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UCI vs ASO

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24 February 2007
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ilan
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  1. As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect). On the other hand, ASO merely
    represents its own interests, and as a private business has no
    responsibility to accept input from any outsider, that is, riders,
    teams, or other race organisers, indeed, its accountability is
    essentially limited to the UCI. For this reason, ASO's challenge of
    the UCI is an attempt to rid itself of virtually all accountability
    thus opening the door to the type of abuses which cycling has been
    trying to eradicate -- a collapse of the Pro Tour system and its
    guarantees would mean the return of previous horrors such as the Le
    Groupement and Team Coast fiascoes -- all of which would most directly
    affect the working conditions of riders.

    As usual, it is the riders who are suffering most from this conflict,
    and it will be the riders who will lose the most if ASO wins. As
    Operation Puerto has shown, a professional bicycle racer is only one
    unsubstantiated allegation away from exclusion, and with organisers
    running roughshod, riders will be excluded from the top races at the
    first sign of rumour. Allowing ASO to dictate its own terms for team
    participation in its events could result in exclusion of such riders
    as Ivan Basso and Jan Ullrich (if he manages to get a license and
    team) and these illegal exclusions have already been announced by the
    organiser of the Tour of Germany.

    So riders must face some short term consequences in order to maintain
    the rights that they have struggled to obtain. In fact, it is the rise
    of awareness by riders and teams of their fundamental rights which is
    at the heart of the current turmoil in cycling. What we are witnessing
    now is a result of the exposure of traditional abuses by cycling's
    power brokers due to a realisation by riders and teams of their
    fundamental right to due process. Not surprisingly, this has come in
    the wake of successes by American racers who have not hesitated to use
    competent legal counsel when necessary. In particular, it was an
    American team that convinced Ivan Basso that he did not have to prove
    his innocence to continue racing. This rise in awareness is scaring
    ASO, which is desperately trying to preserve the cycling tradition of
    taking advantage of naive riders. ASO's lack of respect for due
    process and rights of athletes is obvious in its statement that it
    already considers Oscar Pereiro the winner of the 2006 Tour de
    France. Their distaste for the United States and all that it
    represents was earlier made clear by its disavowal of Lance Armstrong
    days after his last Tour de France win.

    The wave of annoyingly successful Americans with new approaches to
    cycle racing disturbs ASO which sees as its mission the preservation
    of cycling's traditional monuments, from Paris-Roubaix to the Tour de
    France, and to prevent any intrusion into its territory. As an
    example, consider the harassment the Women's Tour de France received
    in the 1980's including successful lawsuits forcing a change of name
    not only of the event but of the term Yellow Jersey, otherwise used by
    virtually every other professional and amateur stage race, and the
    subsequent demise of that event. It is true that ASO has made an
    effort to move cycling in a new direction by organising the Tour of
    Qatar. The bizarre choice of running a race in the Persian Gulf is
    evident when viewing the world's best cyclist racing through the
    completely deserted streets of its capital Doha. What is the point of
    such expansion, to some day run a circuit race around Iran's nuclear
    power plants? As further evidence of the nature of ASO's management,
    there is CEO Patrice Clerc's recent statement that the UCI has less
    experience in Cycling than the Tour de France, which in fact was
    established some years after the UCI. His quixotic remark illustrates
    the formidable difficulty the UCI faces in establishing and
    maintaining a dialogue with ASO.

    Compare this with the UCI. Despite its many faults, the UCI has made
    extraordinarily successful efforts to develop cycling in many new
    directions. For example, its velodrome programme at Aigle has resulted
    in a whole new generation of track riders from developing countries.

    It appears that many people now agree that the UCI's decision to
    expand
    the Pro Tour to 20 teams was wrong, or at least premature. However,
    that decision must stand, as everyone of those 20 teams spent
    considerable money and effort to obtain the legal guarantee to race in
    the most important events in the sport. Disagreement with the current
    situation is understandable, but violation of the rules is not. And we
    are not talking about Civil Disobedience a la Martin Luther King, the
    only thing that ASO is fighting for is the right to do anything it
    wants.

