Sit Bones Width and Saddle Size

A saddle CAN be too narrow ...

However, the part that you sit on can be as wide as you want it to be ... a typical church pew must be 12-to-16 feet wide, and I can tell you that a child can lean his-or-her sitbones against it when kneeling becomes tedious ...

So, IMO, at some point the width-or-lack-of is purely a cosmetic issue ...

A BROOKS B17 "narrow" is wider than most saddles ...

A "standard" BROOKS B17 is much wider than most saddles ...

A BROOKS B67 is really wide, but the nose isn't ...

• BTW. About a decade ago, I bought a Fizik women's saddle for my wife ... I tried it on a trainer for a few minutes just to insure that it was comfortable ... it was.
  

My understanding though is that if you get too wide, then chafing is a possibility. Just wondered if there was some "rule of thumb" when it comes to width and sit bone measurement.

To quote myself: "A BROOKS B67 is really wide, but the nose isn't ..." + "a typical church pew must be 12-to-16 feet wide, and I can tell you that a child can lean his-or-her sitbones against it when kneeling becomes tedious ..."

• I do not believe that you are capable of experiencing "chafing" from the rear portion of the saddle UNLESS it has a convex shape
  

FWIW. My RULE OF THUMB for saddles -- When in doubt, choose the BROOKS Professional ...

• some periodic maintenance IS required ...
  
• Leather saddles generally weigh 2x what a high end, contemporary "plastic" saddle will weigh ...
  
• the Brooks saddles with Titanium rails will reduce the weight marginally but add several hundred dollars to the cost so they are of dubious benefit ... save the weight elsewhere.
  

FYI. The Brooks Professional is wider than the Brooks B17 "narrow" and not as wide as the "standard" Brooks B17.

If you have your heart set on another plastic saddle, then let me paraphrase someone else's observation -- unless you are the size-and-weight of a professional rider who spends hours in the saddle, then don't expect the saddle that he-or-she uses to be comfortable for you, too. Conversely, I think Pantani rode on a Selle Italia Flite saddle ... a fairly w-i-d-e saddle, IMO.

If you can find one and you don't mind the polished brass trim on the rear edge of the saddle, then the SAN MARCO ROLLS is supposed to be a very comfortable saddle ...

The original SAN MARCO CONCOR is also a very comfortable saddle.

Both of the fore mentioned San Marco saddles & the Selle Italia Flite saddle are porky by today's standards.

Going to try the B15 Swallow. Wider than the B17 Narrow. Hopefully that works. Thanks for the input.

Here's my take on the Brooks saddle after ONE ride. It's very good....now. Yes, it's stiff but if it breaks in like it's supposed to it's only going to get better. I think I understand why people say they are uncomfortable. It's posture. If you get lazy in the saddle and rest on your perineum (sorta slide down onto the narrower middle), it's going to cause you discomfort. I found myself doing that on a couple occasions. But as long as I stayed in a good posture with my sit bones squarely on the wide part of the saddle, I was fine. It requires using your core just a bit and not just plopped down on top of the saddle. Not that you have to have a ripped six pack but you can't be lazy. I'm excited to see how it transforms. Unless it were to change drastically, I think this one's a keeper.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by alfeng [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

A saddle CAN be too narrow ...

However, the part that you sit on can be as wide as you want it to be ... a typical church pew must be 12-to-16 feet wide, and I can tell you that a child can lean his-or-her sitbones against it when kneeling becomes tedious ...

So, IMO, at some point the width-or-lack-of is purely a cosmetic issue ...

A BROOKS B17 "narrow" is wider than most saddles ...

A "standard" BROOKS B17 is much wider than most saddles ...

A BROOKS B67 is really wide, but the nose isn't ...

• BTW. About a decade ago, I bought a Fizik women's saddle for my wife ... I tried it on a trainer for a few minutes just to insure that it was comfortable ... it was.
  

What? the width issue has been proven over and over and over thousands of times to be more important then just looks. If a saddle is too narrow, your sit bones won’t be supporting your weight and you’ll feel like you are straddling a horizontal pipe because the sit bones will sitting on the slopes of the saddle not the flat area. If the saddle is too wide, it will chafe your thighs. And your pew example does not relate at all to a bicycle seat, try placing a foam covered plank on your bike and pedal away for about 100 miles...heck you won't make it around the block.

