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Crampons

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
8 January 2006
Last activity
12 January 2006
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Office Pest
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  1. Evening all.

    I'm just back from a not entirely successful stroll up Snowdon. Myself
    and the others were without crampons, which was the end of the attempt
    up, as the sheet ice at the bottom of the zigzags (pyg/miners path)
    was impassable in my boots, or unwise to attempt.

    As I don't do a lot of winter walking, is there a cheap occasional use
    crampon that would be ideal for going over my Berghaus Explorer GTX
    boots? (without notches heel & toe for keeping crampons in the right
    place)

    I'm not looking to spend a fortune, as I don't have it, nor would I
    get a massive amount of use from them.

    Suggestions, if you would, please.

    Anyone else up there today?

  2. Office Pest OfficePest@officepest said:

    Evening all.

    I'm just back from a not entirely successful stroll up Snowdon. Myself
    and the others were without crampons, which was the end of the attempt
    up, as the sheet ice at the bottom of the zigzags (pyg/miners path)
    was impassable in my boots, or unwise to attempt.

    As I don't do a lot of winter walking, is there a cheap occasional use
    crampon that would be ideal for going over my Berghaus Explorer GTX
    boots? (without notches heel & toe for keeping crampons in the right
    place)

    Are these things any good ? (Haven't tried them myself).

    http://www.nevisport.com/detail.asp?StoreID=5&DepartmentID=95&CategoryID=188&Depth=3&ProductID=381013

    (that's Grivel Spider inset crampons, 19.99 in case the link doesn't work).

    -adrian

  3. Office Pest said:

    As I don't do a lot of winter walking, is there a cheap occasional use
    crampon that would be ideal for going over my Berghaus Explorer GTX
    boots? (without notches heel & toe for keeping crampons in the right
    place)

    Conventional wisdom says that boots have to be fairly sturdy to
    take crampons, both in the sole and the upper. The sole needs to
    be fairly stiff to avoid it moving independently of the crampon
    itself, while if the upper is too soft & flexible then the straps
    can end up cutting off circulation to your toes by the time you
    have them tight enough.

    But conventional wisdom can be over cautious at times, and I'd
    imagine that for the odd occasion when you need to cross a big
    sheet of ice then you'd manage fine if you were careful and made
    sure of your placement in each step. I wouldn't recommend this
    arrangement for much more than this kind of occasional use though.

    As for a cheap crampon, however, you're really looking at the used
    market. Adrian suggested instep crampons and I, like him, have
    never used them, but I've never heard a good word said about them.
    The problem I'd expect with instep crampons is that they provide
    a pivot point rather than a platform - on solid ice you're trying
    to balance on a 3" square, rather than having support over the
    whole foot. The thought of it makes me squirm.

    Instead, I suggest you're looking for 10- or 12-point articulated
    crampons (as opposed to step-in crampons), with a metal bar
    connecting front to back to accomodate the flexbility of your
    boots. You can probably pick up a used set on Ebay without
    breaking the bank.

    Alternatively speak to a local walking club or outdoor shop to see
    if you can borrow / hire some just in case.

    Usual caveat applies: winter equipment without training can be
    more dangerous than no winter equipment at all.

    Colin

  4. Adrian Godwin said:

    Are these things any good ? (Haven't tried them myself).

    http://www.nevisport.com/detail.asp?StoreID=5&DepartmentID=95&CategoryID=188&Depth=3&ProductID=381013

    (that's Grivel Spider inset crampons, 19.99 in case the link doesn't work).

    -adrian

    Cheers for that Adrian, they look like they might be a hot ticket!

  5. On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 22:56:49 +0000, Office Pest

    OfficePest@officepest said:

    Evening all.

    I'm just back from a not entirely successful stroll up Snowdon. Myself
    and the others were without crampons, which was the end of the attempt
    up, as the sheet ice at the bottom of the zigzags (pyg/miners path)
    was impassable in my boots, or unwise to attempt.

    As I don't do a lot of winter walking, is there a cheap occasional use
    crampon that would be ideal for going over my Berghaus Explorer GTX
    boots? (without notches heel & toe for keeping crampons in the right
    place)

    I'm not looking to spend a fortune, as I don't have it, nor would I
    get a massive amount of use from them.

