About Lance's marathon....

Pat in TX said:

I was in a running store the other day and the guy says to me, "Why did
Lance think he could run a marathon when the farthest he's ever tried to run
was only 15 miles?" I told him that cyclists think that if you can go at
least half the distance, then you can go the other half. I had just ridden
50 miles that day, so I "knew" I could ride a total of 100 miles without
problem. He looked stunned. Finally, he said, that runners use a different
"rule of thumb" in that they figure if they run 3/4 of the distance in
question, they can manage to run the rest.

While it's a different thing running "only" a half-marathon, I did one
a few years ago having run no further than 3-4 miles during the
previous 2 years (and a grand total of about 14 miles during those two
years). The serious runners I was with all thought I was nuts, and
that I wouldn't even finish.

I smoked 'em and got second in my age group. They hated me. ;-)

Let's not forget that Lance started out as a VERY good triathlete.
Sounds like he didn't go overboard preparing for the race, but hey...
who am I to fault Lance's preparation? ;-)

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

"Mark Hickey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Pat in TX said:

I was in a running store the other day and the guy says to me, "Why
did
Lance think he could run a marathon when the farthest he's ever tried
to run
was only 15 miles?" I told him that cyclists think that if you can go
at
least half the distance, then you can go the other half. I had just
ridden
50 miles that day, so I "knew" I could ride a total of 100 miles
without
problem. He looked stunned. Finally, he said, that runners use a
different
"rule of thumb" in that they figure if they run 3/4 of the distance in
question, they can manage to run the rest.

While it's a different thing running "only" a half-marathon, I did one
a few years ago having run no further than 3-4 miles during the
previous 2 years (and a grand total of about 14 miles during those two
years). The serious runners I was with all thought I was nuts, and
that I wouldn't even finish.

I smoked 'em and got second in my age group. They hated me. ;-)

Interesting, did you go under 1:30? I ran my first and only marathon
quite a while back. Unlike cycling, the high impact takes a toll after
about an hour.

Phil H

Phil Holman' piholmanc@yourservice said:

"Mark Hickey" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

While it's a different thing running "only" a half-marathon, I did one
a few years ago having run no further than 3-4 miles during the
previous 2 years (and a grand total of about 14 miles during those two
years). The serious runners I was with all thought I was nuts, and
that I wouldn't even finish.

I smoked 'em and got second in my age group. They hated me. ;-)

Interesting, did you go under 1:30?

Nope, but it was a very tough race. It was at ~7500 ft. altitude,
very hilly and a large portion on gravel roads (you haven't lived 'til
you've run 11 miles at race pace, and then have to run up a steep hill
covered in loose gravel - you feel like you're running on ice). I did
a 1:42 IIRC - the winning time for the full marathon was over three
and a half hours - tough race.

Quoted message said:

I ran my first and only marathon
quite a while back. Unlike cycling, the high impact takes a toll after
about an hour.

It sure does - I was sore after the race for a few days, but had the
good sense to stop running again immediately. ;-)

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 12:23:35 -0600, "Pat in TX" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I was in a running store the other day and the guy says to me, "Why did
Lance think he could run a marathon when the farthest he's ever tried to run
was only 15 miles?" I told him that cyclists think that if you can go at
least half the distance, then you can go the other half. I had just ridden
50 miles that day, so I "knew" I could ride a total of 100 miles without
problem. He looked stunned. Finally, he said, that runners use a different
"rule of thumb" in that they figure if they run 3/4 of the distance in
question, they can manage to run the rest.

So, we both learned something that day.

Pat in TX

Pat,

That's very true what the runner told you.

You can't coast down the hill while running as you do can with your
bike! So, you need to run down the hill and that takes a lot of
pounding on your quads. You can't coast on the flats or draft behind
your fellow team mates or if you have any (a marathon after all is not
a team effort -- it's individual), so you need to keep running. And
that takes a big toll on your joints.

Keep in mind that as you run, your striking foot bears 4x your body
weight! And that 4x body weight pounding continues in the case of
Lance for close to 3 hrs!!

The idea of running 3/4 of the distance is to develop the necessary
stabilizing muscles to prevent the very injuries that Lance was
suffering.

I too did the same training regimen as Lance did, running only half
the distance. I did great the first half of my 26 mile with the same
pace as Lance, but just at the 20 miles point, IT band settled in and
that was it. I had to walk the whole 6 miles like my old grand daddy
just to finish still with a great time though.

