Vaguely [OT] - anyone got any leverage at BT?

"GSV Three Minds in a Can" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however it
appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'. No
explanation of why, of course. (Their first response was that regulatory
reasons prevented it .. I asked for the regulation number, and they backed
off fairly fast).

So it's gone from 'can't' to 'won't', which is not a big advance. So
anyone got any hot contacts at BT? I promised to credit them as the
source, and I thought they'd be happy for people to be able to find their
call boxes (such as are left), but apparently they aren't. Weird.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.

CEO of BT Retail (yup, I got a reply but chances are he has or shortly will
change his ID...) is

[email hidden] <[email hidden]>

see...

http://www.btplc.com/Thegroup/Theboard/IanLivingston/IanLivingston.htm

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from
the wonderful person Rab C Nesbitt <[email hidden]>
said

Quoted message said:

"GSV Three Minds in a Can" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however it
appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'. No
explanation of why, of course. (Their first response was that regulatory
reasons prevented it .. I asked for the regulation number, and they backed
off fairly fast).

So it's gone from 'can't' to 'won't', which is not a big advance. So
anyone got any hot contacts at BT? I promised to credit them as the
source, and I thought they'd be happy for people to be able to find their
call boxes (such as are left), but apparently they aren't. Weird.

CEO of BT Retail (yup, I got a reply but chances are he has or shortly will
change his ID...) is

[email hidden] <[email hidden]>

see...

http://www.btplc.com/Thegroup/Theboard/IanLivingston/IanLivingston.htm

Thanks. . Well that's a contact, but it doesn't sound like you have much
leverage with the man. I was sort of hoping for someone whose Dad (or
Son!) is high enough to make a policy decision .. 8>.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:59:47 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can
<[email hidden]> wrote:

|!I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
|!contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however
|!it appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
|!digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'. No
|!explanation of why, of course. (Their first response was that regulatory
|!reasons prevented it .. I asked for the regulation number, and they
|!backed off fairly fast).
|!
|!So it's gone from 'can't' to 'won't', which is not a big advance. So
|!anyone got any hot contacts at BT? I promised to credit them as the
|!source, and I thought they'd be happy for people to be able to find
|!their call boxes (such as are left), but apparently they aren't. Weird.

I always carry a mobile but it rarely shows a signal. Far more important
to have the coverage of the <spit> *five* UK mobile phone systems marked.
--
Dave Fawthrop <sf hyphenologist.co.uk> 165 *Free* SF ebooks.
165 Sci Fi books on CDROM, from Project Gutenberg
http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Main_Page Completely Free to any
address in the UK. Contact me on the *above* email address.

"GSV Three Minds in a Can" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
wonderful person Rab C Nesbitt <[email hidden]> said

Quoted message said:

"GSV Three Minds in a Can" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however
it
appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'. No
explanation of why, of course. (Their first response was that regulatory
reasons prevented it .. I asked for the regulation number, and they
backed
off fairly fast).

So it's gone from 'can't' to 'won't', which is not a big advance. So
anyone got any hot contacts at BT? I promised to credit them as the
source, and I thought they'd be happy for people to be able to find
their
call boxes (such as are left), but apparently they aren't. Weird.

CEO of BT Retail (yup, I got a reply but chances are he has or shortly
will
change his ID...) is

[email hidden] <[email hidden]>

see...

http://www.btplc.com/Thegroup/Theboard/IanLivingston/IanLivingston.htm

Thanks. . Well that's a contact, but it doesn't sound like you have much
leverage with the man. I was sort of hoping for someone whose Dad (or
Son!) is high enough to make a policy decision .. 8>.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.

It's a long and sad story... but he was positive in his email...

briefly, (I live in the Highlands, the wife in Berkshire....) ;-) ...

Wife has BT Broadband. Keeps going wrong. Very nice people in India try to
sort but are not given the tools or the training (or, probably, the fair
wages,,,).

Eventually BT says "fault on your premises... you'll have to pay". We say
"send an engineer then", eventually one turns up & finds fault it BT
wiring/exchange... 'happenned 3 or 4 times at least....

And, to cap it all, BT keeps telling me we are not customers notwithstanding
my demonstrating regular monthly payments,,, (makes getting anyone to do
anything hard...). I've offerred money to charity if they sort it but nae
reply...

Only good thing is, after last bout of complaints we got refund AND free
chocolates and free wine (!!!!) - and I was in Scotland so the wife eats the
chocs & gives away the wine as she disnae drink....

So, when I moved late last year (between houses I own on't old council
estate - called "a scheme" up here - with views of 4 munros & 2 sea
lochs...) I decided to sign up with "Plusnet"... but then BT buys Plusnet...

Ho hum....

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
wonderful person Dave Fawthrop <[email hidden]>
said

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:59:47 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can
<[email hidden]> wrote:

|!I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
|!contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however
|!it appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
|!digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'. No
|!explanation of why, of course. (Their first response was that regulatory
|!reasons prevented it .. I asked for the regulation number, and they
|!backed off fairly fast).
|!
|!So it's gone from 'can't' to 'won't', which is not a big advance. So
|!anyone got any hot contacts at BT? I promised to credit them as the
|!source, and I thought they'd be happy for people to be able to find
|!their call boxes (such as are left), but apparently they aren't. Weird.

