Windtrainer 101 - Lesson 1

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DaveB said:

I got my windtrainer setup yesterday and had a test ride. Now I need to
put some planning into when I'm going to use it and what kind of workout
to do. The main aim right now is the Geelong Tri in mid-April which will
be 40km with some rolling hills and likely to be some good winds. I'm
already doing one or two commutes a week plus a long hilly ride on the
weekend. The windtrainer is aimed at me getting better at maintaining a
TT pace over an hour (I'll do the 40km at 30kmh so will take about 1hr20).

So assuming I can fit in one or two sessions a week on the windtrainer,
what should I be aiming to do and what sort of heart rate zones should I
be working on (usually in 155-165 in the bike leg to save something for
the run).

Also in the test ride yesterday, what felt like hard riding to me only
had the heart rate to around 140bpm. Should I base HR on the wind
trainer so that it is comparable to what I would do on the road?

Has anyone come across some good training programs on the Internet for
wind trainers. There are heaps of run and swim programs out there but
can't see much cycling.

DaveB

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on trainer your HR will be considerably less than on the road for the same quality effort, as you are only really using the legs on the trainer. I worked with Rod Cedaro for 12 months and his programs had me at roughly 8-10 BPM less on the trainer compared to the road (wish he told me that at the start of the program - for 4 weeks i did base work on the trainer and was wondering why I was so trashed - I was working at "road" HR as against trainer)

in terms of what you should be doing to prepare for Geelong, i'll that to others better qualified - are you there Bleve???? That person might also need to have a better feel for your current level of fitness

trainer hours are mind-numbingly boring - there's nothing surer. It almost makes swimming seem like a thrill-a-minute. Get the mp3 player out, or lash out and buy some cycle training dvd's - hell, anything to pass the time. there's little to do on a trainer other than concentrate on the pain building in your legs

monsterman said:

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trainer hours are mind-numbingly boring - there's nothing surer. It almost makes swimming seem like a thrill-a-minute. Get the mp3 player out, or lash out and buy some cycle training dvd's - hell, anything to pass the time. there's little to do on a trainer other than concentrate on the pain building in your legs

you havnt mentioned cadence....

Carl may have an opinion on this more suited to tri, but why on earth do we see so many of the tri riders rolling around on a big gear thrashing (many, at times below 30kph), at slow rpms wearing out their knees when they could spin and save muscle condition, energy and work at better output for a lower heart rate..

for me my rule of thumb is only hit the big chain ring over 30klm per hour ( along with the other one of arm and leg warmers below 20 degrees C, but that's another item)...and always try and maintain 100rpm cadence for the whole session or ride, be able to spin out to 130-150 for sprints or last 200 meters etc..or higher if you have track aspirations.

wattage is vital of course , but few other than elite riders can maintain max wattage for more than 15-20 secs , if that....without dizzy eratic riding cramps or total dissolving into a blithering heap....

When I'm OS, I get to speak to a heap of riders who are forced to use wind trainers due to Nthn Hemisphere climate extremes and many concentrate on spinning first then endurance then power...and last but not least the importance of recovery, both on the bike and off it.

ahhh training.....ahhh sunshine...ahhhh goat

DaveB wrote -

Quoted message said:

Has anyone come across some good training programs on the Internet for
wind trainers.

Having spent a fair bit of time on ergos and windtrainers - IMHO there are
three essential things that will enable you to get some real benefits from
them, they being -

1. a coach (human)
2. an industrial strength fan
3. music that moves you (about the only safe place to cycle with an mp3
player)

It is absolutely VITAL to get a knowledgeable coach to see what level you
are at, where your deficiencies are, and how to structure a program that
moves you down the path to the goals you want to achieve.

Unless you have done a coaching course, self coaching is much less likely to
succeed - its the gradual building of lactate tolerance, strength and
endurance over time that really will do you some good - and there is much
wisdom and experience in getting that right - easily misinterpreted over the
net or from reading any of the quite good books out there.

I did a year of ergo sessions twice a week for a year and improved from e to
b grades at club level and I never was much of an athlete - keen, but the
power to weight ain't impressive. Those sessions made the difference - but
only because I was building to a program devised by someone who had been
there, done that themselves.

This has been the experience of others in my club who have gone to the iron
maiden in the garage to improve their cycling (in addition to doing their
usual outside rides).

Do not do this at home without a program devised by someone who knows what
they are doing or it is likely you will be wasting your time, and boring
yourself silly to no useful purpose.

If you do follow an well structured program, look for an improvement on the
road (esp say on a time trial course, where there are less factors in play
about whether you have improved) in 4 to 6 weeks and it will be significant
measurable and repeatable.

As to the other bits - the fan mimics the wind and controls the copious
quantities of sweat you will produce. The music lessens the boredom and
makes the sessions seem to go more quickly.

A means of measuring cadence and heart rate is pretty useful (the more
recent Polar's do both and can be used on other bikes as well) - but its the
constant application of effort in a structured program that will do it for
you, not the gizmos.

So find that coach before you do any serious time on the w/t - after seeing
and testing/assessing you they can write remote control programs for you but
you will I suspect need some initial face to face time.

best, Andrew

Andrew Price said:

DaveB wrote -

Quoted message said:

Has anyone come across some good training programs on the Internet for
wind trainers.