    Suggestions, if you would, please.

    I use Stubai 8 point walkers crampons. Originally I got them to fit
    Brasher boots as they are suitable for flexible soles. They have
    proved ideal for general fellwalking in snow and ice and secure for
    the likes of the Fairfield Horseshoe and slopes as steep as the ascent
    of Middle Dodd and Red Screes from Hartsop Hall. I've enjoyed having
    secure footing when all around me there were people sliding about and
    straining to keep theirs. They need to be securely strapped or they
    may come off, but on the terrain on which I use them this would not be
    critical, just inconvenient. I wouldn't use them on scrambles, for
    example. I've not had any problems from them with restricted
    circulation, even wearing them for four hours. The model I use has
    been superseded, possibly by one shown at the top of:
    http://www.trailwise.co.uk/stubai-crampons.html

    Check with your supplier that they are suitable for your boots before
    you buy, if you choose to, and get advice as to how to strap them on
    securely. They seem to cost about forty quid.

    HTH

    John D.
    --
    John Dawson at home in Kendal, Cumbria.
    Lake District Walks Web Pages http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/
    Kilimanjaro trip at http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/kilimanjaro/
    Egypt trip at http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/egypt/

  6. "Colin MacDonald" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Office Pest said:

    As I don't do a lot of winter walking, is there a cheap occasional use
    crampon that would be ideal for going over my Berghaus Explorer GTX
    boots? (without notches heel & toe for keeping crampons in the right
    place)

    Conventional wisdom says that boots have to be fairly sturdy to take
    crampons, both in the sole and the upper. The sole needs to be fairly
    stiff to avoid it moving independently of the crampon itself, while if the
    upper is too soft & flexible then the straps can end up cutting off
    circulation to your toes by the time you have them tight enough.

    But conventional wisdom can be over cautious at times, and I'd imagine
    that for the odd occasion when you need to cross a big sheet of ice then
    you'd manage fine if you were careful and made sure of your placement in
    each step. I wouldn't recommend this arrangement for much more than this
    kind of occasional use though.

    As for a cheap crampon, however, you're really looking at the used market.
    Adrian suggested instep crampons and I, like him, have never used them,
    but I've never heard a good word said about them. The problem I'd expect
    with instep crampons is that they provide a pivot point rather than a
    platform - on solid ice you're trying to balance on a 3" square, rather
    than having support over the whole foot. The thought of it makes me
    squirm.

    Instead, I suggest you're looking for 10- or 12-point articulated crampons
    (as opposed to step-in crampons), with a metal bar connecting front to
    back to accomodate the flexbility of your boots. You can probably pick up
    a used set on Ebay without breaking the bank.

    Alternatively speak to a local walking club or outdoor shop to see if you
    can borrow / hire some just in case.

    Usual caveat applies: winter equipment without training can be more
    dangerous than no winter equipment at all.

    Colin

    I agree. Economy is no substitute for safety. Go for FULL front point
    crampons - with at least a 3/4 rigid boot - and learn how to use them (and
    an ice axe) Then you've got them if and when you need them. I think you can
    buy a reasonable pair of crampons for £50 - £75. Don't scimp on safety.

  7. "Colin MacDonald" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Instead, I suggest you're looking for 10- or 12-point articulated crampons
    (as opposed to step-in crampons), with a metal bar connecting front to
    back to accomodate the flexbility of your boots. You can probably pick up
    a used set on Ebay without breaking the bank.

    I've been looking at crampons for a few weeks now on Ebay and I'm staggered
    at how much people are prepared to pay for 2nd hand crampons. So I ended up
    getting a new pair of Petzl Vasak - probably not want you want. I do however
    have a pair of old Austria Alpin 10 points which I've used with old style
    Mantas in the alps for glacier crossing / approaches to rock climbs. I'm
    sure something of that type would be quite adequate. The current versions
    are available from Rock and Run and look good value.

    http://www.rockrun.com/shop/type.html?d=2&t=28&sid=7355f02a57b3aa67ede5c7ec77869148

    Incidentally, I had a similar episode on Fairfield a few years back. The
    snow on top was OK in boots but lower down was frozen grass and rock. Since
    my crampons were at home in the cupboard I picked up some impressive
    bruises. Stupid boy.