    -ilan

  2. "ilan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect). On the other hand, ASO merely
    represents its own interests, and as a private business has no
    responsibility to accept input from any outsider, that is, riders,
    teams, or other race organisers, indeed, its accountability is
    essentially limited to the UCI. For this reason, ASO's challenge of
    the UCI is an attempt to rid itself of virtually all accountability
    thus opening the door to the type of abuses which cycling has been
    trying to eradicate -- a collapse of the Pro Tour system and its
    guarantees would mean the return of previous horrors such as the Le
    Groupement and Team Coast fiascoes -- all of which would most directly
    affect the working conditions of riders.

    As usual, it is the riders who are suffering most from this conflict,
    and it will be the riders who will lose the most if ASO wins. As
    Operation Puerto has shown, a professional bicycle racer is only one
    unsubstantiated allegation away from exclusion, and with organisers
    running roughshod, riders will be excluded from the top races at the
    first sign of rumour. Allowing ASO to dictate its own terms for team
    participation in its events could result in exclusion of such riders
    as Ivan Basso and Jan Ullrich (if he manages to get a license and
    team) and these illegal exclusions have already been announced by the
    organiser of the Tour of Germany.

    So riders must face some short term consequences in order to maintain
    the rights that they have struggled to obtain. In fact, it is the rise
    of awareness by riders and teams of their fundamental rights which is
    at the heart of the current turmoil in cycling. What we are witnessing
    now is a result of the exposure of traditional abuses by cycling's
    power brokers due to a realisation by riders and teams of their
    fundamental right to due process. Not surprisingly, this has come in
    the wake of successes by American racers who have not hesitated to use
    competent legal counsel when necessary. In particular, it was an
    American team that convinced Ivan Basso that he did not have to prove
    his innocence to continue racing. This rise in awareness is scaring
    ASO, which is desperately trying to preserve the cycling tradition of
    taking advantage of naive riders. ASO's lack of respect for due
    process and rights of athletes is obvious in its statement that it
    already considers Oscar Pereiro the winner of the 2006 Tour de
    France. Their distaste for the United States and all that it
    represents was earlier made clear by its disavowal of Lance Armstrong
    days after his last Tour de France win.

    The wave of annoyingly successful Americans with new approaches to
    cycle racing disturbs ASO which sees as its mission the preservation
    of cycling's traditional monuments, from Paris-Roubaix to the Tour de
    France, and to prevent any intrusion into its territory. As an
    example, consider the harassment the Women's Tour de France received
    in the 1980's including successful lawsuits forcing a change of name
    not only of the event but of the term Yellow Jersey, otherwise used by
    virtually every other professional and amateur stage race, and the
    subsequent demise of that event. It is true that ASO has made an
    effort to move cycling in a new direction by organising the Tour of
    Qatar. The bizarre choice of running a race in the Persian Gulf is
    evident when viewing the world's best cyclist racing through the
    completely deserted streets of its capital Doha. What is the point of
    such expansion, to some day run a circuit race around Iran's nuclear
    power plants? As further evidence of the nature of ASO's management,
    there is CEO Patrice Clerc's recent statement that the UCI has less
    experience in Cycling than the Tour de France, which in fact was
    established some years after the UCI. His quixotic remark illustrates
    the formidable difficulty the UCI faces in establishing and
    maintaining a dialogue with ASO.

    Compare this with the UCI. Despite its many faults, the UCI has made
    extraordinarily successful efforts to develop cycling in many new
    directions. For example, its velodrome programme at Aigle has resulted
    in a whole new generation of track riders from developing countries.

    It appears that many people now agree that the UCI's decision to
    expand
    the Pro Tour to 20 teams was wrong, or at least premature. However,
    that decision must stand, as everyone of those 20 teams spent
    considerable money and effort to obtain the legal guarantee to race in
    the most important events in the sport. Disagreement with the current
    situation is understandable, but violation of the rules is not. And we
    are not talking about Civil Disobedience a la Martin Luther King, the
    only thing that ASO is fighting for is the right to do anything it
    wants.

    While I understand what you're saying Ilan, I'm still having a lot of
    trouble with the attitude of the UCI in the matters of the doping controls.
    They cannot follow their own rules and they feel that trial by accusation in
    the press is perfectly acceptable practice. I'd be a lot more likely to
    support them if they had even a hint of ethical behaviour.