Brooks saddles do come in different widths, but why? Because of the sit bone problem, however unlike a plastic or CF based saddle the leather saddle actually breaks into your butt and your sit bones will make indentations where they sit making the saddle very comfortable from that point on for the original owner. Also the saddles you mentioned are not racing saddles but rather touring saddles where your sitting more upright then in a lower aero position, for the lower aero position Brooks makes the Swift and the Swallow. I have a B17 on my touring bike and I have a Swift on my road bike. My wife has a large rump, so I bought her a Specialized Expedition Plus, a wide saddle, she loves it...I hate it because it pains me after just 15 minutes of riding on it.

And as far as being able to report on saddle widths of various Brooks saddles, big deal you can learn that at the Brooks site.

It's obvious that Alfeng knows nothing about saddles.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by Froze [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

What? the width issue has been proven over and over and over thousands of times to be more important then just looks. If a saddle is too narrow, your sit bones won’t be supporting your weight and you’ll feel like you are straddling a horizontal pipe because the sit bones will sitting on the slopes of the saddle not the flat area. If the saddle is too wide, it will chafe your thighs. And your pew example does not relate at all to a bicycle seat, try placing a foam covered plank on your bike and pedal away for about 100 miles...heck you won't make it around the block.

Brooks saddles do come in different widths, but why? Because of the sit bone problem, however unlike a plastic or CF based saddle the leather saddle actually breaks into your butt and your sit bones will make indentations where they sit making the saddle very comfortable from that point on for the original owner. Also the saddles you mentioned are not racing saddles but rather touring saddles where your sitting more upright then in a lower aero position, for the lower aero position Brooks makes the Swift and the Swallow. I have a B17 on my touring bike and I have a Swift on my road bike. My wife has a large rump, so I bought her a Specialized Expedition Plus, a wide saddle, she loves it...I hate it because it pains me after just 15 minutes of riding on it.

And as far as being able to report on saddle widths of various Brooks saddles, big deal you can learn that at the Brooks site.

It's obvious that Alfeng knows nothing about saddles.

Indeed!

It may not be a big deal to YOU that I indicated that BROOKS saddles come in various widths, but if a person doesn't know that already then it may be useful information.

Hey! I guess it's a big deal that YOU have taken a few moments of your apparently valuable time to assess my knowledge-or-lack-of on the topic of bicycle saddles because ...

Quote (from another thread): Originally Posted by Froze [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

I am somewhat known and wish to not be revealed so I don't have to be bothered with a thousand questions.

WOW!

Who knew?

Of course, you (Froze) may be right that "Alfeng knows nothing about saddles" ...

BUT, despite your self-declaration that you are "somewhat known" it may be YOU who "knows nothing" ...

Hey! Does your anonymity mean that you can make the unreferenced declaration that "the width issue has been proven over and over and over thousands of times to be more important then (sic) just looks"?

Thousands of times?

Really?

Chafing?

Really?!?

The fact that YOU have a problem with chafing suggests that you don't know how to set up a Leather saddle ... OR, perhaps you need to lose weight ...

OR, were you just parroting something that you read somewhere?

Regardless, the fact that you chose to ignore my initial statement that "A saddle CAN be too narrow ..." would seem to suggest that you may have a literacy problem ... OR, were you intentionally ignoring my initial statement?

What should we think?

After all, you apparently disdain redundant statements ...

Since you are apparently enamored with the Brooks website, why don't you tell us if the B67 is wider-or-narrower than the Specialized Expedition Plus saddle which you put on your wife's bike ...

I reckon the B67 is almost 8" (200mm) wide.

Is that right?

How wide is the Specialized Expedition Plus saddle?

Have you ever sat upon a B67 saddle or an equivalently wide Brooks saddle?

I think not.

BTW. Did you actually adjust the Specialized Expedition Plus saddle to accommodate YOU or did you just sit on your wife's bike? Regardless, perhaps you want to better educate yourself as to the difference between what may be a poorly dimensioned "plastic" saddle and a Leather saddle because your first-hand experience just doesn't extrapolate into a universal experience ...

Is the NOSE of your B17 wider than the NOSE on a Swift?

• I think not unless you have failed to perform periodic maintenance on the saddles and have allowed the skirts on the B17 to flare out
  
  

If you look at YOUR saddles, you will see that other than cosmetic finish (or, if you have a Titanium version) the nose piece beneath the leather of most Brooks saddles is dimensionally the same; so, the only difference in how wide one Brooks saddle is over most others is due to how thick the leather is -- the exception may be the nose piece on a B72 whose nose piece I recall as actually being narrower.

• So, I'll repeat that "A BROOKS B67 is really wide, but the nose isn't ..."
  

With the understanding that different Brooks saddles have different widths, how-on-Earth do you manage to use two different width saddles?!?

