Ti Fork?

DougA said:

Any idea why this magic material has not been used for forks? Could it be
not stiff enough?

That's pretty much it. If you make a ti fork as stiff as a steel or
carbon, then its weighs a ton. I am not aware of any ti fork that is
light enough to compete with carbon. I believe the lightest one I saw
was like 500 or 600g, which is very heavy!

I've recall an italian or eastern european mfr who use to make a ti
frame and offered a ti fork. The price for the frameset was insane,
like $10,000, and that was back in the early 90s.

If you really "gots to have one," I believe Calfee use to sell a ti
fork for his cyclocross frame. You may want to contact him.

bfd said:

DougA said:

Any idea why this magic material has not been used for forks? Could it be
not stiff enough?

That's pretty much it. If you make a ti fork as stiff as a steel or
carbon, then its weighs a ton. I am not aware of any ti fork that is
light enough to compete with carbon. I believe the lightest one I saw
was like 500 or 600g, which is very heavy!

I've recall an italian or eastern european mfr who use to make a ti
frame and offered a ti fork. The price for the frameset was insane,
like $10,000, and that was back in the early 90s.

If you really "gots to have one," I believe Calfee use to sell a ti
fork for his cyclocross frame. You may want to contact him.

Stiffness isn't the issue. Sibex makes ti forks for cross and
mountain bikes
http://www.sibexsports.com/forks.htm
The cross fork is within 60g of Alpha Q's carbon cross fork, which is
even more expensive. The problem with making a lightweight road fork
is that the crown would have to be forged instead of welded, which is
a real [censored] with titanium.

Quoted message said:

The problem with making a lightweight road fork is that the crown
would have to be forged instead of welded, which is a real [censored]
with titanium.

Current Columbus EL forks are TIG welded unicrown, wouldn't that be
an option for Ti as well?

--
MfG/Best regards
helmut springer panta rhei

DougA said:

Any idea why this magic material has not been used for forks? Could it be
not stiff enough?

Been done many times; Speedwell, Teledyne, Panasonic Sumitomo Mory etc.
Steel may be a better choice but Ti is certainly possible. The jointing
techniques available at the crown aren't favorable to Ti.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

bfd said:

DougA said:

Any idea why this magic material has not been used for forks? Could it be
not stiff enough?

That's pretty much it. If you make a ti fork as stiff as a steel or
carbon, then its weighs a ton. I am not aware of any ti fork that is
light enough to compete with carbon. I believe the lightest one I saw
was like 500 or 600g, which is very heavy!

I've recall an italian or eastern european mfr who use to make a ti
frame and offered a ti fork.

Morati for the titanium fork.

The price for the frameset was insane,

Quoted message said:

like $10,000, and that was back in the early 90s.

If you really "gots to have one," I believe Calfee use to sell a ti
fork for his cyclocross frame. You may want to contact him.

Helmut Springer said:

Quoted message said:

The problem with making a lightweight road fork is that the crown
would have to be forged instead of welded, which is a real [censored]
with titanium.

Current Columbus EL forks are TIG welded unicrown, wouldn't that be
an option for Ti as well?

--
MfG/Best regards
helmut springer panta rhei

Welded unicrown is an option, but the narrower the tire clearance the
heavier it ends up compared to forged. Nothing about a titanium road
fork would be special enough to go over 100g heavier than carbon at a
significant cost penalty. On the mountain bike end, the Sibex fork is
one of the lightest out there.

DougA said:

Any idea why this magic material has not been used for forks? Could it be
not stiff enough?

It isn't magic.

It is used for forks.

Stick one in this troll, it's done.

Actually, you could make a tubular fork crown easily and weld it, like
all raleigh 3-speeds made from 1920-1990. Mitering would be fairly
minimal. It seems like sibex hasn't exatly figured that out, yet ...

http://www.sibexsports.com/forks.htm

- Don Gillies
San Diego, CA

Donald Gillies said:

Actually, you could make a tubular fork crown easily and weld it, like
all raleigh 3-speeds made from 1920-1990. Mitering would be fairly
minimal. It seems like sibex hasn't exatly figured that out, yet ...

http://www.sibexsports.com/forks.htm

You should cut one in half sometime.
http://www.yellowjersey.org/THIMBLE.JPG

The Raleigh 'thimble fork' design relies on a deep dip-brazed internal
contact below the crown. A simple welded copy with reasonably light
material will fail as many hasty copies did.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

A Muzi said:

DougA said:

Any idea why this magic material has not been used for forks? Could
it be not stiff enough?

Been done many times; Speedwell, Teledyne, Panasonic Sumitomo Mory etc.
Steel may be a better choice but Ti is certainly possible. The jointing
techniques available at the crown aren't favorable to Ti.

absolutely.

In article <[email hidden]>,

A Muzi said:

Donald Gillies said:

Actually, you could make a tubular fork crown easily and weld it, like
all raleigh 3-speeds made from 1920-1990. Mitering would be fairly
minimal. It seems like sibex hasn't exatly figured that out, yet ...

http://www.sibexsports.com/forks.htm

You should cut one in half sometime.
http://www.yellowjersey.org/THIMBLE.JPG

What is that round piece interior to the "crown?"

Quoted message said:

The Raleigh 'thimble fork' design relies on a deep dip-brazed internal
contact below the crown. A simple welded copy with reasonably light
material will fail as many hasty copies did.

--
Michael Press

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Donald Gillies said:

Actually, you could make a tubular fork crown easily and weld it, like
all raleigh 3-speeds made from 1920-1990. Mitering would be fairly
minimal. It seems like sibex hasn't exatly figured that out, yet ...
http://www.sibexsports.com/forks.htm

Quoted message said:

A Muzi said:

You should cut one in half sometime.
http://www.yellowjersey.org/THIMBLE.JPG

Michael Press said:

What is that round piece interior to the "crown?"

Quoted message said:

A Muzi said:

The Raleigh 'thimble fork' design relies on a deep dip-brazed internal
contact below the crown. A simple welded copy with reasonably light
material will fail as many hasty copies did.

Remember the small cute Raleigh decals "The All Steel Bicycle"? Raleigh
developed pressed steel bottom brackets, lugs and crowns to replace the
prior sand-cast iron fittings (CCM for example was still using cast iron
BBs through the 1950s)

The famous 'thimble crown' looks as if the fork blades are tenuously
hanging from a horizontal pipe. In fact the outer piece slips deep into
the blades, the column goes right through that and there's another steel
liner inside, as you note. These are rumored to be 'dip brazed' and the
Raleigh salesmen pushed that 'feature' but despite searching I saw no
such operation at Nottingham in 1973. Who knows?

It is rare to see one of these forks fail for any reason including
second and third crashes after repeated alignments. I've never seen one
with a brazing error, although Nottingham Raleighs in general have about
the same rate as other Euro mass-market frames. Seat stay tops, mostly:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/fixstay.html
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971