Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial. However, I don't seem to be able to get any. A local chemist says she can't order them any more. There are plenty of websites mentioning runners and cyclists taking them, but where do they get them? Any ideas?
"John Dawson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial. However, I don't seem to be able to get any. A local chemist says she can't order them any more. There are plenty of websites mentioning runners and cyclists taking them, but where do they get them? Any ideas?
The Army abandoned Salt tablets and salt in waterbottles in tropical climes many years ago, after research showed that in actual fact, a normal balanced diet contains all the salt you need. I would suggest that there is something else amiss (unless you DON'T eat a balanced diet......you should never need supplementary salt in temperate climes...)
In message <[email hidden]>, Gordon <[email hidden]> writes
Quoted message said:
"John Dawson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial. However, I don't seem to be able to get any. A local chemist says she can't order them any more. There are plenty of websites mentioning runners and cyclists taking them, but where do they get them? Any ideas?
The Army abandoned Salt tablets and salt in waterbottles in tropical climes many years ago, after research showed that in actual fact, a normal balanced diet contains all the salt you need. I would suggest that there is something else amiss (unless you DON'T eat a balanced diet......you should never need supplementary salt in temperate climes...)
It might help to Stretch the muscled before a walk, also Tonic water containing Quinine will help reduce cramp. Be sure not to dehydrate during a walk. I don't think the isotonic drinks help much, when you sweat it's the water that you lose not the electrolytes. Adding more will only concentrate the electrolytes in your body - unnecessary IMO.
I'm sure - no - certain someone will correct me if I'm wrong. -- Bill Grey
"John Dawson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial. However, I don't seem to be able to get any. A local chemist says she can't order them any more. There are plenty of websites mentioning runners and cyclists taking them, but where do they get them? Any ideas?
The Army abandoned Salt tablets and salt in waterbottles in tropical climes many years ago, after research showed that in actual fact, a normal balanced diet contains all the salt you need. I would suggest that there is something else amiss (unless you DON'T eat a balanced diet......you should never need supplementary salt in temperate climes...)
When we moved to Malta in the early sixties, we were advised to use salt tablets during the summer: one each day... All that first summer, we kept forgetting (being kids!), and came to no harm... The following summer medical advice was not to, as they were causing too many ulcers and seemed to give no benefit.
I would look for the cause of your need for extra salt and get that fixed rather than take salt tabs. -- Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons http://www.katedicey.co.uk Click on Kate's Pages and explore!
Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial.
First time I came across mention of them was on a visit to the Grand Canyon, with all the notices about the dangers of dehydration saying *not* to use salt tablets, which rather suggests their use is deprecated these days.
Note with rehydration powders, not all of them actually contain much salt. While you'd think that's a bit bonkers (and you'd be right IMHO), the problem with salt is that it makes them taste 'orrible when you make them up before you've done exercise, so they tend not to sell so well... So do check the ingredients list.
Pete. -- Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial.
First time I came across mention of them was on a visit to the Grand Canyon, with all the notices about the dangers of dehydration saying *not* to use salt tablets, which rather suggests their use is deprecated these days.
There seems to be a wide misconception about why I want to take them and how much I'm going to consume. In the past year I've suffered cramp twice. The first time was on the Lakeland fells, resolved within minutes with a packet of salted crisps, and second in the Pyrenees where I appeared to solve the problem by adding salt to my main meals, something I don't normally do. It may be that my salt intake is on the low side and that this is the cause of the problem but the medics are constantly warning about excess salt consumption and I don't feel inclined to add salt I may not need. I'm going to sub-Saharan Africa. I have no idea what the food will be like, or what the salt content will be, or whether I'll be able to add salt if I feel I need it. What I want to avoid is being out in the mountains, suffering cramp, knowing what the likely solution is, and not having it available when I need it. If I don't suffer cramp I won't need to take any of the tablets at all, but I'd like them available.
Occasionally when I go out walking I suffer from cramp in my leg muscles. On the most recent occasion I had been out for about five hours had consumed plenty of Go electrolyte drink. A packet of salted crisps sorted out the problem as it has done many times in the past. On one previous occasion I tried a rehydration sachet but this did not resolve the problem. It does appear to be a shortage of NaCl. I'm going abroad next month on a walking holiday where I won't have access to packets of crisps and I thought of taking salt tablets with me for such an emergency, at least as a trial.
