Download Michael Moores Sicko

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at the
history books. The you get the media and people like Howard Stern
praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the sirius now.

Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make one
of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Because (LOL) you might care (LOL) about the tens of millions of
Americans (LOL) that have no health insurnace, or (LOL) they only
think they do until they need it. (This last one really has me
ROTFLMAO.) And the uninsured kids: they are just _hilarious_.

And that joke about Michael Moore's weight: that's just _so_ funny,
because (get it?) a fat guy is by definition incapable of doing
anything of value. Let's all have a hearty laugh about Michael Moore's
weight, Stop it, I mean it, you're a funny guy, Sornson. My sides
hurt. Whew!

Quoted message said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Because (LOL) you might care (LOL) about the tens of millions of
Americans (LOL) that have no health insurnace, or (LOL) they only
think they do until they need it. (This last one really has me
ROTFLMAO.) And the uninsured kids: they are just _hilarious_.

And that joke about Michael Moore's weight: that's just _so_ funny,
because (get it?) a fat guy is by definition incapable of doing
anything of value. Let's all have a hearty laugh about Michael Moore's
weight, Stop it, I mean it, you're a funny guy, Sornson. My sides
hurt. Whew!

The fat [censored] started as a comedian (LOL) before he all of a sudden
decided he was a socialist. Friggin liberal Hollywierd is all about
raising social consciousness to get rid of the guilt they feel for
having so much money in the first place. If Michael Moore was such a
good guy for "exposing" the capitalist system, he would take some of the
$105 Million he made from his last movie and pay for the guys other
finger to be reattached instead of just filming the poor [censored] decision.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Michael Moore is just the liberal incarnation of guys like O'Liely and
Rushtard. All are full of verbal flatulence, blatantly twisting the
truth with their sensatio-tainment to drown out reasoned discourse. At
least most of the left doesn't take MM very seriously.

Also, don't confuse the messenger with the message. US health care is a
disaster. Some years ago W said, regarding single payer insurance, that
it would cost $1.5 trillion/y to insure everyone in the US under such a
system. Surprise! We were spending $1.5 trillion/y on health care at
that time and 40 million (plus) Americans *still* had no health
insurance. BTW we're spending about twice as much per person on our
crappy "system" as the rest of the industrialized world.
So MM may not be your favorite gun totin', car exec bashing, liberal
fart bag. That doesn't mean the health care system he's bashing this
time around is in a sustainable condition.

Shawn

[cross-posted newsgroups trimmed]

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ride-A-Lot [email protected] said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at
the history books.

Interestingly enough, when people do examine his claims line by line
they are remarkably accurate. You can validly disagree with his values,
his attitude, his conclusions, his grandstanding technique or even just
dislike his personality but when it comes to the facts the guy does his
homework. Where he falls down as a documentarian is that he sometimes
misses the correct context in which to place those facts.

When it comes to health care, the field in which I work, the system we
have in the US is inexcusably broken. It costs too much and doesn't
deliver adequately. The American health care system is ranked, IIRC,
37th in terms of outcomes but 1st in cost. We spend twice as much as
the next most expensive country for health care for poorer outcomes
(that's not all the health care system's fault, BTW- the American
sedentary lifestyle and rampant obesity are important contributors to
poorer outcomes. We're in worse health to begin with and that affects
outcomes).

Between 41 and 46 million Americans don't have health insurance, which
in turn means that they do not have good access to health care services.
Health insurance is heavily overpriced (mine costs 19% of my take home
income- $31 less per month than my house payment) and inefficient.
Insurance company overhead (including profit and operating costs)
average between 10% and 30% according to industry figures; by
comparison, Medicare's overhead is 1%. How about that, the government
is actually more efficient than "the market."

Americans will get national healthcare through the government. The
impetus for this is not going to come from Michael Moore and the pinko
Left. It's going to come from the business sector and the Right trying
to find ways to put American businesses on a competitive footing with
companies in the rest of the world. The current hybrid programs in a
few states, ones which impose a de facto health care tax on every child
woman and man by requiring them to buy health insurance or face legal
penalties, will fail due to being too expensive for individuals to
tolerate and too costly for states to subsidize. Interestingly most of
those plans were formulated by insurance industry groups. Hmmm. They
too see the writing on the wall and know that their days are numbered.

Ride-A-Lot said:

Quoted message said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Because (LOL) you might care (LOL) about the tens of millions of
Americans (LOL) that have no health insurnace, or (LOL) they only
think they do until they need it. (This last one really has me
ROTFLMAO.) And the uninsured kids: they are just _hilarious_.