David.

David said:

On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 12:23:35 -0600, "Pat in TX" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I was in a running store the other day and the guy says to me, "Why did
Lance think he could run a marathon when the farthest he's ever tried to run
was only 15 miles?" I told him that cyclists think that if you can go at
least half the distance, then you can go the other half. I had just ridden
50 miles that day, so I "knew" I could ride a total of 100 miles without
problem. He looked stunned. Finally, he said, that runners use a different
"rule of thumb" in that they figure if they run 3/4 of the distance in
question, they can manage to run the rest.

So, we both learned something that day.

Pat in TX

Pat,

That's very true what the runner told you.

You can't coast down the hill while running as you do can with your
bike! So, you need to run down the hill and that takes a lot of
pounding on your quads. You can't coast on the flats or draft behind
your fellow team mates or if you have any (a marathon after all is not
a team effort -- it's individual), so you need to keep running. And
that takes a big toll on your joints.

Keep in mind that as you run, your striking foot bears 4x your body
weight! And that 4x body weight pounding continues in the case of
Lance for close to 3 hrs!!

The idea of running 3/4 of the distance is to develop the necessary
stabilizing muscles to prevent the very injuries that Lance was
suffering.

Also mental toughness. Running for 3.5 hours took a lot of mental
toughness to relize I wasn't hurt, even tho i felt crappy.

Quoted message said:

I too did the same training regimen as Lance did, running only half
the distance. I did great the first half of my 26 mile with the same
pace as Lance, but just at the 20 miles point, IT band settled in and
that was it. I had to walk the whole 6 miles like my old grand daddy
just to finish still with a great time though.

It is said marathon has two 'halves', the first half-> first 20 miles
and the the last 6.2, the second 'half'. I really loved to run and
'enjoyed' the marathons I ran but screwed up achille's tendons ended my
running.

Quoted message said:

David.

Pat in TX said:

I was in a running store the other day and the guy says to me, "Why did
Lance think he could run a marathon when the farthest he's ever tried to run
was only 15 miles?" I told him that cyclists think that if you can go at
least half the distance, then you can go the other half. I had just ridden
50 miles that day, so I "knew" I could ride a total of 100 miles without
problem. He looked stunned. Finally, he said, that runners use a different
"rule of thumb" in that they figure if they run 3/4 of the distance in
question, they can manage to run the rest.

So, we both learned something that day.

Pat in TX

"Rules of thumb" are, of course, just a point of departure.
My back and knees are both issues, so my marathon training consisted of
5-6 mile runs with a 9 and a 12 miler thrown in.
FWIW, if you're not planning on winning, I think that doing training
runs beyond, say, 10 miles, are largely a psychological boost. I doubt
that my body is going to learn all that much when compared with the
potential for an injury hampering training (or worse.)
If finishing is your goal, the training you do should be based on
completing the task while minimizing damage.
/s

On 11/15/06 11:20 AM, in article
[email hidden], "Scott Gordo"

Quoted message said:

Pat in TX said:

I was in a running store the other day and the guy says to me, "Why did
Lance think he could run a marathon when the farthest he's ever tried to run
was only 15 miles?" I told him that cyclists think that if you can go at
least half the distance, then you can go the other half. I had just ridden
50 miles that day, so I "knew" I could ride a total of 100 miles without
problem. He looked stunned. Finally, he said, that runners use a different
"rule of thumb" in that they figure if they run 3/4 of the distance in
question, they can manage to run the rest.

So, we both learned something that day.

Pat in TX

"Rules of thumb" are, of course, just a point of departure.
My back and knees are both issues, so my marathon training consisted of
5-6 mile runs with a 9 and a 12 miler thrown in.
FWIW, if you're not planning on winning, I think that doing training
runs beyond, say, 10 miles, are largely a psychological boost. I doubt
that my body is going to learn all that much when compared with the
potential for an injury hampering training (or worse.)
If finishing is your goal, the training you do should be based on
completing the task while minimizing damage.
/s

Maybe a very in shape 18-25 year old could finish a marathon on the training
you describe but for normal mortals at least one or two long runs in the 20
mile range are the usual rule. I have completed two marathons and still
experienced some cramping in the later stages, even with two 20 mile plus
training runs and a few more runs in the mid to high teens. While having
done the long runs is definitely a psychological boost, it is a physical
boost as well. I have seen a lot of marathon non-finishers who figured that
if they could run 10+ miles they could complete a marathon!