First time I came across mention of them was on a visit to the Grand Canyon, with all the notices about the dangers of dehydration saying *not* to use salt tablets, which rather suggests their use is deprecated these days.
There seems to be a wide misconception about why I want to take them and how much I'm going to consume. In the past year I've suffered cramp twice. The first time was on the Lakeland fells, resolved within minutes with a packet of salted crisps, and second in the Pyrenees where I appeared to solve the problem by adding salt to my main meals, something I don't normally do. It may be that my salt intake is on the low side and that this is the cause of the problem but the medics are constantly warning about excess salt consumption and I don't feel inclined to add salt I may not need. I'm going to sub-Saharan Africa. I have no idea what the food will be like, or what the salt content will be, or whether I'll be able to add salt if I feel I need it. What I want to avoid is being out in the mountains, suffering cramp, knowing what the likely solution is, and not having it available when I need it. If I don't suffer cramp I won't need to take any of the tablets at all, but I'd like them available.
John D.
John,
I too got severe cramp a few times in the Lakes when I had been using rehydration drinks *during* a walk. I never got cramp before I started using those drinks whilst walking, and never after I switched back to water. This is a purely empirical observation that I can't substantiate with theory but in my case the correlation was fairly convincing.
I too got severe cramp a few times in the Lakes when I had been using rehydration drinks *during* a walk. I never got cramp before I started using those drinks whilst walking, and never after I switched back to water. This is a purely empirical observation that I can't substantiate with theory but in my case the correlation was fairly convincing.
I don't have such a correlation. I've only recently started using Go and that was an attempt to solve the cramp problem. I can remember an occasion about four years ago doing the Fairfield Horseshoe in snow. I had water on the way up to Fairfield, sweet tea on Fairfield itself and got cramp on the way down. Before anyone starts telling me tea is a diuretic I know. I also know it's such a mild diuretic that its dehydrating effect is tiny compared to the amount of liquid in the drink itself. I want to stress that I get cramp in my legs only maybe once or twice a year. The only correlation I have is that if I get cramp, ingesting NaCl resolves it.
I too got severe cramp a few times in the Lakes when I had been using rehydration drinks *during* a walk. I never got cramp before I started using those drinks whilst walking, and never after I switched back to water. This is a purely empirical observation that I can't substantiate with theory but in my case the correlation was fairly convincing.
I don't have such a correlation. I've only recently started using Go and that was an attempt to solve the cramp problem. I can remember an occasion about four years ago doing the Fairfield Horseshoe in snow. I had water on the way up to Fairfield, sweet tea on Fairfield itself and got cramp on the way down. Before anyone starts telling me tea is a diuretic I know. I also know it's such a mild diuretic that its dehydrating effect is tiny compared to the amount of liquid in the drink itself. I want to stress that I get cramp in my legs only maybe once or twice a year. The only correlation I have is that if I get cramp, ingesting NaCl resolves it.
What about using 'Lo Salt', which has a lot of potassium chloride? My understanding is that we get plenty of sodium salts in out diet, but not necessarily enough potassium, which is essential for nerve function(?).
In message <[email hidden]>, John Dawson <[email hidden]> writes
Quoted message said:
I don't have such a correlation. I've only recently started using Go and that was an attempt to solve the cramp problem. I can remember an occasion about four years ago doing the Fairfield Horseshoe in snow. I had water on the way up to Fairfield, sweet tea on Fairfield itself and got cramp on the way down. Before anyone starts telling me tea is a diuretic I know. I also know it's such a mild diuretic that its dehydrating effect is tiny compared to the amount of liquid in the drink itself. I want to stress that I get cramp in my legs only maybe once or twice a year. The only correlation I have is that if I get cramp, ingesting NaCl resolves it.
I know nothing about the subject (except that my doc has told me very firmly to lay off the salt). Yahoo! Health! has! this! to! say!:
The message <[email hidden]> from Bill Grey <[email hidden]> contains these words:
Quoted message said:
I don't think the isotonic drinks help much, when you sweat it's the water that you lose not the electrolytes. Adding more will only concentrate the electrolytes in your body - unnecessary IMO.
Quoted message said:
I'm sure - no - certain someone will correct me if I'm wrong.
I'm not a doctor - all I know is that when the sweat stings my eyes, and tastes salty, I must be losing salt - I do occasionally get cramp after a hard summer day. I don't go for "scientific" drinks (in PET bottles!!) but drink Lidl's apple juice in 25cl tetra bricks, which usually does the trick.