And that joke about Michael Moore's weight: that's just _so_ funny,
because (get it?) a fat guy is by definition incapable of doing
anything of value. Let's all have a hearty laugh about Michael
Moore's weight, Stop it, I mean it, you're a funny guy, Sornson. My
sides hurt. Whew!

The fat [censored] started as a comedian (LOL) before he all of a sudden
decided he was a socialist. Friggin liberal Hollywierd is all about
raising social consciousness to get rid of the guilt they feel for
having so much money in the first place. If Michael Moore was such a
good guy for "exposing" the capitalist system, he would take some of
the $105 Million he made from his last movie and pay for the guys
other finger to be reattached instead of just filming the poor [censored]
decision.

I plonked the Train Wreck (for obvious reasons); this merely affirms my
decision. (And "Plump's Fiction" was a play on "Pulp Fiction", as both
works are...FICTION. HTH!)

Bill "calling MM a documentarian is like calling Hugo Chavez a progressive
leader" S.

Ride-A-Lot said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at the
history books. The you get the media and people like Howard Stern
praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the sirius now.

Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make
one of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

http://www.slate.com/id/2102723/ (old but worth reading again)

http://www.mooreexposed.com/ (surf from there)

"Tim McNamara" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[cross-posted newsgroups trimmed]

Quoted message said:

Between 41 and 46 million Americans don't have health insurance, which
in turn means that they do not have good access to health care services.
Health insurance is heavily overpriced (mine costs 19% of my take home
income- $31 less per month than my house payment) and inefficient.
Insurance company overhead (including profit and operating costs)
average between 10% and 30% according to industry figures; by
comparison, Medicare's overhead is 1%. How about that, the government
is actually more efficient than "the market."

I've been on Medicare for 2 years, I have the same doctors as I had with
private insurance. The care I get is no where near as good as before, they
aren't allowed to run some tests and are only paid for a fraction of what
they normally would charge. Guess who makes up the difference in what
they normally charge and what Medicare will pay, not me because they aren't
allowed to do bill me (by law), it's people like you who have private
insurance who gets the padded overcharges. I just recently crashed my
bike and took a trip to the emergency room, total bill was $1800, Medicare
paid $233, I paid a $50 copay. The $233 might have covered the leg brace
they gave me.

I tell my friends who are under 65 to get healthy before their 65th
birthday, because after that, they want you to die. You are no longer
paying in but instead are a liability.

In article
<[email hidden]>,

Shawn said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Michael Moore is just the liberal incarnation of guys like O'Liely and
Rushtard. All are full of verbal flatulence, blatantly twisting the
truth with their sensatio-tainment to drown out reasoned discourse. At
least most of the left doesn't take MM very seriously.

Also, don't confuse the messenger with the message. US health care is a
disaster. Some years ago W said, regarding single payer insurance, that
it would cost $1.5 trillion/y to insure everyone in the US under such a
system. Surprise! We were spending $1.5 trillion/y on health care at
that time and 40 million (plus) Americans *still* had no health
insurance. BTW we're spending about twice as much per person on our
crappy "system" as the rest of the industrialized world.
So MM may not be your favorite gun totin', car exec bashing, liberal
fart bag. That doesn't mean the health care system he's bashing this
time around is in a sustainable condition.

It is complicated and has many aspects that can be
pointed out as faults. It is so complicated that anyone
who claims he has a solution has tunnel vision, or is
deluded, a fear-monger, a liar, an opportunist, a
shill, a dupe, or some combination of the above. Any
changes made will be made by the winner, with no
improvement to the situation. MM is an opportunist, a
fear-monger and a liar.

--
Michael Press

Michael Press said:

In article
<[email hidden]>,

Shawn said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Michael Moore is just the liberal incarnation of guys like O'Liely and
Rushtard. All are full of verbal flatulence, blatantly twisting the
truth with their sensatio-tainment to drown out reasoned discourse. At
least most of the left doesn't take MM very seriously.

Also, don't confuse the messenger with the message. US health care is a
disaster. Some years ago W said, regarding single payer insurance, that
it would cost $1.5 trillion/y to insure everyone in the US under such a
system. Surprise! We were spending $1.5 trillion/y on health care at
that time and 40 million (plus) Americans *still* had no health
insurance. BTW we're spending about twice as much per person on our
crappy "system" as the rest of the industrialized world.
So MM may not be your favorite gun totin', car exec bashing, liberal
fart bag. That doesn't mean the health care system he's bashing this
time around is in a sustainable condition.

