everyone was going slow??? WTF!!!! big or small, somebody smacks me on the back hard, we fight then or i wait for him at the end of the race..these few reasons are [censored] up reasons on why he isnt liked..

race from start to finish.. case closed!!!

maybe dont attack when a guy goes up the road to spend 30 seconds with his family when they go thru his home town. even then the guy who wants to go up the road asks the leader of the race.. if the hammer is down, they aint slowing.. thats happened lots of times.. guy just waves to his wife and kid and 40kph.

and maybe the last day of the tour, nobody attacks in the first half of the stage.
i cant think of anymore...

thomas attacks during a race...

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by leanman [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

tom boonan smacked thomas v on the back real hard its said, cause thomas attacked when everyone was going slow??? WTF!!!! big or small, somebody smacks me on the back hard, we fight then or i wait for him at the end of the race..these few reasons are [censored] up reasons on why he isnt liked..

race from start to finish.. case closed!!!
...

maybe dont attack when a guy goes up the road to spend 30 seconds with his family when they go thru his home town. even then the guy who wants to go up the road asks the leader of the race.. if the hammer is down, they aint slowing.. thats happened lots of times.. guy just waves to his wife and kid and 40kph.

If Boonan really slapped Voeckler on the back for that reason I'd be dissapointed. He's (Boonan) one of the riders I like rooting for.

The only time I'd see not to capitalize is right after a bad accident. But seriously how can anyone get bent about it. It's a race... from start to finish. Like that nonsense with Shleck's gear slippage. When someone races the Tour, they are not only competing against the other riders, they are competing against the geography and sometimes even against the voices in their own heads telling them to get off the bike. Why does MY race depend on YOUR mechanic's ineptitude, YOUR need for food, or YOUR bloody soapbox?

But back on topic, it would be nice to see him do well at Worlds. I'll probably be rooting for Gilbert though despite his monopoly on one day races last season. Edit: but with 5 minutes more thought I'll probably be rooting for whomever fights hard this season with little fruit to bear. I guess that would indeed be an underdog of sorts.

danfoz

read 5th paragraph28, 2012
Do you like this?
[IMG]cdn1.media.cyclingnews.futurecdn.netimg 6901 220.jpgOpen ↗[/IMG] Thomas Voeckler (Europcar)

• [IMG]cdn1.media.cyclingnews.futurecdn.netimg 6901 45.jpgOpen ↗[/IMG]
  
• [IMG]cdn2.media.cyclingnews.futurecdn.netbettiniphoto 0096562 1 full 45.jpgOpen ↗[/IMG]
  
• [IMG]cdn4.media.cyclingnews.futurecdn.netbettiniphoto 0086507 1 full 45.jpgOpen ↗[/IMG]
  

view thumbnail gallery

Frenchman on jealousy and suspicion
Thomas Voeckler (Europcar) may be the darling of the French public after his exploits at the Tour de France, but he has admitted that his riding style has won him few friends in the peloton over the years.
The Frenchman made his first major impact in the summer of 2004, when victory at the national championships was followed by a lengthy spell in the yellow jersey at the Tour de France. While his pugnacious displays earned accolades aplenty in the home media, Voeckler soon detected a palpable degree of resentment among some of his peers.
“For the last few years, I’ve been the most popular French rider, sort of the darling, and at the same time, nine riders out of ten in the peloton don’t like me,” Voeckler told L’Équipe. “I understood that very early on, from 2005. The previous year, I had worn the yellow jersey for ten days on the Tour de France, but they felt that from a sporting point of view, I didn’t merit all that interest.”
In the years immediately after that initial breakthrough, Voeckler found that his aggressive brand of riding had put a number of noses out of joint in the peloton.
“One day on the 2006 Tour, Tom Boonen, who was reigning world champion, was near the front, slowing things a little,” Voeckler said. “At the moment I launched my attack, he hit me hard on the back. I stopped, he yelled at me and I said to him: ‘You can shout if you like, but don’t touch me.’ I was the small French guy he could hit because I’m thirty centimetres smaller than him.
“Whatever your palmares, nobody has the right to do that to a guy who wants to attack. I can’t forget it. Others, like Andrey Mizurov, threatened to throw their bidons at me if I attacked.”
Voeckler subsequently realised that his high media profile had also fanned some jealousy within the French peloton, although he admitted that the situation has changed slightly since his illustrious 2011 season. “But that doesn’t mean they have more time for me,” he pointed out. “My results have just changed the deal. In cycling, you need to have a palmares to have the right to talk, to be respected. I find that a bit useless.”
To illustrate his point, Voeckler recalled one of the first times he encountered the peloton’s internal hierarchy, during his grand tour debut.
“At the start of every stage of the Giro d’Italia, Mario Cipollini took out the road book to show riders where they had the right to attack! That was when I was starting out, in 2001, it was another era. And guys went along with it!”
Dealing with suspicion
That Voeckler has now earned the respect, if not the affection of his peers, is based largely on his performance at the 2011 Tour de France. In a remarkable display, he repeated his 2004 feat of wearing the yellow jersey for ten days, and also went on to finish fourth overall in Paris.
Given that he had finished 76th overall the previous year, eyebrows were raised at the marked nature of Voeckler’s transformation in the mountains. He took such suspicions on the chin, and admitted that he was himself struggling to explain the late blossoming of hitherto unknown stage racing prowess.
“I understand [the suspicions] all the more given that I’m the first to make that proposal about certain guys… I can’t blame people when you see all the affairs there have been these past few years,” Voeckler said. “On the Tour this year, I was surprised to be there. In 2009 also, when I won the Tour de Haut Var, and in 2010, with the great season that I did.
“I’m at a level that I would never have expected. I don’t really know how to explain it. I’ve discovered aptitudes in the high mountains while I’ve always maintained that as soon as the gradient went above 6%, it climbed too much for me.”
Voeckler also addressed rumours that he had trained under the supervision of an Italian doctor, and dismissed the suggestion that he had once been a client of the Bernard Sainz, the so-called ‘Dr. Mabuse.’
“I heard it said that I was seeing Docteur Mabuse. There’s even a guy who saw me coming out of his house!” Voeckler said. “To come back to the Italian doctor, at one stage, I had a