Do YOUR sit bones change from ride to ride?

Yes?

No?

• So, IMO [presuming that a person knows how to set up a saddle], at some point the width-or-lack-of is purely a cosmetic issue ...
  

So, while some may agree with you (Froze) & suggest that I "knows nothing about saddles" I would have to say that you (Froze) somehow have managed to know less.

[CENTER] ----[/CENTER]

FYI. The phrase ("at some point"😉 which you either chose to ignore or are incapable of comprehending is a qualifier ...

If the former case, then shame on you for being a troll ...

If the latter case, then I hope that you are not so "well known" that it would be embarrassing for you to go back to school so that you can improve your literacy rate.

I have three bikes - one with a Fizik Ariane, another with a Selle Italia C2 gel and the third with a Brooks B17 Imperial. (This has a cutout) I also have a cheaper saddle that was replaced by the Brooks and another Fizik that I used a bit. I have tried the Brooks on each bike for a total of about 300 miles on it so far and I have ridden the other saddles about 1500 miles since September. For what it is worth, the Brooks is the most comfortable one by far and is probably the only one I would use now when riding more than 20 miles. (Although I'll give the others a chance again this summer because it is a hassle to keep switching saddles and I'm not ready to give up on them and buy two more Brooks yet.) I certainly don't get any chafing from it.

Perhaps it is the width of the Brooks but I think it is the different construction that I notice as I do think that the other saddles contact my sit bones ok.

alfeng, after reading Froze's questioning of your knowledge of saddles, I was eagerly awaiting your long and defensive response. You certainly didn't disappoint. Your rebuttal is a true classic, complete with all variety of your courtroom questions. The bold words and italics are a great touch as well, as if anyone who doesn't agree with you simply needs to reread the exact words you've first written to understand your genius and appreciate your deep contributions to the world of saddle science.

Bravo......
Whupp

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by doctorold [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

So, if I figure out the measurement between my sit bones, how do I know what size saddle to get? I obviously don't want one that is narrower than the measurement. But then how wide is too wide?

... and back to the original program:

You can cheat 🙂 Just use the BG Fit saddle chart (Specialized) and take your information and compare that to the widths they recommend and it may work for you...

However, saddle width isnt all the story. I find my uber skinny 143mm Specialized Toupe saddle very very comfortable, however the slightly wider Fizik saddle that came with one of my bikes is fairly comfy but anything over 2 hours on it is fairly grim.

+1 on the saddle chart, and the Specialized butt-o-meter. I've had my share of saddle guesswork, and it's not an exact science. I still don't think I have "THE" saddle for me, but eventually one just fits.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by alfeng [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

Indeed!

It may not be a big deal to YOU that I indicated that BROOKS saddles come in various widths, but if a person doesn't know that already then it may be useful information.

Hey! I guess it's a big deal that YOU have taken a few moments of your apparently valuable time to assess my knowledge-or-lack-of on the topic of bicycle saddles because ...

WOW!

Who knew?

Of course, you (Froze) may be right that "Alfeng knows nothing about saddles" ...

BUT, despite your self-declaration that you are "somewhat known" it may be YOU who "knows nothing" ...

Hey! Does your anonymity mean that you can make the unreferenced declaration that "the width issue has been proven over and over and over thousands of times to be more important then (sic) just looks"?

Thousands of times?

Really?

Chafing?

Really?!?

The fact that YOU have a problem with chafing suggests that you don't know how to set up a Leather saddle ... OR, perhaps you need to lose weight ...

OR, were you just parroting something that you read somewhere?

Regardless, the fact that you chose to ignore my initial statement that "A saddle CAN be too narrow ..." would seem to suggest that you may have a literacy problem ... OR, were you intentionally ignoring my initial statement?

What should we think?

After all, you apparently disdain redundant statements ...

Since you are apparently enamored with the Brooks website, why don't you tell us if the B67 is wider-or-narrower than the Specialized Expedition Plus saddle which you put on your wife's bike ...

I reckon the B67 is almost 8" (200mm) wide.

Is that right?

How wide is the Specialized Expedition Plus saddle?

Have you ever sat upon a B67 saddle or an equivalently wide Brooks saddle?

I think not.

BTW. Did you actually adjust the Specialized Expedition Plus saddle to accommodate YOU or did you just sit on your wife's bike? Regardless, perhaps you want to better educate yourself as to the difference between what may be a poorly dimensioned "plastic" saddle and a Leather saddle because your first-hand experience just doesn't extrapolate into a universal experience ...