It is complicated and has many aspects that can be
pointed out as faults. It is so complicated that anyone
who claims he has a solution has tunnel vision, or is
deluded, a fear-monger, a liar, an opportunist, a
shill, a dupe, or some combination of the above. Any
changes made will be made by the winner, with no
improvement to the situation. MM is an opportunist, a
fear-monger and a liar.

Almost all true. The only thing stopping health care reform is the
insurance industry management and the drug companies. Decapitate them
through reform legislation and the problem is solved (yeah I know
<snicker, snort, guffaw>😉.

Shawn

In article <[email hidden]>, "DI" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Tim McNamara" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[cross-posted newsgroups trimmed]

Quoted message said:

Between 41 and 46 million Americans don't have health insurance,
which in turn means that they do not have good access to health
care services. Health insurance is heavily overpriced (mine costs
19% of my take home income- $31 less per month than my house
payment) and inefficient. Insurance company overhead (including
profit and operating costs) average between 10% and 30% according
to industry figures; by comparison, Medicare's overhead is 1%. How
about that, the government is actually more efficient than "the
market."

I've been on Medicare for 2 years, I have the same doctors as I had
with private insurance. The care I get is no where near as good as
before, they aren't allowed to run some tests and are only paid for a
fraction of what they normally would charge. Guess who makes up
the difference in what they normally charge and what Medicare will
pay, not me because they aren't allowed to do bill me (by law), it's
people like you who have private insurance who gets the padded
overcharges. I just recently crashed my bike and took a trip to
the emergency room, total bill was $1800, Medicare paid $233, I paid
a $50 copay. The $233 might have covered the leg brace they gave
me.

There is some truth to that and some- as far as I know- misinformation
seems to have been given to you. If a physician is "not allowed to run
some tests" that has come from the people they work for, not Medicare.
I am not aware of any medical tests that Medicare will not pay for.

You have to recognize that the bill you get from the hospital and other
health care providers has nothing to do with reality. It's what they
wish they got paid. If you had private insurance, they too would have
paid only a fraction of that bill- probably more then Medicare allowed-
and the rest would have been written off under the terms of the provide
agreement. 50% "discounts" are not at all unusual. At my last
physical, the bill for standard blood tests was $200+ but my insurance
paid something like $60 and the rest was the "provider's
responsibility." The main reason for these excessively high bills is to
keep upward pressure on reimbursement rates.

The problem is that if you go in without health insurance, they'll try
to make you pay the full rate. The people who can least afford to pay-
they'd buy insurance if they could- also get charged the highest amounts
for their health care. This happens at my clinic, too. I get around it
by making services "no charge" or underbilling (putting down 30 minutes
instead of 60 on my billing sheets). As I see it, why waste my business
office staff's time sending out bills that the customer can never pay?
All that does is make everyone feel bad and achieves nothing positive.

Quoted message said:

The fat [censored] started as a comedian (LOL) before he all of a sudden
decided he was a socialist. Friggin liberal Hollywierd is all about
raising social consciousness to get rid of the guilt they feel for
having so much money in the first place. If Michael Moore was such a
good guy for "exposing" the capitalist system, he would take some of the
$105 Million he made from his last movie and pay for the guys other
finger to be reattached instead of just filming the poor [censored] decision.

Back in those day that [censored] looked just like the Michelin man and now
here's filled in all the ripples

Ride-A-Lot said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at the
history books. The you get the media and people like Howard Stern
praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the sirius now.

Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make one
of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

I, for one, would rather have someone stirring the pot now rather than
after we've sunk to being a third-world country where a handful of
people have power and the rest of us have nothing. And that's exactly
where I think we're heading. We're going to be slaves of China in
another decade because they hold so much of our debt and there's only
going to be a few people in the USA who are going to be able to
financially take advantage of that.

Greg
--
http://ticketmastersucks.org

G.T. said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at the
history books. The you get the media and people like Howard Stern
praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the sirius now.

Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make
one of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

I, for one, would rather have someone stirring the pot now rather than
after we've sunk to being a third-world country where a handful of
people have power and the rest of us have nothing. And that's exactly
where I think we're heading. We're going to be slaves of China in
another decade because they hold so much of our debt and there's only
going to be a few people in the USA who are going to be able to
financially take advantage of that.

You sound like a nut case.
Unfortunately I think your right on the money (owed to China, for the
poison food they ship us).

Shawn

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:
{Illegal Spam Snipped}
Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Quoted message said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at the
history books. The you get the media and people like Howard Stern
praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the sirius now.
Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make
one of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

G.T. said:

I, for one, would rather have someone stirring the pot now rather than
after we've sunk to being a third-world country where a handful of
people have power and the rest of us have nothing. And that's exactly
where I think we're heading. We're going to be slaves of China in
another decade because they hold so much of our debt and there's only
going to be a few people in the USA who are going to be able to
financially take advantage of that.

