Spokes

Wilfred Kazoks said:

I have seen spokes that are thicker at the ends than the middle. I managed
to find some via Google called DT ALPINE III.
http://www.dtswiss.com/index.asp?fuseaction=spokes.bikedetail&id=6

They're called butted spokes.

Quoted message said:

Are these type of spokes really worthwhile?

It depends. Read this : http://www.sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html

Quoted message said:

Are there other brands of similar spokes?

yes

Quoted message said:

Where in Melbourne can I get them. I am in the Eastern suburbs. Do they cost
a lot?

They're more expensive than straight spokes, and any LBS will sell them
to you.

(did I just get trolled by Bratton?)

I just got 34 silver DT Revolutions at Bicycle Recycle for under 50 bucks!!

http://www.dtswiss.com/index.asp?fuseaction=spokes.bikedetail&id=4

A couple of other shops tried to charge me more than that for 2mm silver DT Champions (the basic, non-butted DT)!! :eek: Most other shops will rip you off, so make sure you go down there. Bicycle Recycle are in South Rd., Moorabbin, about 300m up from Warrigal Rd.: 9555 8692. This shop usually sells the straight DTs for 90c each!

The Revolutions saved me about 90g on the front wheel I just built (292mm spokes). I'm no weight weenie, but I thought, for an extra 20 bucks, why not go for the light ones.

Other brands common, good brands are Wheelsmith and Sapim, but these seem a little harder to get than DTs.

http://www.wheelsmith.com/
http://www.sapim.be/

How did you find building with the Revs? Some mechanics hate them and
are scared of using them on the back wheel - they only want to use them
on the non-drive side.

Donga

531Aussie said:

I just got 34 silver DT Revolutions at Bicycle Recycle for under 50
bucks!!

http://www.dtswiss.com/index.asp?fuseaction=spokes.bikedetail&id=4

A couple of other shops tried to charge me more than that for 2mm
silver DT Champions (the basic, non-butted DT). Most other shops will
rip you off, so make sure you go down there.

I think we do basic 14 guage DT Champions for $1 each from memory.
The aerolites, on the other hand ... *ouch*

Donga said:

How did you find building with the Revs? Some mechanics hate them and
are scared of using them on the back wheel - they only want to use them
on the non-drive side.

Donga

I recently built up both front and rear with DT Revolutions with Velocity Aeroheat rims. Nice light wheels but tricky to build and for my riding style not heavy enough, I keep knocking them out of true and have damaged the front rim hopping up though more likely down kerbs. Back to DT Comp and Velocity Aeros, bit heavier but the last one i built up were bombproof and lasted true and straight until i wore out the braking surfaces.

CC

Donga said:

How did you find building with the Revs? Some mechanics hate them and
are scared of using them on the back wheel - they only want to use them
on the non-drive side.

I'm no mechanic -- I've probably built less than 10 wheels in my life -- but the build for this Mavic CXP33 front wheel was fine. I'm about 90kg, so, despite the 'science' saying that butted spokes are stronge enough, and have the elastic-like properties, etc, I wouldn't use them for a rear wheel. Perhaps that's just me, but when the guy at the shop handed me the bundled-up Revolutions, I couldn't believe how light and floppy they were. Comparing them to the straight DTS is like night and day!

As cogcontrol has just intimated (above), a 30mm deep rim with DT Champions is almost indestructable!! I have 3 CXP30 rears, and 3 old Rigida DP18 rears, and they are all totally indestructable!! 🙂

531Aussie said:

Donga said:

How did you find building with the Revs? Some mechanics hate them and
are scared of using them on the back wheel - they only want to use
them
on the non-drive side.I'm no mechanic -- I've probably built less than 10 wheels in my life --

but the build for this Mavic CXP33 front wheel was fine. I'm about 90kg,
so, despite the 'science' saying that butted spokes are stronge enough,
and have the elastic-like properties, etc, I wouldn't use them for a
rear wheel. Perhaps that's just me, but when the guy at the shop handed
me the bundled-up Revolutions, I couldn't believe how light and floppy
they were. Comparing them to the straight DTS is like night and day!

How floppy they are doesn't make much difference actually since spokes
can only take tension, they do not need to (and are incapable of)
resisting bending, sheer or torsional forces. If your spokes are
having to resist other forces, its usually because the wheel hasn't
been built properly or the parts aren't compatible.

The elasticity can have a very beneficial impact on overall wheel
strength and can help minimise metal fatigue, the major cause (from an
engineering point of view) of most spoke failures.

(A fatigue failure can be recognised by the nature of the break, it
breaks neatly through brittle crack propagation and the two bits
usually fit back together. Failures from extreme tension have a
characteristic ductile failure mode and the break area is so distorted
that the pieces do not fit together.)

Disclaimer: I've not done any engineering since university and I'm a
little rusty, but I did read Jobst Brandt's wheel book over the weekend
(once) and my recollection of what was in the book could be wrong since
I only spent an hour or so reading it.... See
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/

Brandt was also scathing of "aero" spokes by the way, I'll be swapping
my blades for swaged (butted) round spokes at my next wheelbuild.

Travis