Petaluma Tragedy

Dan Abel sez:

Quoted message said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

A hundred employees, an US$8 million a year business.

Quoted message said:

Dan Abel
[email hidden]
Petaluma, California, USA

Oh, I know this place (rather, I know of it); it has a terrific reputation
and an equally-terrific product. How sad! I truly do *hate* this kind of
story, particularly when it concerns an area which, once quite rural, has
become a suburban destination. That whole area used to "stink," from
chicken farms no less.

Down this way, the former prolific orchard that was the Santa Clara Valley
has seen the NIMBY phenononom for years; on the plus side, there are a few
generational holdouts who refuse to sell their valuable patches of green in
the face of every-mounting pressure. Olson's cherry orchard finally gave up
the ghost several years ago.

Sigh . . .

Spitz
--
"Mind the runner beans!"

"Dan Abel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A hundred employees, an US$8 million a year business.

http://petmushroom.org/docs/sun062602.html

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of property
rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least should be--the
freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't care if they have
been there for 1000 years, they have no right to spread foul odors on my
property.

--
Peter Aitken

"Peter Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Dan Abel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A hundred employees, an US$8 million a year business.

http://petmushroom.org/docs/sun062602.html

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of property
rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least should be--the
freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't care if they have
been there for 1000 years, they have no right to spread foul odors on my
property.

I agree if you were there first. If, OTOH, you bought property near a farm
then there is no way they should have to close shop to cater to your nose.

I'm familiar with one rural community that has potential property buyers
come and spend time in the community. They are told "If you buy, you are
moving into a farming community. This is what a farming community smells
like. If you don't like that, don't buy. If you do buy, don't come crying
to us to do anything about the 'odour's that you don't like -- we were there
first."

This is the same as people who build or buy houses next to an airport and
then raise a ruckus because of the noise planes make. We live near an
airport. One idiot built a fox farm at the end of one of the runways. Due
to prevailing winds, this end of this particular runway is not used very
often, but should there be an emergency (not a rare thing where you have 4
or 5 different airforces training) and there is a landing at that end, sure
as God made little green apples the next day that guy is suing for damage to
his farm due to his vixens being stressed by the noise. Buddy! There are
thousands of acres of vacant land you could have bought and built on, why in
hell did you pick right at the end of a runway?????

Gabby

Peter Aitken said:

"Dan Abel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A hundred employees, an US$8 million a year business.

http://petmushroom.org/docs/sun062602.html

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of property
rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least should be--the
freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't care if they have
been there for 1000 years, they have no right to spread foul odors on my
property.

even when they have demonstrated willingness to move the composting
facility to another location?

--

saerah

http://anisaerah.blogspot.com/

"Peace is not an absence of war, it is a virtue, a state of mind, a
disposition for benevolence, confidence, justice."
-Baruch Spinoza

"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly
what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There
is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-Douglas Adams

"Dan Abel" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

Damn shame. People moved down here, moved into McMansions on what
were cornfields the year before and started right away [censored] about the
remaining farm property being used, you know, tractors and all that?

Too bad, it's zoned farm use, farm use it stays. Tractors and all that.

nancy

Dan Abel said:

Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A quick correction: Compost can be made of any fresh organic matter.
You can compost dandelions, and you can compost roadkill. It doesn't
have to be [censored].

--Lia

He picked the one at the end of the runway because it was cheaper. The
reason it was cheaper is because everyone knew the noise was an issue.
He paid for the property at a price set BECAUSE it was noisy, and now
want to complain about it, just like Peter. BTW, I'm buying the house
next to Peter. I am sensitive to grass cutting, car exhaust, and smoke
from grilling, so Peter can expect to quit all of these things, because
BY GOD, I have RIGHTS !!! </sarcasm>

Dean G.

"Peter Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Dan Abel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A hundred employees, an US$8 million a year business.

http://petmushroom.org/docs/sun062602.html

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of property
rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least should be--the
freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't care if they have
been there for 1000 years, they have no right to spread foul odors on my
property.

LOL - Peter, you remind me of all the people in Rosemont and Des Plaines IL
who moved into the villages...and then promptly started screaming about
O'Hare airport and the noisy planes.

If I buy/build a house downwind from a pig farm, if I've checked out the
area, I *know* there's a pig farm upwind from me. Whose property rights
become more important, the existing pig farmer (who has the right to utilize
his property also), or me-the-recent-arrival?

