Cadence update 2

WibbleWobble said the following on 26/07/2006 23:19:

Quoted message said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

After the intial probs tiring out if legs rotated too fast my average speed
has gone up 15-20% (really!) and I get a steady aerobic 60rpm rhythm which
is fine for my 19 stone body, and...I've lost 1.5 stones since recently
restarted cycling and eating better!

That's excellent news! You're doing better at losing weight than me,
although I do have a 5 stone head start :-) That's what all the gears
are for on a reasonably modern bike - so you can always be in just the
one you need.

Quoted message said:

This fat bloke basically outruns 90% of other cycists which must be a bit of
a shock to them, blubber overtaking.

It's when you can do it on a three-speed shopping bike that it gets fun,
especially if you're overtaking a lycra lout!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

Paul Boyd said:

Quoted message said:

This fat bloke basically outruns 90% of other cycists which must be a bit of
a shock to them, blubber overtaking.

It's when you can do it on a three-speed shopping bike that it gets fun,
especially if you're overtaking a lycra lout!

All time time on my brompton (many re-overtake me when they jump the
next red lights though, giving me another opportunity to pass them)

I don't understand why people don't use gears though, half the cyclists
I see are in a very high gear when they try to set off, and therefore
have very poor acceleration, it's very confusing.

Paul Weaver said the following on 27/07/2006 08:33:

Quoted message said:

I don't understand why people don't use gears though, half the cyclists
I see are in a very high gear when they try to set off, and therefore
have very poor acceleration, it's very confusing.

Or if they're under 15 they try to race you pedalling at 200rpm!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

WibbleWobble said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

Excellent!

I'd suggest that after a period at 60-70 you try going for 80-90. You may
or may not find it better, but it should certainly be tried.

--
Arthur Clune

"Paul Boyd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

WibbleWobble said the following on 26/07/2006 23:19:

Quoted message said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm
to 60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

After the intial probs tiring out if legs rotated too fast my average
speed has gone up 15-20% (really!) and I get a steady aerobic 60rpm
rhythm which is fine for my 19 stone body, and...I've lost 1.5 stones
since recently restarted cycling and eating better!

That's excellent news! You're doing better at losing weight than me,
although I do have a 5 stone head start :-) That's what all the gears are
for on a reasonably modern bike - so you can always be in just the one you
need.

Quoted message said:

This fat bloke basically outruns 90% of other cycists which must be a bit
of a shock to them, blubber overtaking.

It's when you can do it on a three-speed shopping bike that it gets fun,
especially if you're overtaking a lycra lout!

I noticed that a great many cyclists do just like I used to do, which is
stay in too high a gear - maybe because he initial cadence of 60-70 tires
them out too much.
On todays ride, I got a funny look from a teenager on an MTB whom I
overtook. He then tried mashing hard to catch up, gained some, but ran out
of steam and dropped out! Makes me feel 20 years younger! :-)
-Joe

"Arthur Clune" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

WibbleWobble said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm
to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

Excellent!

I'd suggest that after a period at 60-70 you try going for 80-90. You may
or may not find it better, but it should certainly be tried.

--
Arthur Clune

Do you mean 80-90 all the time?!? Yikes, I find that 75 is about my limit
for a short while, then I drop back. Is there any advantage over 60rpm in
terms of efficency?

WibbleWobble said the following on 27/07/2006 13:20:

Quoted message said:

Makes me feel 20 years younger! :-)

People will pay a fortune for that!!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

WibbleWobble said the following on 27/07/2006 13:22:

Quoted message said:

Do you mean 80-90 all the time?!? Yikes, I find that 75 is about my limit
for a short while, then I drop back. Is there any advantage over 60rpm in
terms of efficency?

You will need to work up to that, same as you worked up to 60 from 30.
I use around 70-80 (IIRC) all the time. As to efficiency, it feels
better than anything much below 60! (TdF riders will be at about 110rpm
on a huge chainring and a silly little rear sprocket!)

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

WibbleWobble said:

Do you mean 80-90 all the time?!? Yikes, I find that 75 is about my limit
for a short while, then I drop back.

You probably found 60 was a bit of a stretch after being at 30... it's
a progressive thing, it gets easier the more you work on it.

Quoted message said:

Is there any advantage over 60rpm in
terms of efficency?

In the longer term, higher cadences (I've heard ~80 quoted) are fully
aerobic so you can (with practice) maintain them for longer without
suddenly running out of Go (aka "the bonk"😉.

So as Arthur suggests, worth a bit of work, but if it's ultimately not
for you it's not the end of the world.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

"Paul Boyd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Paul Weaver said the following on 27/07/2006 08:33:

Quoted message said:

I don't understand why people don't use gears though, half the cyclists
I see are in a very high gear when they try to set off, and therefore
have very poor acceleration, it's very confusing.

Or if they're under 15 they try to race you pedalling at 200rpm!
--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

....on a full-sus MTB that's about a clear foot too large!
--
Jim

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

WibbleWobble said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

Excellent!

I'd suggest that after a period at 60-70 you try going for 80-90. You may
or may not find it better, but it should certainly be tried.

Wot 'e said. Or more so. On my geared machinery, if the cadence drops
below 100 rpm it's time to change down.

The fixer said I hit 69 km/h on the way home from work last week. Doing
some sums suggests that this corresponds to a cadence of > 220 rpm.

I suspect speedo error.

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
I thought I saw his name on a jar of marmalade the other day, but when I
looked more closely, I saw it read 'thick cut'.

WibbleWobble said:

"Arthur Clune" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

WibbleWobble said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm
to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

Excellent!

I'd suggest that after a period at 60-70 you try going for 80-90. You may
or may not find it better, but it should certainly be tried.