Is the NOSE of your B17 wider than the NOSE on a Swift?

• I think not unless you have failed to perform periodic maintenance on the saddles and have allowed the skirts on the B17 to flare out
  
  

If you look at YOUR saddles, you will see that other than cosmetic finish (or, if you have a Titanium version) the nose piece beneath the leather of most Brooks saddles is dimensionally the same; so, the only difference in how wide one Brooks saddle is over most others is due to how thick the leather is -- the exception may be the nose piece on a B72 whose nose piece I recall as actually being narrower.

• So, I'll repeat that "A BROOKS B67 is really wide, but the nose isn't ..."
  

With the understanding that different Brooks saddles have different widths, how-on-Earth do you manage to use two different width saddles?!?

Do YOUR sit bones change from ride to ride?

Yes?

No?

• So, IMO [presuming that a person knows how to set up a saddle], at some point the width-or-lack-of is purely a cosmetic issue ...
  

So, while some may agree with you (Froze) & suggest that I "knows nothing about saddles" I would have to say that you (Froze) somehow have managed to know less.

[CENTER] ----[/CENTER]

FYI. The phrase ("at some point"😉 which you either chose to ignore or are incapable of comprehending is a qualifier ...

If the former case, then shame on you for being a troll ...

If the latter case, then I hope that you are not so "well known" that it would be embarrassing for you to go back to school so that you can improve your literacy rate.

You can sit there behind your computer and pretend to be something your not all day long; only reason I replied so others here can read your ignorant statements again and be as bored with you as I am.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by Froze [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

You can sit there behind your computer and pretend to be something your not all day long; only reason I replied so others here can read your ignorant statements again and be as bored with you as I am.

Well, I have to tell you that your reply doesn't make any sense to me & it probably doesn't make any sense to anyone other than yourself ...

BUT, you are the one who claims (or, should I say "pretends"?) to be "well known" ... so, I suppose you feel that being "well known" may entitle you to use the English language in any manner you choose.

To repeat:

• while some may agree with you (Froze) & suggest that I "knows nothing about saddles" I would have to say that you (Froze) somehow have managed to know less.
  

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by swampy1970 [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

However, saddle width isnt all the story. I find my uber skinny 143mm Specialized Toupe saddle very very comfortable, however the slightly wider Fizik saddle that came with one of my bikes is fairly comfy but anything over 2 hours on it is fairly grim.

I think that is the heart of the matter. I have several saddles that have about the same width yet feel quite different to ride on. I too can't see any problem with a saddle being "too" wide as long as nothing rubs or affects your pedaling motion in some way. It is absolutely amazing to me how many models there are yet how slight the differences seem to be between a lot of them.

Other than the Brooks, I've tried about 4 saddles in the past year (for rides over 2 hours) and there is quite a difference between them that is hard to comprehend by simply looking at them or measuring them. Even ones of similar size, shape and construction can feel different. As I said previously, the Brooks seems to be the only one that uses radically different construction and it is much more comfortable to me. I am not a big or heavy person and find the fairly wide B17 Imperial works fine for me in both aero and touring positions. I am not sure what possible benefit would lead me to consider a narrower Brooks model. I am not a racer but I often go on rides of 2-4 hours. And some saddles are pretty painful to me just an hour in.

Allfangs: HAHAHHAHAHHHHAAAAAAHAHAHAH, this is funny stuff, you should be a comedian because your sure are making me laugh!!!

-------------- deleted

San Marco Rolls is wide, and not too wide. very comfortable. been riding them since pre-2000s.

Quoted post said:

Originally Posted by doctorold [IMG]/img/forum/go_quote.gif[/IMG]

Here's my take on the Brooks saddle after ONE ride. It's very good....now. Yes, it's stiff but if it breaks in like it's supposed to it's only going to get better. I think I understand why people say they are uncomfortable. It's posture. If you get lazy in the saddle and rest on your perineum (sorta slide down onto the narrower middle), it's going to cause you discomfort. I found myself doing that on a couple occasions. But as long as I stayed in a good posture with my sit bones squarely on the wide part of the saddle, I was fine. It requires using your core just a bit and not just plopped down on top of the saddle. Not that you have to have a ripped six pack but you can't be lazy. I'm excited to see how it transforms. Unless it were to change drastically, I think this one's a keeper.

If you don't mind my saying, doctorold, I think this goes for all good performance-oriented (basically firm and narrow) saddles. The riders with poor saddle positioning or poor posture, either because of laziness or simply not knowing what good posture on a bike feels like, seem to be the ones always hunting for a new saddle.