Hey Andy Gout Cure?

Sarah said...

Quoted message said:

After reading your post yesterday, what should be in the news but a way

to

Quoted message said:

avoid gout! http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/6690595.stm
Sounds a painful complaint!

Sarah

Sarah,

Someone else posted this as well. It seems a bit too general to be
convincing.

Why did my podiatrist's plan involve lowering caffeine, just days ago?

Maybe it's only just two opposite extremes that makes me wonder "WHAT???"

I drink maybe a handful of cups of coffee a year.

"The latest research looked at the eating habits of 14,000 men and women
between 1988 and 1994."

Is that a valid study? 6 years of data, over 12 years old?? WHAT TOOK SO
LONG to report their findings??

I'm too new to gout to make an informed decision from this brief report.
I'd like a second opinion. 🙁 [throwing hands in the air]

Still, thanks for the FYI,

Andy

Andy said:

Why did my podiatrist's plan involve lowering caffeine, just days ago?

Short answer -- it's not the caffeine that does it; that was stated in
the report. Tea doesn't have the same effect.

--
Dan Goodman
"You, each of you, have some special wild cards. Play with them.
Find out what makes you different and better. Because it is there,
if only you can find it." Vernor Vinge, _Rainbows End_
Journal http://dsgood.livejournal.com
Futures http://dangoodman.livejournal.com
Links http://del.icio.us/dsgood

Andy q said:

Sarah said...

Quoted message said:

After reading your post yesterday, what should be in the news but a way

to

Quoted message said:

avoid gout! http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/6690595.stm
Sounds a painful complaint!

Sarah

Sarah,

Someone else posted this as well. It seems a bit too general to be
convincing.

Why did my podiatrist's plan involve lowering caffeine, just days ago?

Maybe it's only just two opposite extremes that makes me wonder "WHAT???"

I drink maybe a handful of cups of coffee a year.

"The latest research looked at the eating habits of 14,000 men and women
between 1988 and 1994."

Is that a valid study? 6 years of data, over 12 years old?? WHAT TOOK SO
LONG to report their findings??

I'm too new to gout to make an informed decision from this brief report.
I'd like a second opinion. 🙁 [throwing hands in the air]

Still, thanks for the FYI,

Andy, once you start reading about gout you'll find out that
EVERYTHING can contibute to gout except maybe water (they covrered
their bases well). So, you're stuck with the old process of
elimination method to figure out what triggers *your* gout. Think of
it as a food allergy, then figure out what you're allergic to. Think
in terms of previous days, not just hours.

--
See return address to reply by email

Dan Goodman said...

Quoted message said:

Andy said:

Why did my podiatrist's plan involve lowering caffeine, just days ago?

Short answer -- it's not the caffeine that does it; that was stated in
the report. Tea doesn't have the same effect.

Shorter reply -- The information stated in the article is pure conjecture.

Andy

said...

Quoted message said:

Andy, once you start reading about gout you'll find out that
EVERYTHING can contibute to gout except maybe water (they covrered
their bases well). So, you're stuck with the old process of
elimination method to figure out what triggers *your* gout. Think of
it as a food allergy, then figure out what you're allergic to. Think
in terms of previous days, not just hours.

sf,

That's been the bulk of my aggravation these past three days!!! Not that I
don't know HOW to diet, rather it's the extended time of "eliminating trigger
foods" as you said. It could take months.

I want the uric-acid reducing meds, dammit! <--- gout pout 🙁

Andy

Andy said:

Dan Goodman said...

Quoted message said:

Andy said:

Why did my podiatrist's plan involve lowering caffeine, just days

ago?

Quoted message said:

Short answer -- it's not the caffeine that does it; that was stated
in the report. Tea doesn't have the same effect.

Shorter reply -- The information stated in the article is pure
conjecture.

Not _pure_ conjecture. Scientific research.

Other studies might or might not show similar results. If the results
hold up, sooner or later it will be determined what in the coffee has
the desired effect.