Do not do this at home without a program devised by someone who knows what
they are doing or it is likely you will be wasting your time, and boring
yourself silly to no useful purpose.

Well it's the Internet, and in terms of advice you get what you pay for,
but really, don't you think that's a bit over the top? I can accept that
a coach will help me get the most out of it, as it would be for almost
any sport. But saying it will be a waste of time without a coach is
ridiculous. I bought a second hand wind trainer because the budget
doesn't extend beyond that, it definitely doesn't extend to coaching.

DaveB

DaveB said:

Andrew Price said:

DaveB wrote -

Quoted message said:

Has anyone come across some good training programs on the Internet for
wind trainers.

Do not do this at home without a program devised by someone who knows what
they are doing or it is likely you will be wasting your time, and boring
yourself silly to no useful purpose.

Well it's the Internet, and in terms of advice you get what you pay for,
but really, don't you think that's a bit over the top? I can accept that
a coach will help me get the most out of it, as it would be for almost
any sport. But saying it will be a waste of time without a coach is
ridiculous. I bought a second hand wind trainer because the budget
doesn't extend beyond that, it definitely doesn't extend to coaching.

a. not all coaching is expensive (or even has a cost, a number of clubs
etc will offer free coaching - esp Tri clubs who are mainly focussed on
novices, you have looked into that, right?)

b. it is possible to not only waste your time, but also to set yourself
back by training "badly" (it's late, I've just gotten back from a
training camp at Hotham, forgive my berevity!).

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DaveB said:

Andrew Price wrote:
Well it's the Internet, and in terms of advice you get what you pay for,
but really, don't you think that's a bit over the top? I can accept that
a coach will help me get the most out of it, as it would be for almost
any sport. But saying it will be a waste of time without a coach is
ridiculous. I bought a second hand wind trainer because the budget
doesn't extend beyond that, it definitely doesn't extend to coaching.

DaveB

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Getting coached is certainly the best way to get max returns for effort, and to avoid junk miles and hours on the bike, but like you say, there are always the fiscal realities of life . . . . . . . . . . . .

I dont think Andrew was suggesting that you need to undertake a hardcore "on location with the super-coach" weekly $$$$$ program. If you can afford just one session with a coach, that person, armed with your LT (and there's plenty of info on the web on how to work that out with reas accuracy) and some basic info on your style, event goals, hours available to train etc etc, will be able to give you the fundamentals of a solid training program. One session might not break the bank. Some coaches will do much cheaper group rates if you and a mate(s) go. In that same session you could also get some feedback on overall bike fit, aero position, pedalling technique etc that may improve your current position and help you stay injury free.

Two more tips:

1. dont chuck out old crappy tyres - patch up cut ones, scrounge ones that might not have anough rubber to be safe on the road - and if you have to - buy some cheap [censored] hard as hell tyres. Wind trainers (except the ore expensive rim-drive ones) go through tyres like Oprah goes through cupcakes!!
   
2. Lastly - if you've got a spare a back wheel - make it the trainer wheel - save your good tyres for the road.
   

Bleve said:

a. not all coaching is expensive (or even has a cost, a number of clubs
etc will offer free coaching - esp Tri clubs who are mainly focussed on
novices, you have looked into that, right?)

Yep been checking out the local tri clubs but their training session
times don't suit (maybe later in the year when MBA studies have finally
finished).

Quoted message said:

b. it is possible to not only waste your time, but also to set yourself
back by training "badly" (it's late, I've just gotten back from a
training camp at Hotham, forgive my berevity!).

If someone said to me "I'm buying a wind trainer to get fit" then I'd be
worried they weren't going to achieve anything. In my case I've bought
it to slot in a specific session within a program. If I see it having an
adverse affect on my cycling or running then I'd adjust what I'm doing
(or give it away till after the main race).

DaveB

In article <[email hidden]>,

DaveB said:

Bleve said:

a. not all coaching is expensive (or even has a cost, a number of clubs
etc will offer free coaching - esp Tri clubs who are mainly focussed on
novices, you have looked into that, right?)

Yep been checking out the local tri clubs but their training session
times don't suit (maybe later in the year when MBA studies have finally
finished).

Quoted message said:

b. it is possible to not only waste your time, but also to set yourself
back by training "badly" (it's late, I've just gotten back from a
training camp at Hotham, forgive my berevity!).

If someone said to me "I'm buying a wind trainer to get fit" then I'd be
worried they weren't going to achieve anything. In my case I've bought
it to slot in a specific session within a program. If I see it having an
adverse affect on my cycling or running then I'd adjust what I'm doing
(or give it away till after the main race).

DaveB

Dave,

Not sure if this is much help but it is a start:
<http://www.cptips.com/toc.htm#table>
Read the sections on Offseason Training and Stationary Cycling.

Good luck with the training.

regards,
Darryl

darryl said:

Not sure if this is much help but it is a start:
<http://www.cptips.com/toc.htm#table>
Read the sections on Offseason Training and Stationary Cycling.

Wow, just followed that link. I think that might keep me in reading
material for a while.

DaveB