Slaves? Hardly. USA has steadily increasing average income and assets
per household. Plus, a huge and growing number of millionaires the
overwhelming bulk of whom are first-generation, i.e., self-made. Our
labor mobility is higher than anywhere ever in history and that's a true
resource.

p.s. ours is not a 'class' system. When you hear negativity and envy
about 'the rich', look at their dissolute ineffective progeny - whatever
it us , it doesn't 'stick'. Which all works out just fine.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Shawn said:

G.T. said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Bill Sornson wrote:
> Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:
>
> {Illegal Spam Snipped}
>
> Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL
>

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at
the history books. The you get the media and people like Howard
Stern praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the
sirius now.

Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make
one of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

I, for one, would rather have someone stirring the pot now rather than
after we've sunk to being a third-world country where a handful of
people have power and the rest of us have nothing. And that's exactly
where I think we're heading. We're going to be slaves of China in
another decade because they hold so much of our debt and there's only
going to be a few people in the USA who are going to be able to
financially take advantage of that.

You sound like a nut case.
Unfortunately I think your right on the money (owed to China, for the
poison food they ship us).

Excluding the nut case portion of us being slaves to China it's a fact
that the we're losing the middle class very rapidly and it's a fact that
China is catching up to Japan in how much debt of ours they hold. Japan
never will call in that debt and China will most likely never call it in
so as to not disrupt the global economy but one never knows.

Greg
--
http://ticketmastersucks.org

A Muzi said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bill Sornson wrote:
> Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:
> {Illegal Spam Snipped}
> Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Quoted message said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Finally, a sane comment about that communist [censored]. It's scary to
think that people actually believe what he says without looking at
the history books. The you get the media and people like Howard
Stern praising his every word. I am thinking about ditching the
sirius now.
Michael Moore is the next Mao Tse Tung, only I don't think they make
one of those gray peoples uniforms in his size.

G.T. said:

I, for one, would rather have someone stirring the pot now rather than
after we've sunk to being a third-world country where a handful of
people have power and the rest of us have nothing. And that's exactly
where I think we're heading. We're going to be slaves of China in
another decade because they hold so much of our debt and there's only
going to be a few people in the USA who are going to be able to
financially take advantage of that.

Slaves? Hardly. USA has steadily increasing average income and assets
per household.

That's pure [censored]. Over the past 15 years purchasing power has
slowly been falling for the middle class because our minimal amount of
inflation is still significantly more than the pathetic annual increase
in earnings of a typical family. Oh, yeah, but executive compensation
continues to grow phenomenally.

Quoted message said:

Plus, a huge and growing number of millionaires the
overwhelming bulk of whom are first-generation, i.e., self-made. Our
labor mobility is higher than anywhere ever in history and that's a true
resource.

p.s. ours is not a 'class' system.

Sure.

http://www.aflcio.org/corporatewatch/paywatch/

Do you make $15 million a year? Will you ever? How many people do you
think could make $15 million a year while still having a viable economy?
200 million people, or magnitudes less?

Greg
--
http://ticketmastersucks.org

Shawn said:

Bill Sornson said:

Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

{Illegal Spam Snipped}

Why on earth would I want to watch "Plump's Fiction"? LOL

Michael Moore is just the liberal incarnation of guys like O'Liely and
Rushtard. All are full of verbal flatulence, blatantly twisting the
truth with their sensatio-tainment to drown out reasoned discourse. At
least most of the left doesn't take MM very seriously.

Also, don't confuse the messenger with the message. US health care is a
disaster. Some years ago W said, regarding single payer insurance, that
it would cost $1.5 trillion/y to insure everyone in the US under such a
system. Surprise! We were spending $1.5 trillion/y on health care at
that time and 40 million (plus) Americans *still* had no health
insurance. BTW we're spending about twice as much per person on our
crappy "system" as the rest of the industrialized world.
So MM may not be your favorite gun totin', car exec bashing, liberal
fart bag. That doesn't mean the health care system he's bashing this
time around is in a sustainable condition.

Shawn

While most of what Moore says in Sicko is accurate, there are some
things where he should have been more careful. The high infant mortality
rate in the U.S. is partially due to the fact that more high-risk
pregnancies are brought to term than in other countries, though the poor
neo-natal care is certainly a contributing factor.

The lower life expectancy is partially due to the health care system,
but is also due to the Republicans and their promotion of subsidies for
industries that promote an unhealthy lifestyle in terms of diet and
exercise.