I always carry a mobile but it rarely shows a signal. Far more important
to have the coverage of the <spit> *five* UK mobile phone systems marked.

Yeah, but those are not much use for navigation points .. I sort of
thought that having several thousand phone boxes on your GPS map would
be useful. Of course it would have been (minor) work for me. I wonder if
there are any other utility companies with a more positive attitude?

Back to (close to) your point - Orange, for instance, have a ton of
mobile phone masts (I've mapped several in Shropshire) - I wonder if a)
they have a computer readable database of all of them (with lat/lon, or
OSGB Grid references), and b) if they'd actually give it out if one
asked?

Anyone think of anything else .. water towers? Problem is persuading the
companies who own the data that there is some benefit to them to release
it and b) that I'm not a terrorist looking for things to blow up. 8>.
Actually the problem is reaching anyone in said companies with enough
brains/authority to think about it rather than just claiming it is
impossible.
How the OS trig points ever got publicly released is a mystery and
marvel to me ..

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.

GSV Three Minds in a Can said:

I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however
it appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'. No
explanation of why, of course. (Their first response was that regulatory
reasons prevented it .. I asked for the regulation number, and they
backed off fairly fast).

FWIW, I expect that part of the real reason for their reluctance to
release such data has to do with the fact that coin boxes are
loss-making and are only maintained because BT (like any other European
incumbent) has to as part of the Universal Service obligation.

I expect furthermore that BT, like many other European incumbents, are
successful in convincing the regulator that the ever-increasing
penetration of mobile phones continuously reduces the need to maintain
coin boxes for social or public safety reasons.

If BT were to release the data you're after, it would also obviate the
rate at which coin boxes are disappearing, whether in real terms or in
terms of the average distance between UK residences and the nearest coin
box. (Note that I have no inside information on this; the above is only
what I believe to be true based on knowledge of trends in other European
countries).

Cheers, Jan

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:59:47 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote...

Quoted message said:

I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however
it appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'.

I bet that Ofcom has a list. They are a public authority, so if they
won't give it to you when you ask nicely, you could request it under the
Freedom of Information Act.
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/about/cad/foiindex/
http://www.ico.gov.uk/Home/what_we_cover/freedom_of_information.aspx

--
Tim Jackson
[email hidden]
(Change '.invalid' to '.com' to reply direct)

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 16:44:48 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote...

Quoted message said:

Back to (close to) your point - Orange, for instance, have a ton of
mobile phone masts (I've mapped several in Shropshire) - I wonder if a)
they have a computer readable database of all of them (with lat/lon, or
OSGB Grid references), and b) if they'd actually give it out if one
asked?

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/sitefinder/

But you may have to ask if they'll let you have it in a more useful
form.

--
Tim Jackson
[email hidden]
(Change '.invalid' to '.com' to reply direct)

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
wonderful person Tim Jackson <[email hidden]> said

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 16:44:48 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote...

Quoted message said:

Back to (close to) your point - Orange, for instance, have a ton of
mobile phone masts (I've mapped several in Shropshire) - I wonder if a)
they have a computer readable database of all of them (with lat/lon, or
OSGB Grid references), and b) if they'd actually give it out if one
asked?

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/sitefinder/

But you may have to ask if they'll let you have it in a more useful
form.

Thanks I'll try asking them. Can also let them know what horses-@sses BT
are being (quoting, initially, regulatory restrictions).

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
wonderful person Tim Jackson <[email hidden]> said

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:59:47 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can wrote...

Quoted message said:

I was going to try to add UK public call boxes (as an overlay) to the Uk
contour, trig points, and summits GPS maps up at WWW.SMC.ORG.UK, however
it appears that BT, while admitting to having the data (probably even in
digital form) won't release it 'except to the emergency services'.

I bet that Ofcom has a list. They are a public authority, so if they
won't give it to you when you ask nicely, you could request it under the
Freedom of Information Act.
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/about/cad/foiindex/
http://www.ico.gov.uk/Home/what_we_cover/freedom_of_information.aspx

Thanks, I could try that. Just as long as the data isn't copyrighted
(since I planned to release it). Obviously if they want to play SBs they
can release it in a format that is near impossible to computer convert,
so getting it nicely would be best.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 16:44:48 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can
<[email hidden]> dropped the following oil-slick:

Quoted message said:

Yeah, but those are not much use for navigation points .. I sort of
thought that having several thousand phone boxes on your GPS map would
be useful.

I find using pubs to navigate by much more fruitful. More of them for
a start.
--
gomez
Honda TransAlp,KTM 640LC Enduro (For Sale)
(not is not to reply)
"The best tool for the job is the hammer thats nearest to hand"

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
wonderful person gomez <[email hidden]> said

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 16:44:48 +0100, GSV Three Minds in a Can
<[email hidden]> dropped the following oil-slick:

Quoted message said:

Yeah, but those are not much use for navigation points .. I sort of
thought that having several thousand phone boxes on your GPS map would
be useful.

I find using pubs to navigate by much more fruitful. More of them for
a start.

Yeah, but who would have a UK wide list with name and grid reference for
the whole set??

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
8,630 Km walked. 1,677Km PROWs surveyed. 30.5% complete.