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Question about cheating

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Road Cycling
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29 July 2006
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  1. Okay, after hearing about Landis, I got to thinking (it *does* happen
    occasionally).

    The various athletic organizations set standards for various drug
    levels. Some of those drugs are naturally occuring (i.e.
    testosterone). They set the standards based on the "norms" for the
    general populace. But elite athletes are not the general populace.
    They have attributes, be they physiological or psychological, that
    enable them to compete at a level far beyond that which the general
    populace could achieve (were they to train).

    Norms don't mean much. Suppose you determine that, for example, for
    drug X 95% of the population has a level between 2 and 6 (units don't
    matter - it's an example). That means that 5% of the population (or
    about 300,000,000 people) have a normal - i.e. NOT artificial - level
    outside 2 and 6. It's not unthinkable that out of 300,000,000 people
    you could find a few thousand freaks with a normal level of, say, 12.
    What would happen if an athletic organization was to test one of the
    freaks?

    Before you say this cannot happen, I'll point out that I have a friend
    who is extremely hyperthyroid. Without medication, his levels are
    about 3.5 times the maximum of the "normal" range.

    Bottom line: I'm wondering, when it comes to naturally occuring
    substances, such as testosterone, if athletic organizations need to do
    more than a simple bodily fluid test. Perhaps they need to sequester
    questionable athletes for a given period and monitor the relevant
    levels. That might be fairer in determining cheaters.

    Anyone with relevant medical/chemical training who can comment?

    Jeff

  2. That's what they do. They make multiple control. No matter how high you
    are (no joke (well, maybe), I am talking about your level of substance
    X), they check if your level is fairly constant, or if you have a peak
    at one time. When your level just rised by a few 10x, it's likely
    unormal. Also, don't underestimate the testing agencies.. they know
    that they are testing atlethes and not Mr. Everybody...

    Another thing, high level of hormones are not alway "natural", even
    though no drugs had been taken. I heard many stories about teenagers
    atlethes that took some "growing hormones", because doing a lot of sport
    can reduce/alter your normal growth, and when they become adults, their
    hormones levels are far higher than anybody else (and the teenagers that
    refused the hormones, once adults, have normal atlethes level).

    Jean

    Quoted message said:

    Bottom line: I'm wondering, when it comes to naturally occuring
    substances, such as testosterone, if athletic organizations need to do
    more than a simple bodily fluid test. Perhaps they need to sequester
    questionable athletes for a given period and monitor the relevant
    levels. That might be fairer in determining cheaters.

    Anyone with relevant medical/chemical training who can comment?

    Jeff

  3. Jean H. said:

    That's what they do. They make multiple control. No matter how high you
    are (no joke (well, maybe), I am talking about your level of substance
    X), they check if your level is fairly constant, or if you have a peak
    at one time. When your level just rised by a few 10x, it's likely
    unormal. Also, don't underestimate the testing agencies.. they know
    that they are testing atlethes and not Mr. Everybody...

    Another thing, high level of hormones are not alway "natural", even
    though no drugs had been taken. I heard many stories about teenagers
    atlethes that took some "growing hormones", because doing a lot of sport
    can reduce/alter your normal growth, and when they become adults, their
    hormones levels are far higher than anybody else (and the teenagers that
    refused the hormones, once adults, have normal atlethes level).

    Jean

    Quoted message said:

    Bottom line: I'm wondering, when it comes to naturally occuring
    substances, such as testosterone, if athletic organizations need to do
    more than a simple bodily fluid test. Perhaps they need to sequester
    questionable athletes for a given period and monitor the relevant
    levels. That might be fairer in determining cheaters.

    Anyone with relevant medical/chemical training who can comment?

    Jeff


    Ahhh,
    One side effect is that it sometimes causes enough overexertion to cause
    even a teenager to have a heart attack. You may FEEL like the God of the
    sport, but you are as mortal as the guy next to you.
    I remember stories from news long past of a 19 year old dying of a heart
    attack, probably pushed too hard by his coach, a 29 year old pro dying
    of same, a bicycle racer (friend of Lance's) dying of a heart attack,
    and one black Olympic champion (Flo-Jo, or Jackie Joyner??) dying at 39.
    Is it worth it?
    Not to me.
    Bill Baka
    I am fairly sure someone with lots of time can Google these.

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