--
Dan Goodman
"You, each of you, have some special wild cards. Play with them.
Find out what makes you different and better. Because it is there,
if only you can find it." Vernor Vinge, _Rainbows End_
Journal http://dsgood.livejournal.com
Futures http://dangoodman.livejournal.com
Links http://del.icio.us/dsgood

In article <[email hidden]>, Andy <q> says...

Quoted message said:

said...

Quoted message said:

Andy, once you start reading about gout you'll find out that
EVERYTHING can contibute to gout except maybe water (they covrered
their bases well). So, you're stuck with the old process of
elimination method to figure out what triggers *your* gout. Think of
it as a food allergy, then figure out what you're allergic to. Think
in terms of previous days, not just hours.

sf,

That's been the bulk of my aggravation these past three days!!! Not that I
don't know HOW to diet, rather it's the extended time of "eliminating trigger
foods" as you said. It could take months.

I want the uric-acid reducing meds, dammit! <--- gout pout 🙁

Andy

There is a lot of good advice in this thread.

Instead of allopurinol, which reduces uric acid production, I take
probenecid, which increases its elimination.
I have also used colchchine, during severe attacks, and another poster
mentioned indocin, which I also considered the "magic bullet" in severe
attacks.

Probenecid (and allopurinol) are taken daily. they may cause an attack
initially! As others have said, stay well hydrated. I hadn't had a
attack in ten years until I became dehydrated during another illness.

Dave S

Dan Goodman said...

Quoted message said:

Andy said:

Dan Goodman said...

Quoted message said:

Andy wrote:

> Why did my podiatrist's plan involve lowering caffeine, just days

ago?

Quoted message said:

Short answer -- it's not the caffeine that does it; that was stated
in the report. Tea doesn't have the same effect.

Shorter reply -- The information stated in the article is pure
conjecture.

Not _pure_ conjecture. Scientific research.

When they use words like "may" and "suggests" there's nothing to talk
about. If they use words like "does" and "proves" then we have something to
debate.

Where are the statistics? Timeline graphs, gender specific studies, control
group results? How was the data collected, in informal sidewalk surveys
over six years, or did they follow the same 14,000 men and women for six
years. Does the thought of drinking 4 or more cups of coffee to prevent
gout not present it's own set of problems regarding caffeine?

Without reading the actual report, it IS pure speculation. Maybe there is
science in the report but where is it?

Andy

"Dave S" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

There is a lot of good advice in this thread.

Instead of allopurinol, which reduces uric acid production, I take
probenecid, which increases its elimination.
I have also used colchchine, during severe attacks, and another poster
mentioned indocin, which I also considered the "magic bullet" in severe
attacks.

Probenecid (and allopurinol) are taken daily. they may cause an attack
initially! As others have said, stay well hydrated. I hadn't had a
attack in ten years until I became dehydrated during another illness.

I have suffered gout attacks for about 20 years now, and I'm only 42. For
years I didn't have any problems and then in recent months I've had attacks
that lasted for weeks. I got on allopurinal after not having taken it for
about 5 years and have had no problems since. Indocin and Indomethicin don't
remove or prevent uric acid (I'm pretty sure) but they do work wonders on
reducing inflammation. Reducing the inflammation is typically the first step
in alleviating a gout attack.

One thing that I've learned is to drink LOTS of water every day. Hydration
has an immediate effect on triggering gout - at least for me. Good luck for
anyone trying to deal with this. It's a terrible thing that seems to get
only a smirk or laugh when you tell someone you're having an attack. If only
the person laughing could feel the pain they wouldn't think it's so damn
funny.

In article <[email hidden]>, Andy <q> says...

Quoted message said:

said...

Quoted message said:

Andy, once you start reading about gout you'll find out that
EVERYTHING can contibute to gout except maybe water (they covrered
their bases well). So, you're stuck with the old process of
elimination method to figure out what triggers *your* gout. Think of
it as a food allergy, then figure out what you're allergic to. Think
in terms of previous days, not just hours.

sf,

That's been the bulk of my aggravation these past three days!!! Not that I
don't know HOW to diet, rather it's the extended time of "eliminating trigger
foods" as you said. It could take months.

