IM training question

Hi Tom,

I might be able to help guide you along. First I need to know how much time you have for training
each week. Your current level and planned max allowance. Actually, finishing is doable on very
little training but you must ration your effort and never over extend during any part of the event.
Winning your age group is another story.

Ken @ Kauai

"Tom Henderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OK, I'm a week and a day from signing up for IMFL. My training plans for the coming year include a
half marathon, probably a marathon early in the year, a 3.4 mile OW swim that I do every year, and
at least a couple of century rides, either on my own or as part of an organized century. My goal
will be simply to complete an IM distance race.

So the first of about 10,000 questions I'll probably post here in the coming year is: As my rides,
runs, and swims get longer, I'll be able to roughly estimate my finishing time on a good day,
barring any race-day complications. Obviously I need to be 17 hours or faster. Also obviously, I
should plan for a "no complications" race day. I might feel bad that day, weather can always be a
big factor, equipment issues can cause delays on the course, etc. So, the question is, when should
I start feeling like a finish is pretty likely? When my estimated time is down to 16 hours? 15?

Don't get me wrong, if I find on race day that I can finish in 9 hours, I'll do it! What I'm
worried about is the more realistic possibility that my pace over that distance appears to be
close to the edge. When can I feel more comfortable about being able to make it?

Tom

Tom Henderson said:

So the first of about 10,000 questions I'll probably post here in the coming year is: As my rides,
runs, and swims get longer, I'll be able to roughly estimate my finishing time on a good day,
barring any race-day complications.

I find that this is a very precarious way to estimate finishing time. Just because I can
swim 2.4 miles in X time, Bike 112 mi in "Y" time and run 26.2 miles in "Z" time does not
mean I can do
2.4,112,26.2 in "X","Y","Z" time or any real factor thereof. Instead of doing doing one of the
century rides or marathons why not do a 1/2 IM earlier or mid season. IMHO this will give you a
much more accurate representation of finishing time than a compilation of the three seperate
sports. Even doing the 1/2 you still have, heat, course, bad day etc that will affect your time.

Quoted message said:

Obviously I need to be 17 hours or faster. Also obviously, I should plan for a "no complications"
race day. I might feel bad that day, weather can always be a big factor, equipment issues can
cause delays on the course, etc. So, the question is, when should I start feeling like a finish is
pretty likely? When my estimated time is down to 16 hours? 15?

Not trying to be flip here but why worry about it. Are you training to "just make it under
the finish line" or are you training to do the best you can? Are you going to train
differently as soon as you're "pretty confident" you're going to make it? I suggest laying
out a workout plan you think is feasible according to were you're at right now and will be
something that you think will accomplish your goals of finishing. Do the best training you
can. Come race day you do the best you can. Either you make it or you don't, either way you
end up knowing you gave it your best effort.

Quoted message said:

Don't get me wrong, if I find on race day that I can finish in 9 hours, I'll do it! What I'm
worried about is the more realistic possibility that my pace over that distance appears to be close
to the edge. When can I feel more comfortable about being able to make it?

I'll probably get in trouble for this but, what is your reasoning for being so close to the edge?
I obviously know nothing about you or your training and it may very well be that a 17 hour IM is
the true edge of your abilities. In that case I'd say go for it do the best you can and don't
worry about it. OTOH what if you put an IM off for this year and spent two years training maybe
doing a couple of 1/2's this year, do you think your concern would still be as great? Most
everyone that starts an IM has a little bit of that fear of not making the cut off for some
reason. But why make it worse if an additional year of experiance and training could very well
quell a majority of those fears?

~Matt

Quoted message said:

Tom

In article <[email hidden]>, Tom Henderson

Quoted message said:

OK, I'm a week and a day from signing up for IMFL. My training plans for the coming year include a
half marathon, probably a marathon early in the year, a 3.4 mile OW swim that I do every year, and
at least a couple of century rides, either on my own or as part of an organized century. My goal
will be simply to complete an IM distance race.