Was it really necessary to cut and paste so much? There's certainly not enough info in that article, part of an interview with one rider, to say what was going through Boonen's mind at the time. We don't have the other side of the story, do we? No matter the case, I like Voeckler and his willingness to be unpredictable. I think it's safe to say that radios have made things more predictable. Certainly, they're not the only reason for that, but they are a significant reason. I think there is a higher percentage of racers that don't have the best grip on tactics and reading the peloton than there was before radios, when winning required being able to read the peloton and/or take risks. I'm with Danfoz in that I think it's poor form to take advantage of an accident during a race. Likewise, if your only way to win is to attack during a peloton nature break, then....well, you're pretty sad. I also think it's in very bad form to attack in a feed zone. I couldn't care less about the tactical aspects of attacking in a feed zone, but it's safety that could be a real problem with such an attack, with riders and musettes all over the road. I could easily see a pile-up happening at a feed zone because of an attack. For just about any other situation, I'm all for letting the riders have at it. Hell, I wish there was actual attacking and racing happening on the last stage of the TdF. The riders can drink champagne when they're done. Voeckler is certainly the kind of guy that could have more success if radios were banned. Interestingly there was a big name rider who recently stated after a race that said race was a lot more exciting since radios were banned for the race. I can't remember the rider's name, but I got the impression that he had a lot of fun on that day and would favor banning radios.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by danfoz [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

If Boonan really slapped Voeckler on the back for that reason I'd be dissapointed. He's (Boonan) one of the riders I like rooting for.

The only time I'd see not to capitalize is right after a bad accident. But seriously how can anyone get bent about it. It's a race... from start to finish. Like that nonsense with Shleck's gear slippage. When someone races the Tour, they are not only competing against the other riders, they are competing against the geography and sometimes even against the voices in their own heads telling them to get off the bike. Why does MY race depend on YOUR mechanic's ineptitude, YOUR need for food, or YOUR bloody soapbox?

But back on topic, it would be nice to see him do well at Worlds. I'll probably be rooting for Gilbert though despite his monopoly on one day races last season. Edit: but with 5 minutes more thought I'll probably be rooting for whomever fights hard this season with little fruit to bear. I guess that would indeed be an underdog of sorts.

Guess who attacked right after the car took out Hoogerland and Flecha - Voeckler. I think he was out of the saddle the instant he realized he wasn't going to crash...

He obviously has a fair amount of talent but spends alot of time faffing around wasting energy. Sure you can call it courageous but courageous doesn't get you on the podium at the Tour. Getting your team mates to do the leg work and listening to your team boss (ie someone who has a clue about what's going on in the race) does. French temperament without the legs of Hinault to back it up.

swampy1970 said:

Guess who attacked right after the car took out Hoogerland and Flecha - Voeckler. I think he was out of the saddle the instant he realized he wasn't going to crash...
 
He obviously has a fair amount of talent but spends alot of time faffing around wasting energy. Sure you can call it courageous but courageous doesn't get you on the podium at the Tour. Getting your team mates to do the leg work and listening to your team boss (ie someone who has a clue about what's going on in the race) does. French temperament without the legs of Hinault to back it up.

 
 
 

Voeckler's getting smarter, and I think it shows in the better results he seems to be getting. He's definitely a talented rider, and I think he's got the legs for bigger and better things. You can't be a schlep and spend 9 or 10 stages in yellow. I'll take Voeckler's excitement any day over that of the Schlecks, but that may not be saying much. After all Cuddles looks damn near bubbly when compared to the Schlecks. People are drawn to and dig Voeckler because he does so much of his own leg work. He's fun to watch. The grand tours are desperately in need of more "fun riders".

True, you can't be a complete numpty and hold onto yellow that long - but the both times that Voeckler took yellow in his career he took advantage of the peloton letting his break stay away but he played his cards well just by being in those breaks in the first place. The first time they were given 12 minutes and this time 4+ minutes while the peloton sat up and made sure that the two guys that ended up on the deck weren't eliminated - only Garmin chased but then again, Garmin seem to do weird things from time to time...

He took advantage of the Schlecks' inability to figure out how to attack. If the top guys don't really attack each other as was the case last year it's a whole different ball game from the smash fest that was the 2004 Tour where Voeckler ultimately finished more than 31 minutes down after being 10 minutes up going into the mountians.

Plucky riding for sure but for someone who earns over $500,000 per year... meh.

Personally I don't think the guy has a cat in hells chance at the Worlds' this year and will probably finish somewhere other than with the leaders. It's either going to be a real strong hard-man like Cancellara, or Boonen or a sprinter like Cav or Goss that'll take it in Copenhagen.