Criterium Conundrum

wiredued said:

I was in the middle of a tight cat5 pack going five wide into a difficult turn wondering if I should be risking my life for something like 15th place. Is that correct thinking for a crit?🙂

Yes. They aren't paying 15 deep (in fact, they aren't paying at all) and it's not like you need the points for an upgrade. If you aren't "in the money" save yourself and your fellow riders and don't bother with the sprint. You wouldn't believe how many dumb crashes happen because some jackass is sprinting with his head down for 35th place. Or maybe you would believe it. 😉

wiredued said:

I was in the middle of a tight cat5 pack going five wide into a difficult turn wondering if I should be risking my life for something like 15th place. Is that correct thinking for a crit?🙂

I know it sounds easier than it is, and totally obvious, and someone has to be in the "middle of the pack," and all that, but the correct thinking is getting TO the FRONT, or better yet, getting OFF the front. If I remember right, most Cat 5 riders (Cat 4 and 3 too often, oh hell, all Cats) expect Crits to come to a bunch sprint. Instead of risking your "life" in a meaningless sprint for 15th, risk your "race" on a flyer or two. Hopefully you have team mates who can counter your moves, and you theirs.

You may finish off the back, even get pulled a few times, but you'll stay upright, get some great intensity workouts, perhaps garner a bit of respect, and maybe get a few primes (prizes in the 5s and potentially cash when you upgrade) and the results can be great. Don't protect a meaningless 15th, let someone else do that, chase a win! 🙂 Attack BEFORE the "difficult" turn, let the pack slow down for the turn while you pick your own, and the fastest line. Yeah I know, easier said then done, but you're a bike racer, what's "easy" got to do with it? I bet that aint a word in your vocabulary! Bon Chance!

CDAKIAHONDA said:

I know it sounds easier than it is, and totally obvious, and someone has to be in the "middle of the pack," and all that, but the correct thinking is getting TO the FRONT, or better yet, getting OFF the front. If I remember right, most Cat 5 riders (Cat 4 and 3 too often, oh hell, all Cats) expect Crits to come to a bunch sprint. Instead of risking your "life" in a meaningless sprint for 15th, risk your "race" on a flyer or two. Hopefully you have team mates who can counter your moves, and you theirs.

You may finish off the back, even get pulled a few times, but you'll stay upright, get some great intensity workouts, perhaps garner a bit of respect, and maybe get a few primes (prizes in the 5s and potentially cash when you upgrade) and the results can be great. Don't protect a meaningless 15th, let someone else do that, chase a win! 🙂 Attack BEFORE the "difficult" turn, let the pack slow down for the turn while you pick your own, and the fastest line. Yeah I know, easier said then done, but you're a bike racer, what's "easy" got to do with it? I bet that aint a word in your vocabulary! Bon Chance!

+1. Good stuff. 🙂

wiredued said:

I was in the middle of a tight cat5 pack going five wide into a difficult turn wondering if I should be risking my life for something like 15th place. Is that correct thinking for a crit?🙂

Given that sharing the road with a single Cat5 rider could be deemed "risking ones life" I think your question should have been "If I've spent the last hour with these guys, why the heck and I thinking about questions like this coming upto the finish?" You should be thinking "what's gonna work the best, 14, 13 or 12 in the sprint?"

WWSKD?

wiredued said:

I was in the middle of a tight cat5 pack going five wide into a difficult turn wondering if I should be risking my life for something like 15th place. Is that correct thinking for a crit?🙂

If you're concerned about your life, you shouldn't be doin' crits in the first place - stick to time trials🙂 . Pros crash frequently in crits too; it's not just a Cat5 phenomena...

Seriously, experience is the best teacher. IMO, the willingness to take those risks (calculated risks, not stupid stuff) the other guy won't will get the results you're after quicker than playing it safe exclusively. I'm fully aware you're disinclined to take a significant risk for 15th place, but I'm not advocating giving up your position either.