  3. ilan said:

    As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect).

    It's doing a pretty crappy job of protecting riders, and it doesn't
    own the races that matter. All it has for power is Olympic
    connections. If the GT's decide to cut ties with UCI and do their
    own sanctioning, Pro Riders are out of the Olympics and able to stand
    on their own. That may not be a bad scenario.

    -dB

  4. dbrower said:
    ilan said:

    As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect).

    It's doing a pretty crappy job of protecting riders, and it doesn't
    own the races that matter. All it has for power is Olympic
    connections. If the GT's decide to cut ties with UCI and do their
    own sanctioning, Pro Riders are out of the Olympics and able to stand
    on their own. That may not be a bad scenario.

    You sure got that right

    McBoggy has perhaps killed cycling, although it is a pretty resilient
    sport and as Oil Peak approaches, might possibly spawn higher quality
    local races which attract local tifosi in large numbers

    But McBoggy will certainly have his place in the annals of cycling
    history and when he goes to the big bike race in the sky.

    In the city square at Aigle, they're going to put up a statue
    inscribed:

    Ich habe zerstört

    --
    Le vent à Dos
    Davey Crockett [No 4Q to reply]

  5. On Feb 25, 10:31 am, Davey Crockett <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    dbrower said:
    ilan said:

    As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect).

    Quoted message said:

    It's doing a pretty crappy job of protecting riders, and it doesn't
    own the races that matter. All it has for power is Olympic
    connections. If the GT's decide to cut ties with UCI and do their
    own sanctioning, Pro Riders are out of the Olympics and able to stand
    on their own. That may not be a bad scenario.

    You sure got that right

    McBoggy has perhaps killed cycling, although it is a pretty resilient
    sport and as Oil Peak approaches, might possibly spawn higher quality
    local races which attract local tifosi in large numbers

    But McBoggy will certainly have his place in the annals of cycling
    history and when he goes to the big bike race in the sky.

    In the city square at Aigle, they're going to put up a statue
    inscribed:

    Ich habe zerstört

    --
    Le vent à Dos
    Davey Crockett [No 4Q to reply]

    All these responses have something in common, their awareness of the
    UCI's
    glaring faults makes them side against the UCI, so, by default for
    ASO. The problem
    is that they don't take into account the full consequences of this,
    which will be total
    anarchy, or more accurately, oligarchy. This all kind of reminds me of
    this interesting
    discussion between Pierre Trudeau and some reporters:

    -ilan

  6. ilan said:

    On Feb 25, 10:31 am, Davey Crockett <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    dbrower said:

    On Feb 24, 2:56 pm, "ilan" <[email hidden]> wrote:
    > As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    > conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    > main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    > mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    > its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    > making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    > has often been less than perfect).

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    It's doing a pretty crappy job of protecting riders, and it doesn't
    own the races that matter. All it has for power is Olympic
    connections. If the GT's decide to cut ties with UCI and do their
    own sanctioning, Pro Riders are out of the Olympics and able to stand
    on their own. That may not be a bad scenario.

    Quoted message said:

    You sure got that right

    Quoted message said:

    McBoggy has perhaps killed cycling, although it is a pretty resilient
    sport and as Oil Peak approaches, might possibly spawn higher quality
    local races which attract local tifosi in large numbers

    Quoted message said:

    But McBoggy will certainly have his place in the annals of cycling
    history and when he goes to the big bike race in the sky.

    Quoted message said:

    In the city square at Aigle, they're going to put up a statue
    inscribed:

    Quoted message said:

    Ich habe zerstört

    Quoted message said:

    --
    Le vent à Dos
    Davey Crockett [No 4Q to reply]

    All these responses have something in common, their awareness of the
    UCI's
    glaring faults makes them side against the UCI, so, by default for
    ASO. The problem
    is that they don't take into account the full consequences of this,
    which will be total
    anarchy, or more accurately, oligarchy.

    This would be a problem if you were talking about a society, but the
    organization of a big race is a business. Almost all the revenue in
    cycling is generated by the organizer and the teams and the UCI aren't
    a major contributor to that.