Surely the "nanny knows best, dear" culture has not actually abolished salt tablets? Maybe go to France where they still sell full fat butter with nice crunchy sea salt crystals all through it! Delicious!
Buffered Salt Tablets is a Nutritional Support for chronic fatigue, muscle cramps and heat prostration. Free shipping on orders over $100, 5% cash back on next purchase. Shop & Save here. www.americarx.com * Salt Tablet $7
Save on Nutrition & Personal Care salt tablet from $7. www.winbuyer.com
In message <[email hidden]>, Jim Ford <[email hidden]> writes
Quoted message said:
John Dawson said:
Stuart Mann said:
John,
I too got severe cramp a few times in the Lakes when I had been using rehydration drinks *during* a walk. I never got cramp before I started using those drinks whilst walking, and never after I switched back to water. This is a purely empirical observation that I can't substantiate with theory but in my case the correlation was fairly convincing.
I don't have such a correlation. I've only recently started using Go and that was an attempt to solve the cramp problem. I can remember an occasion about four years ago doing the Fairfield Horseshoe in snow. I had water on the way up to Fairfield, sweet tea on Fairfield itself and got cramp on the way down. Before anyone starts telling me tea is a diuretic I know. I also know it's such a mild diuretic that its dehydrating effect is tiny compared to the amount of liquid in the drink itself. I want to stress that I get cramp in my legs only maybe once or twice a year. The only correlation I have is that if I get cramp, ingesting NaCl resolves it.
What about using 'Lo Salt', which has a lot of potassium chloride? My understanding is that we get plenty of sodium salts in out diet, but not necessarily enough potassium, which is essential for nerve function(?).
Jim Ford
A geologist friend of mine who worked for a contract in the middle east spoke of some of his colleagues who were advised not to take "ISO" drinks but to take just water to prevent dehydration. -- Bill Grey
Buffered Salt Tablets is a Nutritional Support for chronic fatigue, muscle cramps and heat prostration. Free shipping on orders over $100, 5% cash back on next purchase. Shop & Save here. www.americarx.com * Salt Tablet $7
Save on Nutrition & Personal Care salt tablet from $7. www.winbuyer.com
Some people seem to think they are OK!
Thanks Richard for being the only person to answer my question. This should put me on the right track. A one gramme tablet would be about the same amount of salt than in two packets of crisps and I note the tablets are to be dissolved under the tongue so they can't irritate the stomach, the only reservation I had about using them. Winbuyer refer to the Americarx website so it's the same supplier.
What about using 'Lo Salt', which has a lot of potassium chloride? My understanding is that we get plenty of sodium salts in out diet, but not necessarily enough potassium, which is essential for nerve function(?).
I've been reading a bit about salt recently and apparently the refined salt we eat isn't healthy at all. So I bought some organic sea salt and it tastes way better! I don't know if the health benefits are true, but it seems to make more sense to eat the natural stuff rather than the refined version.
"Refined Salt: White Poison The problem with salt is not the salt itself but the condition of the salt we eat! Our regular table salt no longer has anything in common with the original crystal salt. Salt nowadays is mainly sodium chloride and not salt. With the advent of industrial development, our natural salt was "chemically cleaned" and reduced only to sodium and chloride. Major producing companies dry their salt in huge kilns with temperatures reaching 1200 degrees F, changing he salt's chemical structure, which in turn adversely affects the human body. The common table salt we use for cooking has only 2 or 3 chemical elements. The seawater has 84 chemical elements. For our body to be healthy we need all those elements. When we use the common salt, we are in deficit of 81 elements which means we are somehow contributing to becoming weaker, imbalanced and more susceptible to diseases. Use the seawater salt." http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/salt.htm
It may be that my salt intake is on the low side and that this is the cause of the problem but the medics are constantly warning about excess salt consumption
The problem, as I understand it, is *excess* salt consumption, something which is commonplace nowadays due to all the processed food that most people eat.
But not everyone eats a lot of processed food. I don't anymore, so I see nothing wrong with adding a bit of salt to food now and again.
There seems to be a wide misconception about why I want to take them and how much I'm going to consume.
Is there? The notices in the Grand Canyon are specifically to avoid salt tablets to try and solve problems generated by lack of salt *on a hike*. It's not in any way about dietary excess of salt! While it's true that the notices did not say specifically /why/, my guess is that the concentration from a salt tablet may not be a good way to get it in to your body (concentrations like that aren't natural and your guts haven't evolved to deal with them very well, part of why highly refined sugar isn't a great way to take on carbs when hiking).