    Roy.

  8. Following up to Office Pest

    Quoted message said:

    As I don't do a lot of winter walking, is there a cheap occasional use
    crampon that would be ideal for going over my Berghaus Explorer GTX
    boots? (without notches heel & toe for keeping crampons in the right
    place)

    I have old fashioned strap on crampons (French bindings I think
    they are called on articulated crampons). In Wasdale recently
    there was loads of ice but no snow. When it got slippy I wore the
    crampons on the lightweight boots I was wearing, *for* *walking*
    this was fine and got my what would have been a very slippy upper
    Hollow Stones route and Lingmell. I also have some little 4 spike
    instep crampons which I don't think are on sale any more but will
    get you across a patch of ice. I have also used 8 point crampons
    on a flexible plate which will also stay on light boots. If you
    are just walking front points are a liability, the only time you
    will use them is when you hook you other leg on them and fall,
    with whatever consequences. My wifes old 10 pointers are much
    better IMHO.
    For mild winter walking I wouldnt consider stiff boots and snap
    on crampons, you handicap yourself with over heavy boots and
    unwanted front points for the convenience of quick fitting, I
    think all that stuffs for mountaineers.
    One thing to remember is that crampons will get you up and down
    an icy mountain but what happens if they break at the top? Its
    never happened to me, though. You also want to practice ice axe
    breaking a bit before getting overcommitted in a snowy winter
    walk.
    Remember crampons may encourage you to go places you wouldnt
    otherwise.
    I also note a reluctance in some people to use crampons and axe
    even when carried, there seems to be a bit of a "this isnt hard
    enough for me yet" mentality at work?
    --
    Mike Reid
    Walk-eat-photos UK "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
    Walk-eat-photos Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap

  9. Adrian Godwin said:

    Are these things any good ? (Haven't tried them myself).

    I use something similar. They're great for tricky spots on otherwise
    trouble-free walks. I wouldn't recommend relying on them for
    prolonged or risky exposure.

    Chris

  10. Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
    wonderful person The Reid <[email hidden]> said
    <snip>

    Quoted message said:

    One thing to remember is that crampons will get you up and down
    an icy mountain but what happens if they break at the top? Its
    never happened to me, though. You also want to practice ice axe
    breaking a bit before getting overcommitted in a snowy winter
    walk.

    That was my first thought - going up a steep, icy, incline, if you do
    fall over, or your crampon breaks, or whatever, some alternative means
    of stopping (or at least reducing your terminal velocity) would be a
    good plan.

    --
    GSV Three Minds in a Can
    Contact recommends the use of Firefox; SC recommends it at gunpoint.

  11. Following up to GSV Three Minds in a Can

    Quoted message said:

    That was my first thought - going up a steep, icy, incline, if you do
    fall over, or your crampon breaks, or whatever, some alternative means
    of stopping (or at least reducing your terminal velocity) would be a
    good plan.

    yes and it needs a little practice, my first practice I ended up
    lying on the surface of a frozen tarn, my selected "safe" run out
    :-)
    --
    Mike Reid
    Walk-eat-photos UK "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
    Walk-eat-photos Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap

  12. On 10/1/06 11:16, in article [email hidden],

    The Reid said:

    Remember crampons may encourage you to go places you wouldnt
    otherwise.
    I also note a reluctance in some people to use crampons and axe
    even when carried, there seems to be a bit of a "this isnt hard
    enough for me yet" mentality at work?

    Perhaps. But thinking about Snowdon and the Pyg track I would be wary about
    using even these crampons on that sheer, glassy surface.

    As ever. If you are not sure turn back. You can always en joy lower level
    walking. And the hills will still be there for you to return in better
    weather.

    IMHO this kind of sheet glass is the worst kind of winter walking. Full on
    snow is more preferable!

    --
    Andy Howell, Birmingham, UK. To mail simply put back the dots ...

    Must Be Over There ...
    http://www.ecotrend.org.uk/trek

  13. Following up to Andy Howell

    Quoted message said:

    IMHO this kind of sheet glass is the worst kind of winter walking. Full on
    snow is more preferable!

    certainly.
    --
    Mike Reid
    Walk-eat-photos UK "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
    Walk-eat-photos Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap

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