Furthermore, I'm not a big fan of the "coast across the finish line because I'm not in the top 5" mentality - especially in a short crit. I'm going sprint (safely) across line and finish as high as I can while giving some effort to finish off the race. My $0.02(CAN) worth...

tonyzackery said:

Furthermore, I'm not a big fan of the "coast across the finish line because I'm not in the top 5" mentality - especially in a short crit. I'm going sprint (safely) across line and finish as high as I can while giving some effort to finish off the race.

Only time I've crashed in a crit was during a preme sprint when the 2 guys in front of me decided to sit up because they were out of contention. At that point I wasn't sprinting for the preme, but rather trying to stay in contact with the strong riders ahead who were. It was definitely my fault for getting tangled up, but in any case, I'd suggest holding one's line and speed during a pack sprint. Either sprinting when no one else is, or sitting up when everyone else is sprinting, is problematic.

wiredued said:

I was in the middle of a tight cat5 pack going five wide into a difficult turn wondering if I should be risking my life for something like 15th place. Is that correct thinking for a crit?🙂

Additionally, since you posted this in the Training section I'll presume you're wondering about what kind of training is necessary in order to extricate yourself from the aforementioned position of being mid-pack going into the sprint.

In my experience, I've had to gain strength in order to position myself better going into the last corner before the sprint - this is where the podium is attained or lost IMO. This strength was obtained by working almost exclusively on deepening my base and increasing FTP so that my legs are fresher once I need to put the hammer down. Now I'm able to start my sprint at 3rd or 4th wheel rather than 8th or 9th wheel as I was last year.

I'm no expert, but increasing FTP should be near the top of every racer's training regimen. I leave my V02max and anaerobic training to the races.

(OT) This is quite curious, you talk about taking cash at some time? In Italy it's strictly forbidden from the law giving cash prizes in amateur races! How much can you earn winning a cat5/4/3 race? (/OT)

When you go sprinting you must do 2 things: 1) ride well and 2) push extremely hard to gain positions. It's difficult to do the two things at the same time... but you must do them if you wanna be in the top 5...the more sprints you do the more you get used to, as said.

Crits shouldn't be that dangerous. If the speed is high, the peloton should ride single file most of the time, and the only real risk of falling is overcooking it in a corner. Here in Holland the strongest crit specialists absolutely leather it on the front, and the bunch gets strung out right from the off. The roads are also normally narrow with tight corners, so everyone knows it's safer this way.

For me, even though crits are really painful, crashing is not something I worry about, unless it is raining.

But I can imagine in the lower categories the speed probably isn't so high, and noone wants to ride hard on the front so it gets crowded. You'll also have the majority of riders all trying to get into a nice position for the sprint, with noone wanting to be on the front, and this can cause mayhem on the last lap. Taking a flyer is good here, but sometimes it can get so swamped that getting through the waves of "sprinters" is not possible.

The only real solution is to upgrade, and leave the newbies and the "never ride on the front, hope the race goes as slow as possible" guys behind, otherwise you'll get this problem a lot.

Sikhandar said:

(OT) This is quite curious, you talk about taking cash at some time? In Italy it's strictly forbidden from the law giving cash prizes in amateur races! How much can you earn winning a cat5/4/3 race? (/OT)

Not much. It will vary by region. Around here, the total prize list (all places added together) might be $200 to $500 US. In very rare occasions or in stage races, as much as $1000. However, in stage races, this amount includes primes. (I don't know the Italian translation but "prime" is the French word for "bonus" or "extra amount", in this case awarded for special sprints.) So the prize for the win in a cat 3 or 4 race is ~$50-$100, on average. There is often merchandise given for prizes too (tires, socks, helmets, etc.)

The masters racers (older than 35 years old) have similar prize lists. Above category 3, the prize lists start increasing. Category 5 (the very beginners) do not get prize money. They changed the rules on this recently but I believe they also can not get merchandise - only medals. I'm too lazy to go check it right now though.