Re: microwave owens ... wave them goodbye?

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 10:13:41 +0200, "Juhana Harju" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Jik Bombo wrote:
: "Mxsmanic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
: news:[email hidden]...

:: It's no less natural than cooking with ordinary heat. Microwaves at
:: the long end of infrared radiation, and nobody complains about
:: infrared heating.
:
: . . . . . yet.

According to this study microwave cooking caused almost complete (97%) loss
of flavonoids in broccoli.

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/jws/jsfa/2003/00000083/00000014/art00018

In contrast steaming caused only minimal loss.

It was the water. If broccoli is cooked in lots of water, it is only logical
that the cooking water will contain the nutrients which were formerly in the
broccoli. The nutrients are not lost, they are just transferred to the cooking
water. The study used 1 cup chopped broccoli and 2/3 cup water. Nuked for five
minutes. That is way too much water and far too long cooking time in a
microwave oven. They ended up with broccoli soup and you aren't supposed to
throw away the water when you eat soup.

Their boiled broccoli lost 66% of its nutrients and they even cooked some using
a pressure cooker which lost 47% nutrients.

Ora

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 10:13:41 +0200, "Juhana Harju"
<[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Jik Bombo wrote:
: "Mxsmanic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
: news:[email hidden]...

:: It's no less natural than cooking with ordinary heat. Microwaves at
:: the long end of infrared radiation, and nobody complains about
:: infrared heating.
:
: . . . . . yet.

According to this study microwave cooking caused almost complete (97%)
loss
of flavonoids in broccoli.

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/jws/jsfa/2003/00000083/00000014/art00018

In contrast steaming caused only minimal loss.

It was the water. If broccoli is cooked in lots of water, it is only
logical
that the cooking water will contain the nutrients which were formerly in
the
broccoli. The nutrients are not lost, they are just transferred to the
cooking
water. The study used 1 cup chopped broccoli and 2/3 cup water. Nuked
for five
minutes. That is way too much water and far too long cooking time in a
microwave oven. They ended up with broccoli soup and you aren't supposed
to
throw away the water when you eat soup.

Their boiled broccoli lost 66% of its nutrients and they even cooked some
using
a pressure cooker which lost 47% nutrients.

Ora

Ah... so it was not really the microwave oven, but the folks who conducted
the study were really very bad cooks!

Truly microwave is not the best way to cook broccoli. It should be steamed
for just a couple of minutes (until they turn bright green). The same goes
for brussell sprouts. Now spinach is best cooked quickly on a hot skillet
with a touch of olive oil and garlic... just let the spinach go limp with
the drops of water leftover from washing and from insided its leaves.

The microwave oven does have its uses... it makes it much easier to make a
white sauce... even with vegies in it. The way to create the sauce for
"confetti scalloped potatoes" is to take a glass 4-cup measure. Put in it
one small finely diced onion, two finely diced carrots, two finely diced
celery stalks, two tablespoons butter, and two tablespoons olive oil. Put
into the microwave at one to two minute increments until the vegies are
softened. Then add about a third of a cup of flour with salt, pepper and
some dried basil leaves... stir and microwave for about a minute or two
(lots of the timing has to do with the power of the oven). Then fill the
4-cup measure with enough milk to the 3 1/2 to 4 cup line. Microwave that
at one to two minute sections, stirring each time... until it comes to a
boil and thickens. This makes enough sauce for a scalloped potato (and
often with ham) cassarole that uses up to 9 potatoes (three layers of 3
potatoes each).

One of the best things I got from my dad was learning how to cook. It
certainly made it easier to manage being a cash strapped student when I
could create meals froms scatch rather than have to use the expensive
packages. I mean... what is with it with "Instant Rice"... a 20 pound bag
of plain rice is so much cheaper, and who doesn't have 20 minutes for rice
to steam unattended... what is so difficult about that?

HCN said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 10:13:41 +0200, "Juhana Harju"
<[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Jik Bombo wrote:
: "Mxsmanic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
: news:[email hidden]...

:: It's no less natural than cooking with ordinary heat. Microwaves at
:: the long end of infrared radiation, and nobody complains about
:: infrared heating.
:
: . . . . . yet.

According to this study microwave cooking caused almost complete (97%)
loss
of flavonoids in broccoli.

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/jws/jsfa/2003/00000083/00000014/art00018

In contrast steaming caused only minimal loss.

