Altitude/Power Question

RipVanCommittee said:

As someone who live/trains/races mostly at sea level, I've noticed that I've had no discernable power drop up when racingto about 4,000-4,5000 feet.

So here's my question: since I'm seemingly less affected than some others at this lower altitude, is it reasonable to expect that I will be less affected than others at the higher altitudes as well, say up to 7,500 feet? Or, am I kidding myself??

The drop is supposed to be less if you either go straight to elevetion from sea level or after several days of acclimation. So maybe you were in these parameters.

jetnjeff said:

The drop is supposed to be less if you either go straight to elevetion from sea level or after several days of acclimation. So maybe you were in these parameters.

Well, on the few occassions I've raced at altitude, I hit the same power numbers from the first through the 5th or 6th day (despite increased fatigue), so I'm guessing (hoping?) than I may be a non-responder of sorts?

I'm pretty limited in experience about 4,500 feet though.

RipVanCommittee said:

Well, on the few occassions I've raced at altitude, I hit the same power numbers from the first through the 5th or 6th day (despite increased fatigue), so I'm guessing (hoping?) than I may be a non-responder of sorts?

I'm pretty limited in experience about 4,500 feet though.

What duration are we talking about. I could see the shorter anaerobic intervals not being as affected as the longer aerobic lengths.

jetnjeff said:

What duration are we talking about. I could see the shorter anaerobic intervals not being as affected as the longer aerobic lengths.

When I lived at sea level and travelled to races above 6000 feet I'd usually feel great for the first 3 to 4 days and then I'd really suffer for about a week and a half. After that I'd pretty much be back to normal. I've had the same experience mountaineering at much higher elevations. Initially everything is rosy, then some acclimitization blues and hopefully a rebound earned by caching loads high and sleeping low. I've felt like [censored] 5 days into a Denali trip and like superman a week and a half later on the summit.

Hard to say whether you're a non-responder, a fast adapter or you just haven't raced high enough for long enough to feel the impact. Try the Tour of the Gila or Mount Evans if you want to see how you respond. FWIW if I really cared about a long race or series of races up high I'd arrive more than a week in advance but if it's a one day event I'd probably arrive the day before based on my three to four day window before crashing. Don't know what the physiologists say, but that's my experience.

jetnjeff said:

What duration are we talking about. I could see the shorter anaerobic intervals not being as affected as the longer aerobic lengths.

Pretty much all durations--the durations being between 20 minutes to an hour, since most of the races at those elevations (say Mt. Hood or Cascade) have long, aerobic length climbs in them.

My real question is, if I can do reasonably well in those races, but live at sea level--am I wasting my time going to Gila.....

daveryanwyoming said:

When I lived at sea level and travelled to races above 6000 feet I'd usually feel great for the first 3 to 4 days and then I'd really suffer for about a week and a half. After that I'd pretty much be back to normal.

Try the Tour of the Gila or Mount Evans if you want to see how you respond. FWIW if I really cared about a long race or series of races up high I'd arrive more than a week in advance but if it's a one day event I'd probably arrive the day before based on my three to four day window before crashing. Don't know what the physiologists say, but that's my experience.

And there is the conundrum: a few friends of mine went to Gila in years past and got there a week before--and felt horrible, pretty much until the race was over. I could make it down there no earlier than about 4 days before, which would probably mean I'd really start to feel like [censored] right about in time for the final stage!

I'm thinking then, based on their, and your experience, my best bet may be to get there when the event begins, and hope for the best. I guess I really won't know the answer for sure until I give it a go.

Thanks for the help!

RipVanCommittee said:

And there is the conundrum: a few friends of mine went to Gila in years past and got there a week before--and felt horrible, pretty much until the race was over. I could make it down there no earlier than about 4 days before, which would probably mean I'd really start to feel like [censored] right about in time for the final stage!

I'm thinking then, based on their, and your experience, my best bet may be to get there when the event begins, and hope for the best. I guess I really won't know the answer for sure until I give it a go.

Thanks for the help!

If you can't get there 2 weeks before (minimum), I'd show up the day before the TT. I'm a flat-lander (Kansas) and live @ 1330ft. I've raced the Gila 8 times now, Mt. Evans 4 times. My experience is pretty typical... for the Gila, arrive the day before or >2 weeks before. In a former lifetime, I was an elite runner and occasionally raced at altitude. It didn't seem to affect me nearly as much as other sea level athletes, and I seem to adapt quicker (fast responder to any training stressor). Even so, I definitely feel the drop off at about 3 to 5 days in. It takes another 5 days or so to come back to feeling decent. At the Gila, I've always done well on the stage 1 TT (won the cat. III's a while back), regardless of whether I showed up the day before or 2 weeks before. Where I really notice it at the gila is day 3. The few times I've acclimated, I did well... but boy, if you've come straight up to altitude, day 3 has the potential to be a death march. I mean brutal. By day 5, I've always been strong, regardless of whether I've stayed at altitude prior or not. That being said, this year I'm going from Kansas to Ft. Davis for the Hammerfest, and then to Silver City for a whopping 12 days of preparation before the TOG.
BTW- do you live in a hilly area? If not, how are you preparing for the climbs?

1) Going to Gila is never a waste of time. It's a great event, the town of Silver city loves having you there, and you'll enjoy it. Disclaimer - I'm a co-sponsor and an announcer, as well as having raced there.

2) Your results at 4000 - 4500' are, unfortunately, not really a great indicator. Most information that I've seen indicates little to no impact for most athletes up until 5000' (well, placebo excluded). After that, everyone seems to have their individual "break point", from where power drops linearly as you continue to go up. I've posted that wattage FAQ chart before.

3) Per the current literature & expertise I'm familiar with, you either get there 2-4 weeks in advance, or right before. It takes your body more than a week to really make any of the adaptations, but within the time you're making most of them your body is working overtime...that's likely why your friends felt like [censored]. The good news is that the manager of the Holiday Inn Express will give you a monthly or weekly rate on a room if you want to head down 2-4 weeks ahead of time to get acclimated. Good restaurants in town too.

So my advice is to go, be really good about sleep, hydration, and refueling after every stage. The majority of the race is below 7000', with just a couple exceptions...so it's not a "pure" high altitude race where only the Moningers and Overends of the world do well. In 2005 Stevic and Mesa both made the final podium in the men's pro race, despite living close to sea level.

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