    It was presumtuous of the UCI to step in and try to take over
    direction or demand a slice of the pie (the revenue sharing that teams
    want). That sounds like a bad marriage.

    The only reason that the current system has lasted as long as it has
    is probably because of the socialist attitude in Europe, and we're
    discovering even that has it's limits.

    For riders to have a real union (what Bill is always hand-wringing
    about) they have to been seen as an investment by the major player
    (ie. employed by te ASO, not contracted by teams).

    No other major pro sport is governed by a pseudo-democratic amateur
    sport governing body. The UCI is fine for controlling the amateur and
    olympic side of the sport, but in the case of say the Tour the ASO is
    contributing the lion's share to the enterprise, so naturally they are
    going to expect the entitlement that goes along with it.

  7. Hiya:
    I would have thought the UCI, the three Grand Tour companies and
    yes, even the Rider's Union would have had more sense, more humility
    and more interest in the long-term best interests of the sport, it's
    fans and sponsors than, say, FIDE (the World Chess Federation) and the
    world of Chess in general. That's right -- I expected bikies to have
    less ego involbement and more brains than chess players.
    It's all the fault of Americans -- the folks at the UCI and the
    Grand Tours have not only watched too many Westerns, they've taken
    them for models of confilct resolution! It's going to be a gorgeous
    day today -- time to turn off the computer, lube the chain and go
    ride.

    rleone

  8. ilan said:

    As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect). On the other hand, ASO merely
    represents its own interests, and as a private business has no
    responsibility to accept input from any outsider, that is, riders,
    teams, or other race organisers, indeed, its accountability is
    essentially limited to the UCI.

    I guess I can't let this go. What you're saying is true, but the ASO
    IS a business, and there are tried and tested rules to business. The
    employees of a business don't have a say on how it's run or share in
    the revenue. Shareholders on the other hand do have voting rights and
    are paid dividends.

    I think my idea is the only workable solution. The GT organizers
    should merge, sell spots on their circuit for a sum and use the cash
    generated to buy out all the other major pro races and promote the
    resulting league to the next level.

  9. "ilan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...
    On Feb 25, 10:31 am, Davey Crockett <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    dbrower said:
    ilan said:

    As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    has often been less than perfect).

    Quoted message said:

    It's doing a pretty crappy job of protecting riders, and it doesn't
    own the races that matter. All it has for power is Olympic
    connections. If the GT's decide to cut ties with UCI and do their
    own sanctioning, Pro Riders are out of the Olympics and able to stand
    on their own. That may not be a bad scenario.

    You sure got that right

    McBoggy has perhaps killed cycling, although it is a pretty resilient
    sport and as Oil Peak approaches, might possibly spawn higher quality
    local races which attract local tifosi in large numbers

    But McBoggy will certainly have his place in the annals of cycling
    history and when he goes to the big bike race in the sky.

    In the city square at Aigle, they're going to put up a statue
    inscribed:

    Ich habe zerstört

    --
    Le vent à Dos
    Davey Crockett [No 4Q to reply]

    All these responses have something in common, their awareness of the
    UCI's
    glaring faults makes them side against the UCI, so, by default for
    ASO. The problem
    is that they don't take into account the full consequences of this,
    which will be total
    anarchy, or more accurately, oligarchy.

    Anarchy? Until the 1980's the UCI has always been a collection of puppets,
    directed by Lévitan, Goddet, and a few of their companions, like Torriani or
    Karel Steyaert. It was the golden age of bicycle racing. And in those years
    the riders were well aware of theur rights. And they certainly were not
    powerless. Of course, they were dependent of the Tour organization, but the
    organization also depended of them. The history of cycling is full of
    actions - sometimes succesfull, sometimes not - of the riders to defend
    their rights. For instance, the foundation of the Union in the 1920's, the
    strikes in the Giro bewteen 1946 and 1954, the strike in the Tour of'1978,
    etc., etc. However, those times are past and now we have a real power
    struggle between ASO and UCI for the simple reason that a third man went
    into play: the government. From the introduction of the anti-doping laws in
    1965 and certainly since the Festina-scandale of 1998 political authorities
    are no longer benevalent spectators anymore, with the result that doping
    tests and its results have become a very efficient tool in the hand of the
    UCI in its power struggle with the ASO. All those scandals - Operation
    Puerto, Landis, etc. - are only harmful for the UCI, if only because it's
    making them lose money, but not at all to the UCI (they're not losing a
    cent), and they would happily sweep the unde rthe carpet. And they would
    have been quite willing to allow Ullrich and Basso to participate to the
    Tour 2006. Besides, it's not true that the ASO is so anti-american that it
    is already considering Oscar Pereiro winner of the 2006 Tour de France. On
    the contrary: the ASO declared to consider the possibility that there will
    be no winner for 2006.