--
Arthur Clune

Do you mean 80-90 all the time?!? Yikes, I find that 75 is about my limit
for a short while, then I drop back. Is there any advantage over 60rpm in
terms of efficency?

You'll get there gradually - it'll happen.

Paul Weaver said:

I don't understand why people don't use gears though, half the cyclists
I see are in a very high gear when they try to set off, and therefore
have very poor acceleration, it's very confusing.

Now I'm on fixed, I don't understand why people use gears so much. 😉

"Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

WibbleWobble said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm
to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

Excellent!

I'd suggest that after a period at 60-70 you try going for 80-90. You may
or may not find it better, but it should certainly be tried.

Wot 'e said. Or more so. On my geared machinery, if the cadence drops
below 100 rpm it's time to change down.

The fixer said I hit 69 km/h on the way home from work last week. Doing
some sums suggests that this corresponds to a cadence of > 220 rpm.

I suspect speedo error.

Either that or it's the engine you installed ;-)

Dave Larrington said:

The fixer said I hit 69 km/h on the way home from work last week. Doing
some sums suggests that this corresponds to a cadence of > 220 rpm.

I suspect speedo error.

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
I thought I saw his name on a jar of marmalade the other day, but when I
looked more closely, I saw it read 'thick cut'.

I got to 60km/hour the other day on my fixed, though I suspect I have
rather higher gearing than yours. I think ~178rpm on 48x18, which is
my highest by far.

Good and experienced fixers can apparently hit the 200, I am neither of
course.

In article <[email hidden]>

Peter Clinch said:

WibbleWobble said:

Do you mean 80-90 all the time?!? Yikes, I find that 75 is about my limit
for a short while, then I drop back.

You probably found 60 was a bit of a stretch after being at 30... it's
a progressive thing, it gets easier the more you work on it.

Quoted message said:

Is there any advantage over 60rpm in
terms of efficency?

In the longer term, higher cadences (I've heard ~80 quoted) are fully
aerobic so you can (with practice) maintain them for longer without
suddenly running out of Go (aka "the bonk"😉.

The bonk isn't about aerobic versus anaerobic effort, it's what can
happen when you've used up your body's supply of glycogen and start to
burn fat instead. If you push too hard and your glycogen reserves drop
below a critical level before your body has a chance to start
metabolising fat, you will experience weakness and nausea and can bonk
out, rather like the non-Duracell bunny.
You can postpone this by ingesting plenty of carbohydrates before and
during any prolonged period of exercise. Endurance training lets your
metabolism get used to glycogen depletion, so the transition from
glycogen burning to fat burning happens smoothly.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Paul Weaver said:

I don't understand why people don't use gears though, half the cyclists
I see are in a very high gear when they try to set off, and therefore
have very poor acceleration, it's very confusing.

Now I'm on fixed, I don't understand why people use gears so much. 😉

Now I'm doing 28 Scenic km each way to work, I find myself wishing that
the old recumberumbler had a few more...

Actually this is Not True, though I /am/ actively considering the
purchase of one of these:

<URL:http://abundantadventures.com/mt_triple.html>

for the trike, if only to see the expressions on Their faces as they see
me in a 16/34 gear...

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Electricity comes from other planets.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I got to 60km/hour the other day on my fixed, though I suspect I have
rather higher gearing than yours. I think ~178rpm on 48x18, which is
my highest by far.

I'm on 44x18 and have yet to see a genuine figure higher than about 55
km/h. The same hill is good for 72 km/h (so far) on the Speedmachine.

Quoted message said:

Good and experienced fixers can apparently hit the 200, I am neither of
course.

Indeed. I have seen Mr. Chadwick doing so, and it looks, er, scary.

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Electricity comes from other planets.

Following on from WibbleWobble's message. . .

Quoted message said:

Re my previous post about cadence. Tried it for a while. Up from 30rpm to
60-70rpm with plenty of gearchanges.

After the intial probs tiring out if legs rotated too fast my average speed
has gone up 15-20% (really!) and I get a steady aerobic 60rpm rhythm which
is fine for my 19 stone body, and...I've lost 1.5 stones since recently
restarted cycling and eating better!

All good news.

A couple of 'advanced' points worth noting when working at stretching
your capabilities and using your gears.

1
It takes at least 10 minutes for every bit of your body to get into the
swing of working hard and in harmony with the others. Despite knowing
this I still get surprised when I start of with a 'today will be a slow
no-hurry day' only to find myself flying along 20 minutes later.

2
The occasional sprint, for example blasting up a short hill, might
clobber you for a minute or two but is (a) satisfying when you do them,
(b) even more satisfying when you repeat a month later and its so much
easier and (c) helps to build strength.

Tip for bursting up hills: Suppose you've just come down to the bottom
of a U and are now about to head up the other side. It is quite
critical that you're in exactly the right gear and you are settled into
a power stroke rhythm _at the bottom, before the climb._ This can most
easily be described as 'piling on the coal a handful of seconds before
the hill starts'. Most definitely the /wrong/ way (if the hill is
sprintable) is to glide up some way before getting stuck in. For one
thing your speed is changing so quickly that it's difficult to find the
most effective gear.

Finally: Don't be fooled by the above discussion into thinking I'm a
super athlete. This time of year I do 14mph ish to the pub and 13mph
ish back for perhaps a 20 mile round trip. And since I've spent a
fortune in beer to achieve my figure I've no intention of following
outrageous suggestions of losing 1.5 pounds let alone 1.5 STONE!

Keep up the good work. You'll soon be at 80.

--
PETER FOX Not the same since the borehole business dried up
[email hidden]
www.eminent.demon.co.uk - Lots for cyclists