Doug has a point; you buy a house around certain businesses, you're going to
have to expect a smell problem. You buy a house near an airport, you're
going to have a noise problem. Why should your property rights supercede
the property rights of the existing business?

That being said, IMO, it's only pig [censored] that stinks that bad...cow and
horse manure can be almost pleasant.

Why yes, I did grow up in the boonies...why do you ask? 😉

Lisa Ann

"Lisa Ann" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

That being said, IMO, it's only pig [censored] that stinks that bad...cow and
horse manure can be almost pleasant.

I agree. My mother used to call the smell of cow manure "a healthy smell".
Mucking a stable is a lot more pleasant than cleaning an incontinent
patient, but I just couldn't convince my farmer father of that. ;o)

Quoted message said:

Why yes, I did grow up in the boonies...why do you ask? 😉

As did I. Nothing wrong with the boonies.

Gabby

"Dean G." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

He picked the one at the end of the runway because it was cheaper.

Since it was crown land I don't think there was any difference in price. I
think he just did it to be contrary -- it's in his nature. And it was
probably conveniently close to his home.

The

Quoted message said:

reason it was cheaper is because everyone knew the noise was an issue.
He paid for the property at a price set BECAUSE it was noisy, and now
want to complain about it, just like Peter. BTW, I'm buying the house
next to Peter. I am sensitive to grass cutting, car exhaust, and smoke
from grilling, so Peter can expect to quit all of these things, because
BY GOD, I have RIGHTS !!! </sarcasm>

Dean G.

Lisa Ann said:

area, I *know* there's a pig farm upwind from me. Whose property rights
become more important, the existing pig farmer (who has the right to utilize
his property also), or me-the-recent-arrival?

The one with the most money to buy off local politicos.

nb

Julia Altshuler said:

Dan Abel said:

Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A quick correction: Compost can be made of any fresh organic matter.
You can compost dandelions, and you can compost roadkill. It doesn't
have to be [censored].

--Lia

I'm sorry, but this reminds me of when I was a hostess at a restaurant and
the landscaping guys came and spread really crappy <G> compost in the front
flower beds right outside the restaurant door. It wasn't exactly a pleasant
way for the guests to be greeted (nor me, who had to stand right inside the
door for hours). But it didn't stop people from coming in and eating.

Jill

On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 21:09:11 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
<[email hidden]> rummaged among random neurons and opined:

Quoted message said:

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of property
rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least should be--the
freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't care if they have
been there for 1000 years, they have no right to spread foul odors on my
property.

Peter, if you move into a place that has an existing facility that
exudes a foul odor, that's *your* problem. It's kinda like moving to
Baghdad and complaining about the gunfire. If you find a place you're
considering for purchase that has something offensive to you in a
neighbor and buy the place anyway, who's at fault here? You buy a
place abutting the I-5 and complain about the traffic noise? Caveat
emptor, IMHO.

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

--
"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"

jmcquown wrote on 03 Feb 2006 in rec.food.cooking

Quoted message said:

Julia Altshuler said:

Dan Abel said:

Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A quick correction: Compost can be made of any fresh organic
matter. You can compost dandelions, and you can compost roadkill.
It doesn't have to be [censored].

--Lia

I'm sorry, but this reminds me of when I was a hostess at a restaurant
and the landscaping guys came and spread really crappy <G> compost in
the front flower beds right outside the restaurant door. It wasn't
exactly a pleasant way for the guests to be greeted (nor me, who had
to stand right inside the door for hours). But it didn't stop people
from coming in and eating.

Jill

Mushrooms are now grown in the mash left from beer breweries, seems it is
cheaper than [censored] and grows mushrooms faster and better.

--
The eyes are the mirrors....
But the ears...Ah the ears.
The ears keep the hat up.

On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 23:36:50 GMT, "Lisa Ann" <[email hidden]>
rummaged among random neurons and opined:

Quoted message said:

That being said, IMO, it's only pig [censored] that stinks that bad...cow and
horse manure can be almost pleasant.

Ooohhh, I guess you haven't been tooling around the Inland Empire in
California in July. The DH's father, God rest him, lived in Hemet and
we used to go out many weekends to visit, which meant we had to go
through mile after mile of dairy farms (yer Land'o'Lakes dairies were
numerous, which might surprise you Mini-sodans). Even with the windows
up and the air conditioning blasting, at 110°F, the stench could make
your eyes water. There was a restaurant that was boarded up for years,
right on the corner of one of the dairy farms <head shaking> I'm
thinkin' that a restaurant on top of a dairy farm is not conducive to
a roaring clientele.