Quoted message said:
inclined to add salt I may not need. I'm going to sub-Saharan Africa. I have no idea what the food will be like, or what the salt content will be, or whether I'll be able to add salt if I feel I need it. What I want to avoid is being out in the mountains, suffering cramp, knowing what the likely solution is, and not having it available when I need it. If I don't suffer cramp I won't need to take any of the tablets at all, but I'd like them available.
Why not take some salty rations, which nobody is going out of their way posting notices to say it's a bad idea to use them?
Pete. -- Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
"Peter Clinch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
John Dawson said:
There seems to be a wide misconception about why I want to take them and how much I'm going to consume.
Is there? The notices in the Grand Canyon are specifically to avoid salt tablets to try and solve problems generated by lack of salt *on a hike*. It's not in any way about dietary excess of salt! While it's true that the notices did not say specifically /why/, my guess is that the concentration from a salt tablet may not be a good way to get it in to your body (concentrations like that aren't natural and your guts haven't evolved to deal with them very well, part of why highly refined sugar isn't a great way to take on carbs when hiking).
Quoted message said:
inclined to add salt I may not need. I'm going to sub-Saharan Africa. I have no idea what the food will be like, or what the salt content will be, or whether I'll be able to add salt if I feel I need it. What I want to avoid is being out in the mountains, suffering cramp, knowing what the likely solution is, and not having it available when I need it. If I don't suffer cramp I won't need to take any of the tablets at all, but I'd like them available.
Why not take some salty rations, which nobody is going out of their way posting notices to say it's a bad idea to use them?
Of course you could forget expensive rations, internet bought salt tablets et al. If it's just for emergencies why not take some...errr...salt out of the salt pot at home. Blindingly cheap!!
-- Bob Mannix (anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)
"Refined Salt: White Poison The problem with salt is not the salt itself but the condition of the salt we eat! Our regular table salt no longer has anything in common with the original crystal salt. Salt nowadays is mainly sodium chloride and not salt. With the advent of industrial development, our natural salt was "chemically cleaned" and reduced only to sodium and chloride. Major producing companies dry their salt in huge kilns with temperatures reaching 1200 degrees F, changing he salt's chemical structure, which in turn adversely affects the human body. The common table salt we use for cooking has only 2 or 3 chemical elements. The seawater has 84 chemical elements. For our body to be healthy we need all those elements. When we use the common salt, we are in deficit of 81 elements which means we are somehow contributing to becoming weaker, imbalanced and more susceptible to diseases. Use the seawater salt." http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/salt.htm
Paul
Now, what did you have to go and do that for? I had this lovely Weston and Armstrong [censored] detector, five-and-a-half jewels, gallium arsenide mirror, triple expansion; ruined! Needle's wrapped three times round the endstop . . . . .
In message <[email hidden]>, Alan Dicey <[email hidden]> writes
Quoted message said:
Paul Saunders said:
"Refined Salt: White Poison The problem with salt is not the salt itself but the condition of the salt we eat! Our regular table salt no longer has anything in common with the original crystal salt. Salt nowadays is mainly sodium chloride and not salt. With the advent of industrial development, our natural salt was "chemically cleaned" and only to sodium and chloride. Major producing companies dry their salt in huge kilns with temperatures reaching 1200 degrees F, changing he salt's chemical structure, which in turn adversely affects the human body. The common table salt we use for cooking has only 2 or 3 chemical elements. The seawater has 84 chemical elements. For our body to be healthy we need all those elements. When we use the common salt, we are in deficit of 81 elements which means we are somehow contributing to becoming weaker, imbalanced and more susceptible to diseases. Use the seawater salt." http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/salt.htm Paul
Now, what did you have to go and do that for? I had this lovely Weston and Armstrong [censored] detector, five-and-a-half jewels, gallium arsenide mirror, triple expansion; ruined! Needle's wrapped three times round the endstop . . . . .
The Black Duck says "The quacking noise is deafening. This web site is riddled with loosely defined terms and possibly pseudoscientific language with a quite a bit of alternative medicine flim flam. It is full of scientific jargon that is out of place and probably doesn't know the meaning of any of the terms. Using lots of physics terms like this rarely has any meaning outside of physics books. It shows little or no sceptical awareness and so should be treated with caution!"
BTW I love the bit about the [censored] detector, I wish I'd said that. I probably will soon.......
