Back to the future!!

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos...

Can you say "Para-Pull"?

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

"Plus ca change, plus c'est le meme chose" - Jacques Meoff, famous
veteran cyclist

Ozark Bicycle said:

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

Michael Warner said:

Ozark Bicycle said:

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

That has *not* been the emphasis of the marketeers and the LBS sales
droids for quite some time.

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Michael Warner said:

Ozark Bicycle said:

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

That has *not* been the emphasis of the marketeers and the LBS sales
droids for quite some time.

I'm missing the pointy "aero" hoods on the bolts

Taeke

Fixed said:

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnews:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Michael Warner said:

On Fri, 06 Jul 2007 06:04:56 -0700, Ozark Bicycle wrote:
> Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
> and the beginning of another "aero" era?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

Quoted message said:

That has *not* been the emphasis of the marketeers and the LBS sales
droids for quite some time.

I'm missing the pointy "aero" hoods on the bolts

Be patient. ;-)

Ozark Bicycle said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

That has *not* been the emphasis of the marketeers and the LBS sales
droids for quite some time.

True, but why? I can think of some reasons:

- It's much easier for the average person to understand and verify
differences in weight than in aero resistance.

- Many aero components make riding in crosswinds and cornering harder.
While light components may break more easily, that's only a possible
problem, not an immediate one :-)

- For recreational riders, a lighter bike will improve climbing speed, if
only slightly, whereas a more aero bike won't cause any noticeable
improvement in a typical flat group ride unless you're doing very long
pulls on the front on a very long ride.

But I know recreational riders who've chosen heavier aero frames and
parts over light ones - they tend to be good pullers and sprinters on the
flat rather than climbers, so they think the bike supports their strengths.

"Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/features/tour_boonen_transition07/Boonen_Transition_front_brake

Quoted message said:

Looks like we are back to the '60's brake designs. Just like the old
Weinmann brakes of the period when we had square limestone wheels. You know,
just before the pyramids went up...

All of this started when they re-introduced those wool jerseys. What will
be next, corduroy knickers?

Those new brakes are definitely anodized red. That should make them a lot
faster and prolong the life of the pads. One easy addition would be a small
air scoop whistle that could signal the aero advantage threshold speed so
the rider could get definitive data as to when the brakes were working at
peak efficiency. That could eliminate the entire need for computers. Since
they are unreliable, run on batteries and complicated to boot. Just ride
fast enough to hear the sound of winning and hold it there... The perfect
gift for under $100!

Bruce

Ozark Bicycle said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

That has *not* been the emphasis of the marketeers and the LBS sales
droids for quite some time.

True, but why? I can think of some reasons:

- It's much easier for the average person to understand and verify
differences in weight than in aero resistance.

- Many aero components make riding in crosswinds and cornering harder.
While light components may break more easily, that's only a possible
problem, not an immediate one :-)

- For recreational riders, a lighter bike will improve climbing speed, if
only slightly, whereas a more aero bike won't cause any noticeable
improvement in a typical flat group ride unless you're doing very long
pulls on the front on a very long ride.

But I know recreational riders who've chosen heavier aero frames and
parts over light ones - they tend to be good pullers and sprinters on the
flat rather than climbers, so they think the bike supports their strengths.

Bruce Gilbert said:

Those new brakes are definitely anodized red. That should make them a lot
faster and prolong the life of the pads. One easy addition would be a small
air scoop whistle that could signal the aero advantage threshold speed so
the rider could get definitive data as to when the brakes were working at
peak efficiency.

I ride with someone who hasn't fixed a creaking bottom bracket because
(so he claims) if it's not creaking he knows he's not working hard enough.
It's a training aid!

In article <[email hidden]>,

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos/2007/tec
h/features/tour_boonen_transition07/Boonen_Transition_front_brake

"Proprietary" brake? What's proprietary about a retreaded design from
50 years ago?

Bruce Gilbert said:

addition would be a small air scoop whistle that could signal the
aero advantage threshold speed so the rider could get definitive
data as to when the brakes were working at peak efficiency. That
could eliminate the entire need for computers. Since they are
unreliable, run on batteries and complicated to boot. Just ride
fast enough to hear the sound of winning and hold it there... The
perfect gift for under $100!