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

--
"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"

In article <[email hidden]>,

Julia Altshuler said:

Dan Abel said:

Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A quick correction: Compost can be made of any fresh organic matter.
You can compost dandelions, and you can compost roadkill. It doesn't
have to be [censored].

Depends. If you want to grow mushrooms, it needs to be made out of
[censored]. Horseshit. Preferably from a girl's riding academy. No [censored].

I don't know that much about it, but mushrooms are very exacting when it
comes to their growing medium. It's a very exact science:

http://www.angelfire.com/co/mycosociety/cult3.html

--
Dan Abel
[email hidden]
Petaluma, California, USA

Terry Pulliam Burd <[email hidden]> hitched up their panties
and posted news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 21:09:11 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
<[email hidden]> rummaged among random neurons and opined:

Quoted message said:

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of
property rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least
should be--the freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't
care if they have been there for 1000 years, they have no right to
spread foul odors on my property.

Peter, if you move into a place that has an existing facility that
exudes a foul odor, that's *your* problem. It's kinda like moving to
Baghdad and complaining about the gunfire. If you find a place you're
considering for purchase that has something offensive to you in a
neighbor and buy the place anyway, who's at fault here? You buy a
place abutting the I-5 and complain about the traffic noise? Caveat
emptor, IMHO.

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

I agree Terry. There is a plot of land on McKnight Road that used to be a
nursery. The nursery folded. Yesterday I noticed a big sign on the land.
Someone is building luxury apartments on it and using bragging rights that
it's right next to Tilles Park. Well... it's not. Those apartments will
overlook the landfill in Rock Hill (UGH). Yes, it is literally a dump that
the tennants will have a view of. I'm sure the place will not have a
pleasant odor in the summer heat either.

I suppose my point is; research the area before you move into it.

Michael

--
“It requires a certain kind of mind to see beauty in a hamburger bun.”
_Ray Kroc, creator of the McDonald's franchise

Dan Abel said:

Read in the paper this morning that the Petaluma Mushroom Farm is giving
up. They were victims of NIMBY. The neighbors didn't like the smell.
The business was there 28 years. I wonder how long these neighbors were
there? Maybe they shouldn't have bought there? Mushrooms are made with
compost. Compost is made out of [censored]. [censored] stinks.

A hundred employees, an US$8 million a year business.

http://petmushroom.org/docs/sun062602.html

After reading the article, I'm not particularly sympathetic to their
situation. First, it looks like the company has been there since
1973, but not at that size. What was once acceptable at a particular
location, may be a problem when magnified.

The area is zoned rural/residential, not commercial so people do have
a reasonable expectation to buy habitable property. Plus, the people
who owned the surrounding properties over the past couple of decades
before the facility mushroomed, so to speak, shouldn't have to have
their property values plummet because the mushroom farm has grown into
big agribusiness. Yes, the area is rural and there are smells to be
expected, but a composting facility is a processing plant not a farm.

Second, it's not like this company has been good citizens. Illegally
discharging pesticide-contaminated wastewater into the environment,
gross violations of building regulations, and employing more people
than the county approved, presumably to avoid tax repercussions....

Finally, this smell is essentially air pollution, why not look for a
technological solution?

Perhaps as the neighbors' complaints grew over the years, they should
have been donating some of that annual $8 million to a local
engineering school for research into technology to reduce the smell of
their operation rather than trying to bulldoze their way to a permit.
They might have even ended up with a patent, if not placated
neighbors.

Or move to an industrial area where they belong. 🙂
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!

Peter Aitken said:

Too bad in some ways but life moves on. Have you ever heard of property
rights? One of my rights as a propery owner is--or at least should be--the
freedom from unpleasant smells from a neighbor. I don't care if they have
been there for 1000 years, they have no right to spread foul odors on my
property.

If they were there first, they should have seniority. I currently
live in a little suburby area which used to be the corral where cattle
hung out before being loaded onto trains. We're still surrounded by cow
farms, which are delightfully stinky. You can't open the windows. But
they were here first and they have every right to use their land for
what they want. It's their land, not yours! If you don't like the
stinky neighborhood, move to where it's not stinky. (Or maybe people
shouldn't move to a stinky neighborhood and then expect everyone to bend
over backwards just to accomodate them. Selfish!)

Stacia