    Benjo

    nd by the way, I don't agree with your assumption that they are
    anti-american. True, they were not very happy with Amstrong's seven wins in
    a row, but they were neither happy with Indurain's five wins. But it's not
    true that they wanted

  10. ilan said:


    All these responses have something in common, their awareness of the
    UCI's
    glaring faults makes them side against the UCI, so, by default for
    ASO. The problem
    is that they don't take into account the full consequences of this,
    which will be total
    anarchy, or more accurately, oligarchy.

    The problem is internal to OCI - they want to play every hand to the
    end and they can't count chips on the table. Better replace the UCI
    people at the table with realists. Now, today.

    Curtis L. Russell
    Odenton, MD (USA)
    Just someone on two wheels...

  11. In article
    <[email hidden]>,
    "ilan" <[email hidden]> wrote:

    [...]

    Thanks ilan. I too think ASO needs people to stand up
    to it. I do not think UCI was doing it; not
    effectively. Someone else will take on ASO, because it
    can be done. UCI wanted to fight ASO for the power to
    dominate the riders. They would have been smart to ally
    themselves with the riders. Later they could have
    repudiated that alliance.

    --
    Michael Press

  12. In article <[email hidden]>,

    ilan said:

    On Feb 25, 10:31 am, Davey Crockett <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    dbrower said:

    On Feb 24, 2:56 pm, "ilan" <[email hidden]> wrote:
    > As much as I dislike the UCI, I stand 100% behind it in its current
    > conflict with ASO, or, more accurately, I am 100% against ASO. The
    > main point is simple: The UCI represents cycling in general and its
    > mission is to defend the rights of riders, teams, and organisers, and
    > its structure is such that each of these is given a say in decision
    > making (though there is no denying that its handling of this mission
    > has often been less than perfect).

    Quoted message said:

    It's doing a pretty crappy job of protecting riders, and it doesn't
    own the races that matter. All it has for power is Olympic
    connections. If the GT's decide to cut ties with UCI and do their
    own sanctioning, Pro Riders are out of the Olympics and able to stand
    on their own. That may not be a bad scenario.

    You sure got that right

    McBoggy has perhaps killed cycling, although it is a pretty resilient
    sport and as Oil Peak approaches, might possibly spawn higher quality
    local races which attract local tifosi in large numbers

    But McBoggy will certainly have his place in the annals of cycling
    history and when he goes to the big bike race in the sky.

    In the city square at Aigle, they're going to put up a statue
    inscribed:

    Ich habe zerstört

    --
    Le vent à Dos
    Davey Crockett [No 4Q to reply]

    All these responses have something in common, their awareness of the
    UCI's
    glaring faults makes them side against the UCI, so, by default for
    ASO. The problem
    is that they don't take into account the full consequences of this,
    which will be total
    anarchy, or more accurately, oligarchy.

    Dumbass:

    First, anarchy and oligarchy are pretty disparate options, so you're
    effectively predicting everything, or more accurately, nothing.

    Second, I thought cycling's governance already was an oligarchy. You've
    got your ASO (with its Italian and Spanish bretheren), you've got your
    UCI, and you've got...nothing else that hardly matters, unless the teams
    or the riders grow spines.

    The history of professional sporting organizations where
    sanctioning/refereeing and event management are handled by one body is
    pretty good. I count every professional league in North America under
    that system, for one bunch of examples.

    --
    Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
    "I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
    to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

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