It would even make head wind an advantage...

--
MfG/Best regards
helmut springer

Michael Warner said:

- Many aero components make riding in crosswinds and cornering harder.
While light components may break more easily, that's only a possible
problem, not an immediate one :-)

It's not a problem at all, it's another sale when the guy has to replace it.

--

David L. Johnson

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on
no account be allowed to do the job.
-- Douglas Adams

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos...

Aero, light, whaever--it's red and very handsome! I've been keeping my
eye out for a set of vintage Dia-Compe center pulls for a while. I
love the way they look, and the braking's not bad as well. I
reluctantly gave away a weathered set yesterday with an old frame.

Tim McNamara said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos...
h/features/tour_boonen_transition07/Boonen_Transition_front_brake

"Proprietary" brake? What's proprietary about a retreaded design from
50 years ago?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=tech/2007/features/specialized_tarmac_launch07

Based on the description in the link above, they have incorporated
both the dual pivot mechanism and center pull into the same brake.
Maybe that is the proprietary part.

"Specialized also incorporates a proprietary braking system for the
new Transition which uses a more aerodynamic center-pull dual-pivot
configuration (think old U-brake) and aero-sculpted calipers."

Tim McNamara said:

"Proprietary" brake? What's proprietary about a retreaded design from
50 years ago?

Probably non-standard mounting studs or spacing.

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos...

IIRC people were hoarding old U-brakes, AX and Delta brakes for their
TT bikes anyway -- particularly after Lance used AX on his TT bike.
This just looks like some OEM is making them new -- which saves
Specialized from having to fish them out of dumpsters or off eBay. If
this brake creeps in to the road line up, then I will wonder what's
going on. -- Jay Beattie.

Quoted message said:

Tim McNamara said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/tech/index.php?id=/photos...
h/features/tour_boonen_transition07/Boonen_Transition_front_brake

"Proprietary" brake? What's proprietary about a retreaded design from
50 years ago?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=tech/2007/features/specialized_tarmac_launch07

Based on the description in the link above, they have incorporated
both the dual pivot mechanism and center pull into the same brake.
Maybe that is the proprietary part.

"Specialized also incorporates a proprietary braking system for the
new Transition which uses a more aerodynamic center-pull dual-pivot
configuration (think old U-brake) and aero-sculpted calipers."

I've never seen a center-pull brake without dual pivots, although I'm
pretty sure there must be a single pivot center-pull or two out there.

Marcus

none said:

I've never seen a center-pull brake without dual pivots, although I'm
pretty sure there must be a single pivot center-pull or two out there.

I'm having problems visualizing that.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Ozark Bicycle said:

Does this signal the tail-end of the current "what's it weigh?" era
and the beginning of another "aero" era?

It's always been "aero" era in flat stages.

That has *not* been the emphasis of the marketeers and the LBS sales
droids for quite some time.

No matter how much it might make sense (for the rider doing a 40k TT, or
even just a long solo ride just for fun), Aero doesn't sell on the sales
floor. It doesn't even always sell where it *should* sell. The initial
Madone was produced only in an "aero" version, complete with tailfin (a seat
tube that flared to the bike, that I always thought looked pretty cool) and
a funny-shaped downtube that windtunnel testing showed made quite a
difference. But those features added 50 grams to the weight of the bike, as
well as some extra cost. And then Lance got into the act. He wanted a
superlight climbing machine, and didn't see the point to those extra 50
grams. Even though he was shown the data to prove its worth (at the speeds
he rides, it definitely would have been a worthwhile trade during those
times he'd be at the front). So the tailfin and downtube go bye-bye on his
bike, and subsequently bye-bye throughout the rest of the line as well.

Shaped tubes do sell, when they're essentially stylized elements of the
frame. We actually see a lot of bikes out there that are the opposite of
aero, giving up efficiency in the name of what looks cool.

It's just not an easy thing for a bike product guy to figure out. But in
general, customers want something they can measure on a scale, not in a wind
tunnel.
-
--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com