So the first of about 10,000 questions I'll probably post here in the coming year is: As my rides,
runs, and swims get longer, I'll be able to roughly estimate my finishing time on a good day,
barring any race-day complications. Obviously I need to be 17 hours or faster. Also obviously, I
should plan for a "no complications" race day. I might feel bad that day, weather can always be a
big factor, equipment issues can cause delays on the course, etc. So, the question is, when should
I start feeling like a finish is pretty likely? When my estimated time is down to 16 hours? 15?

Don't get me wrong, if I find on race day that I can finish in 9 hours, I'll do it! What I'm
worried about is the more realistic possibility that my pace over that distance appears to be
close to the edge. When can I feel more comfortable about being able to make it?

I can tell you from (recent) experience that if you can make the swim and bike cutoff times you can
walk most of the marathon and still finish. I finished the bike at IM Wisconsin at about 4:45 p.m.
and ran not so much of the Marathon, but I finished at 16:25. I'll e-mail you my race report to give
you an idea what it was like for a back-of-pack first timer.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night, and party every day. Then it was every other day. . . ."

- Homer J. Simpson

I have finished at IMFL in 2001 and 2002. I am a back of the pack racer as well. I like it back
there because I don't have to kill myself and I was there just to finish the race both times. I,
too, will be signing up in a week for IMFL 2004. Looking to go under 12 hours. 2002 was awful
due to the lovely thunderstorms rocking the ocean and on the bike. Got a little tired of water
after 16 hours.

Train hard and see you in 2004.

Jason Watson IMFL 01, 02

"Tom Henderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OK, I'm a week and a day from signing up for IMFL. My training plans for the coming year include a
half marathon, probably a marathon early in the year, a 3.4 mile OW swim that I do every year, and
at least a couple of century rides, either on my own or as part of an organized century. My goal
will be simply to complete an IM distance race.

So the first of about 10,000 questions I'll probably post here in the coming year is: As my rides,
runs, and swims get longer, I'll be able to roughly estimate my finishing time on a good day,
barring any race-day complications. Obviously I need to be 17 hours or faster. Also obviously, I
should plan for a "no complications" race day. I might feel bad that day, weather can always be a
big factor, equipment issues can cause delays on the course, etc. So, the question is, when should
I start feeling like a finish is pretty likely? When my estimated time is down to 16 hours? 15?

Don't get me wrong, if I find on race day that I can finish in 9 hours, I'll do it! What I'm
worried about is the more realistic possibility that my pace over that distance appears to be
close to the edge. When can I feel more comfortable about being able to make it?

Tom

Tom Henderson <[email hidden]> wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Also obviously, I should plan for a "no complications" race day.

Just noticed this typo. Should be "I shouldn't plan"...

I wish I had a 3.4 mile swim in me.....

Good luck, Tom. You will probably surprise yourself.

--
Aaron M. Staebell St. Peters, Missouri

about 1/2 mile to go in the run, then you know you've got it

BD

[email hidden] (MJuric) wrote in news:3fa405d3.1205741224 @netnews.insightbb.com:

Quoted message said:

I find that this is a very precarious way to estimate finishing time. Just because I can swim
2.4 miles in X time, Bike 112 mi in "Y" time and run 26.2 miles in "Z" time does not mean I
can do
2.4,112,26.2 in "X","Y","Z" time or any real factor thereof. Instead of doing doing one of the
century rides or marathons why not do a 1/2 IM earlier or mid season. IMHO this will give you a
much more accurate representation of finishing time than a compilation of the three seperate
sports. Even doing the 1/2 you still have, heat, course, bad day etc that will affect your time.

Agree with everything you say here. I neglected to mention that I've done GCT 3 times, which shares
much of the same course and has much warmer temps than IMFL. Based on this I can tell to some degree
how my workout times will relate to race-day times, particularly on that course. I'd do GCT again
this year, but I owe several Moms in my life a weekend away from GCT. Disney would be perfect, but
isn't in the budget.

