General fitness, health and nutrition · Public discussion

Re: Is oily fish really healthy?

Started by montygram · · Last activity · 2 posts · 227 views

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
29 March 2006
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30 March 2006
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montygram
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  1. For those who want a concise explanation of what is wrong with the
    "science" behind omega 3 claims:

    The professional nutritional literature points out how dangerous omega
    3s can be. New studies, however, do not pay any attention to how long
    animals live if they are fed diets high in omega 3s. Instead, they
    look for "markers" considered "bad." If the omega 3s lower the amount
    of these markers, they can claim that omega 3s are "good." Few, if
    any, of these studies determine whether animals actually live longer
    when fed a high omega 3 diet. Few, if any, of these studies compare
    several different diets, but instead just compare a high safflower diet
    to one of a mixture of safflower oil and fish oil. Why not feed a
    group fresh coconut oil as their source of fat, for example, since it
    is undeniable that people on diets high in coconut products have hardly
    any "chronic disease?"

    The "markers" are mostly due to too much arachidonic acid (an omega 6
    polyunsaturated fatty acid), which is due to too much consumption of
    oils like safflower, sunflower, corn, vegetable, soybean, etc. When
    you switch to a mixture of safflower and fish oil, for example, you
    will get less of the "bad markers" that come from thee omega 6s, but
    you also get new molecules that are probably more dangerous than the
    old ones (due to the fact that fish oil is more biochemically unstable
    than safflower oil, and how young animals fed fish oil died in the old
    experiments that actually waited to see how long the animals lived).

    However, in most of these studies, they only look for certain markers,
    and so what they are doing is creating a false conclusion. Most people
    would rather have a long and healthy life, regarless of what "markers"
    are in their bodies. On the other hand, who would want to die young,
    but have wonderful "markers?" This is the Alice in Wonderland world
    these "researchers" are inhabiting these days. They are told that
    certain markers are good, while others are bad, and they never question
    whether this makes sense or in fact is false. They also tend to ignore
    old studies, and for some of these people, anything done in the 1990s
    is too old to take seriously, so you can see how such a sad state of
    affairs came to pass. They won't look at the old material, which
    determined actual mortality, but instead just focus on markers of "ill
    health," which are really just markers of arachidonic acid overload.
    Many things can attenuate arachiodonic acid overload, but not all of
    them are safe. Fish oil is one of the least unhealthy ways of
    attenuating arachidonic acid overload. And as I've said many times
    before, all you need to do to confirm this is to get some really
    inexpensive mice and feed them a few different diets, and see which
    group lives longer. It would take a few hundred dollars, but instead,
    we get these highly misleading (and much more expensive) studies of
    "markers."

  2. montygram said:

    For those who want a concise explanation of what is wrong with the
    "science" behind omega 3 claims:

    The professional nutritional literature points out how dangerous omega
    3s can be.

    Citations please.

    Quoted message said:

    They are told that
    certain markers are good, while others are bad, and they never question
    whether this makes sense or in fact is false.

    Which markers do you think aren't indicative of disease?

    Quoted message said:

    Many things can attenuate arachiodonic acid overload, but not all of
    them are safe. Fish oil is one of the least unhealthy ways of
    attenuating arachidonic acid overload.

    Do you mean least unhealthy or healthy? I thought your method of not
    eating any EFA was supposed to be best.

    Quoted message said:

    And as I've said many times
    before, all you need to do to confirm this is to get some really
    inexpensive mice and feed them a few different diets, and see which
    group lives longer. It would take a few hundred dollars, but instead,
    we get these highly misleading (and much more expensive) studies of
    "markers."

    Mice genetically modified to convert omega6 to omega3 don't die from
    the "dangerous" omega3 increase. On a diet high in omega6 and virtually
    no omega3, they end up with a 1:1 ratio and are healthy.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=14765186&query_hl=9&itool=pubmed_docsum

    Quoted message said:

    From the full text:

    "We have examined the tissue fatty-acid profiles in four generations of
    transgenic mouse lines (homozygote or heterozygote) and find
    consistently raised n-3 fatty acids, indicating that the transgene is
    functionally active in vivo and transmittable. The transgenic mice
    appear to be normal and healthy."

    Notice that *four* generations of mice have successfully bred in a
    situation where their tissues are high in omega 6 and 3.

    MattLB

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