I just watched a Total Immersion video

Pat said:

am I seeing it wrong, or do they swim with their heads totally underwater in
TI? I was trying to see if they breathe on both sides, but that apparently
is an individual preference. It just looked to me as if in the front crawl
their heads were totally underwater except when it came time to breathe.

Also, on the kicking drills, every person's toes pointed inward. I have
noticed that with my own feet. I guess this is just part of kicking
underwater.

Pat in TX

The head down thing is something that many have disagree with Terry
Laughin. I kind of like TI as a tool for teaching beginners. Except
for the idea that people need to swim with the heads underwater. They
argue that pushing the head under water will raise their lower body
and also will make them more aerodynamic. Problem is they can't see
where they are going and ultimately, the head does not remain under
water all the time. I have a friend who is a triathlete and she went
to a TI camp and learned to swim with her head facing down. She swims
with a stiff back and is convinced that swimming with her head down
will keep her body balanced. She even told me that she was going to
swim with a tennis ball under her chin. She still drags her legs and
kicks way to much. Overall, she improved a lot with the TI camp. But,
she can't keep her butt up and she always looks down. She doesn't
accept coaching from anyone else.

Looking at proficient swimmers they don't swim with their heads
completely immersed or looking down. There is a variation among
swimmers, but the head relaxed looking slightly forward seems to be a
good compromise.

The better swimmers have a good arch in their lower backs bringing
both the shoulders and the butt up. The lower back arch is what keeps
the legs from sinking and each swimmer keeps the head somewhere where
they are comfortable. Bending the neck to look forward or down does
not disrupt the momentum of a good swimmer. Swimmers need to learn to
have a good back arch, point the toes back, keep their shoulders and
butt high in the water, and the head lose and relaxed.

I assume that we were talking about front crawl.

Andres

On 17 Jun,

Quoted post said:

Looking at proficient swimmers they don't swim with their heads
completely immersed or looking down. There is a variation among
swimmers, but the head relaxed looking slightly forward seems to be a
good compromise.

That's what I teach, keeping the head in a relaxed position. As a teaching
point keep half the head in the water. Which half depends on where in the
breathing cycle it is.

--
BD
Change lycos to yahoo to reply

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Looking at proficient swimmers they don't swim with their heads
completely immersed or looking down. There is a variation among
swimmers, but the head relaxed looking slightly forward seems to be a
good compromise.

That's what I teach, keeping the head in a relaxed position. As a
teaching
point keep half the head in the water. Which half depends on where in the
breathing cycle it is.

--
BD

I don't swim the front crawl with my head underwater nor do I plan to adopt
that posture. I always thought that I was using the water to support my
heavy head so that my neck could be more relaxed. It seems to me that if one
forces the head down then that causes excess energy use for something that
isn't necessary.

Pat in TX

Quoted post said:

Looking at proficient swimmers they don't swim with their heads
completely immersed or looking down. There is a variation among
swimmers, but the head relaxed looking slightly forward seems to be a
good compromise.

Quoted message said:

I assume that we were talking about front crawl.

Andres

Swimming with head submersed is easier and more relaxing. One less
disconfort when learning to swim.

Quoted message said:

Swimming with head submersed is easier and more relaxing. One less
disconfort when learning to swim.

Please explain. If you have to hold your head underwater, how could it be
easier than just letting the water support your head? You are using muscles
and energy to force the head downward.

How can it be "one less discomfort" if it is something you have to
consciously think about the entire time?

Why do you say it is a "discomfort" anyway? Letting the water support my
head isn't a discomfort in any way--it just seems natural.

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Nelson said:

Swimming with head submersed is easier and more relaxing. One less
disconfort when learning to swim.

I just tried swimming with my head underwater. I had to do extra work
to do it, so it can't be easier and more relaxed. It was unnatural for
me. The natural position for my head is on the surface, with the water
hitting me at about the forehead level most of the time.

Pat said:

Quoted message said:

Swimming with head submersed is easier and more relaxing. One less
disconfort when learning to swim.

Please explain. If you have to hold your head underwater, how could it be
easier than just letting the water support your head? You are using muscles
and energy to force the head downward.

I don´t have to hold my head underwater. My head, neck, and back
muscles are relaxed.
No energy required! That is my meaning of relaxed!
In contrast to open-water events, for instance, when looking front and
head-out-of-water
are more important or even essential.

Quoted message said:

How can it be "one less discomfort" if it is something you have to
consciously think about the entire time?

I don´t have to consciously think about it the entire time.
Maybe we are different persons with different bodies.
Maybe you get nervous when your head is submersed.

Quoted message said:

Why do you say it is a "discomfort" anyway? Letting the water support my
head isn't a discomfort in any way--it just seems natural.

The possible unconfortable thing about a overly submersed
head is that one can't see front at all, but the same happens
in backstroke, not a problem in pool swimming.

Nelson

Quoted message said:

Pat in TX

Nelson said:

The possible unconfortable thing about a overly submersed
head is that one can't see front at all, but the same happens
in backstroke, not a problem in pool swimming.

I think what was meant about it being uncomfortable is that holding
your head underwater requires holding it out of alignment with the
body, which is uncomfortable. When I swim crawl stroke with my head
relaxed, it is on the surface, meaning that the surface of the water
breaks across the top of my forehead. When you talk about the head
being underwater, I think of it being completely underwater. It isn't
possible for me to swim crawl that way without having to force my head
down.

Quoted message said:

Please explain. If you have to hold your head underwater, how could it be
easier than just letting the water support your head? You are using
muscles
and energy to force the head downward.

I don´t have to hold my head underwater. My head, neck, and back
muscles are relaxed.
No energy required! That is my meaning of relaxed!
In contrast to open-water events, for instance, when looking front and
head-out-of-water
are more important or even essential.

I am not doing any open water events. In the pool, when my upper body
muscles are relaxed, my heat floats (probably due to sinuses). I have to
force it under if I want it submerged. I let the water support it and then
just turn to the side to breathe.