Thanks,

Tom

Harold Buck <[email hidden]> wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I can tell you from (recent) experience that if you can make the swim and bike cutoff times you
can walk most of the marathon and still finish. I finished the bike at IM Wisconsin at about 4:45
p.m. and ran not so much of the Marathon, but I finished at 16:25. I'll e-mail you my race report
to give you an idea what it was like for a back-of-pack first timer.

--Harold Buck

Thanks Harold,

I got the race report, but had already read it when you first posted it. The last couple of years at
IMFL after I was done in the transition area, I rode my mountain bike out on the run course. Seeing
all those folks struggling along in the dark always seemed a bit eerie to me. Doesn't it get a bit
lonely, or are you so absorbed in putting one foot in front of the other that you don't notice?

Tom

"astaebell" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:vqg930r7717be6 @corp.supernews.com:

Quoted message said:

I wish I had a 3.4 mile swim in me.....

Good luck, Tom. You will probably surprise yourself.

Thanks. The problem is I've never ridden further than 65 miles on a bike! Obviously that will be my
focus this year, since the bike has such a dramatic impact on the overall race.

In article <[email hidden]>, Tom Henderson

Quoted message said:

I got the race report, but had already read it when you first posted it. The last couple of
years at IMFL after I was done in the transition area, I rode my mountain bike out on the run
course. Seeing all those folks struggling along in the dark always seemed a bit eerie to me.
Doesn't it get a bit lonely, or are you so absorbed in putting one foot in front of the other
that you don't notice?

It was *very* social. There were lots of other people out there, and I'd just match pace with
someone and we'd talk. We'd keep each other focused. I walked (and rand some) with a bunch of
different people. We'd often get separated (due to my frequent bathroom breaks) and then meet up
again later. But, no, it wasn't lonely at all.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night, and party every day. Then it was every other day. . . ."

- Homer J. Simpson

In article <[email hidden]>, Tom Henderson

Quoted message said:

"astaebell" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:vqg930r7717be6 @corp.supernews.com:

Quoted message said:

I wish I had a 3.4 mile swim in me.....

Good luck, Tom. You will probably surprise yourself.

Thanks. The problem is I've never ridden further than 65 miles on a bike! Obviously that will be
my focus this year, since the bike has such a dramatic impact on the overall race.

A year before my first Ironman, I hadn't done more than 62.5, so I think it should be doable for
you. One thing that helped me was that I signed up for a century charity ride for 3 months before my
race so I knew I'd get my first 100+ mile ride in early in the season. I then tried to do a century
ever 3-4 weeks.

The other important thing is to make sure you train hard for hills if there will be any on the
course--but I think you said you were doing IM Floreda (intentionally misspelling; Simpsons
Reference), in which case never mind.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night, and party every day. Then it was every other day. . . ."

- Homer J. Simpson

"Tom Henderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >

Quoted message said:

Thanks. The problem is I've never ridden further than 65 miles on a bike! Obviously that will be
my focus this year, since the bike has such a dramatic impact on the overall race.

Tom, Just go out and start doing the 100's rather early. It's really very easy. Do the first one at
an easy pace, don't worry about time, just get the distance as a confidence builder. After the first
pick up the pace slightly and do a better time. After the first 3 100's it gets easy to build. I
usually build to 150+ miles 3 months prior to race day and do those every week-end till two weeks
out. My goals are a bit different than yours so you can adjust.

I am a slug of a runner so I must get the bike leg done quickly and feel good at the same time.
Dedicating the training effort for the bike allows me have me best shot. For me I can over train on
the bike with out overuse injury as in running. I find the long bike rides fun and like to push the
first 120 miles hard and then just cruise till I run out of time. Many get the job done with less
time on the bike but this is what works for me.

I will do IMNZ next March and intend to do it with less time training than in the past do to other
interests. My goal in past events led me to 30+ hours per week and I will decrease that to 18
hours/wk for IMNZ. Yep, still a lot of time.

Ken