I want the uric-acid reducing meds, dammit! <--- gout pout 🙁

Andy

There is a lot of good advice in this thread.

I take probenecid, which increases uric acid elimination, allopurinol
reduces its production. These are taken daily, not for an acute attack.

At least initially, they may cause acute attacks!

Like another poster I think indocin is the "magic bullet" during an
acute attack. High doses of ibuprofen work too.
I also used colchicine, which reduced swelling in my feet.

I had no acute attacks in ten years until I became dehydrated during a
brief illness.

I follow no special diet, avoid no trigger foods.

Dave S

Andy said:

Without reading the actual report, it IS pure speculation.
Maybe there is science in the report but where is it?

With regard to caffeine, there are two issues:

a) in some people, caffeine is a powerful diuretic
(provokes urination). In some gout cases this
could be good, but in some cases this could be
very bad (e.g. cases in which urine generation is
inhibited by ureter obstruction due to stones).

b) caffeine is a nitrogenous compund. Therefore,
it contributes to the load of organic nitrogen
that must be eliminated through the kidneys and
urine.

I think the amount of load on the kidneys from
caffeine is small, compared to the stimulant
psychoactive effect. I would be surprised if
drinking a cup or two of strong coffee had any
significant bad effect on gout, due to the load
from the caffeine.

But I am not a doctor, and I am certainly not
_your_ doctor. The next time you discuss this
with your doctor, you could ask him why he
wants to reduce the amount of caffeine in your
diet. If it were entirely due to the fact
that caffeine contributes to the nitrogenous
load on your kidneys, I'd suggest that you
ask him whether that is any different than the
load from eating protein or nucleic acids.

If giving up a slice of cheese balances out
two cups of coffee, ask him whether that
compensates for the coffee. I think that
following a nitrogen-depeleted diet (minimal
protein and nucleic acids) should be the best
approach, and the small amount of contribution
of nitrogen from caffeine would not affect
your result at all. But ask your doctor.

Davlo said:

One thing that I've learned is to drink LOTS of water every day.
Hydration has an immediate effect on triggering gout - at least for me.
Good luck for anyone trying to deal with this. It's a terrible thing that
seems to get only a smirk or laugh when you tell someone you're having
an attack. If only the person laughing could feel the pain
they wouldn't think it's so damn funny.

That's for sure. When I quit drinking beer, I ran into
a series of minor gout warning signs, which did not
go away until I increased my water consumption to match
my previous beer consumption.

(Yes, there are warning signs of incipient gout which
you will learn to recognize, if you are often at risk.)

Quoted message said:

I had no acute attacks in ten years until I became dehydrated during a
brief illness.

I follow no special diet, avoid no trigger foods.

Dave S- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Diuretic pills will/can cause gout of the big toe (and probably other
places.) This stands to reason that becoming dehydrated can cause
gout. I take HCTZ for high blood pressure and will get a little gout
in my big toe occasionally, but it does run in my family, so I expect
it.

I do have a problem with red meat that will cause the inside of my
knees to feel gouty, but only then. This, too runs in my family.
Dee

Andy q said:

When they use words like "may" and "suggests" there's nothing to talk
about. If they use words like "does" and "proves" then we have something to
debate.

Gout can be caused by a medication you take. Hubby cut out one med
that apparently is known for causing gout and his attacks subsided
dramatically.

--
See return address to reply by email

<sf> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Andy q said:

When they use words like "may" and "suggests" there's nothing to talk
about. If they use words like "does" and "proves" then we have something
to
debate.

Gout can be caused by a medication you take. Hubby cut out one med
that apparently is known for causing gout and his attacks subsided
dramatically.

Lots of people take diuretics, for blood pressure and other reasons.
And they tend to cause it.