It was the water. If broccoli is cooked in lots of water, it is only
logical
that the cooking water will contain the nutrients which were formerly in
the
broccoli. The nutrients are not lost, they are just transferred to the
cooking
water. The study used 1 cup chopped broccoli and 2/3 cup water. Nuked
for five
minutes. That is way too much water and far too long cooking time in a
microwave oven. They ended up with broccoli soup and you aren't supposed
to
throw away the water when you eat soup.

Their boiled broccoli lost 66% of its nutrients and they even cooked some
using
a pressure cooker which lost 47% nutrients.

Ora

Ah... so it was not really the microwave oven, but the folks who conducted
the study were really very bad cooks!

Truly microwave is not the best way to cook broccoli. It should be steamed
for just a couple of minutes (until they turn bright green). The same goes
for brussell sprouts. Now spinach is best cooked quickly on a hot skillet
with a touch of olive oil and garlic... just let the spinach go limp with
the drops of water leftover from washing and from insided its leaves.

The microwave oven does have its uses... it makes it much easier to make a
white sauce... even with vegies in it. The way to create the sauce for
"confetti scalloped potatoes" is to take a glass 4-cup measure. Put in it
one small finely diced onion, two finely diced carrots, two finely diced
celery stalks, two tablespoons butter, and two tablespoons olive oil. Put
into the microwave at one to two minute increments until the vegies are
softened. Then add about a third of a cup of flour with salt, pepper and
some dried basil leaves... stir and microwave for about a minute or two
(lots of the timing has to do with the power of the oven). Then fill the
4-cup measure with enough milk to the 3 1/2 to 4 cup line. Microwave that
at one to two minute sections, stirring each time... until it comes to a
boil and thickens. This makes enough sauce for a scalloped potato (and
often with ham) cassarole that uses up to 9 potatoes (three layers of 3
potatoes each).

One of the best things I got from my dad was learning how to cook. It
certainly made it easier to manage being a cash strapped student when I
could create meals froms scatch rather than have to use the expensive
packages. I mean... what is with it with "Instant Rice"... a 20 pound bag
of plain rice is so much cheaper, and who doesn't have 20 minutes for rice
to steam unattended... what is so difficult about that?

I do not microwave my veggies because some flavor is lost. I do not use instant
rice because it does not taste like rice. You are right, 20 minutes to steam is
not very long and the flavor is great. I tried instant once and never again.

Ora

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 10:47:21 -0800, "HCN" <[email hidden]> wrote:

...>>Ah... so it was not really the microwave oven, but the folks who
conducted

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the study were really very bad cooks!

Truly microwave is not the best way to cook broccoli. It should be
steamed
for just a couple of minutes (until they turn bright green). The same
goes
for brussell sprouts. Now spinach is best cooked quickly on a hot skillet
with a touch of olive oil and garlic... just let the spinach go limp with
the drops of water leftover from washing and from insided its leaves.

The microwave oven does have its uses... it makes it much easier to make a
white sauce... even with vegies in it. The way to create the sauce for
"confetti scalloped potatoes" is to take a glass 4-cup measure. Put in it
one small finely diced onion, two finely diced carrots, two finely diced
celery stalks, two tablespoons butter, and two tablespoons olive oil. Put
into the microwave at one to two minute increments until the vegies are
softened. Then add about a third of a cup of flour with salt, pepper and
some dried basil leaves... stir and microwave for about a minute or two
(lots of the timing has to do with the power of the oven). Then fill the
4-cup measure with enough milk to the 3 1/2 to 4 cup line. Microwave that
at one to two minute sections, stirring each time... until it comes to a
boil and thickens. This makes enough sauce for a scalloped potato (and
often with ham) cassarole that uses up to 9 potatoes (three layers of 3
potatoes each).

One of the best things I got from my dad was learning how to cook. It
certainly made it easier to manage being a cash strapped student when I
could create meals froms scatch rather than have to use the expensive
packages. I mean... what is with it with "Instant Rice"... a 20 pound bag
of plain rice is so much cheaper, and who doesn't have 20 minutes for rice
to steam unattended... what is so difficult about that?

I do not microwave my veggies because some flavor is lost. I do not use
instant
rice because it does not taste like rice. You are right, 20 minutes to
steam is
not very long and the flavor is great. I tried instant once and never
again.

Ora

True, I seldom microwave fresh vegies. It is convenient for warming up
frozen vegies, for starting baked potatoes to finish in the real oven and
for making hot water for tea. It is more of a supplement to the stove and
oven, not a replacement.

HCN said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 10:47:21 -0800, "HCN" <[email hidden]> wrote:

..>>Ah... so it was not really the microwave oven, but the folks who
conducted

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the study were really very bad cooks!

Truly microwave is not the best way to cook broccoli. It should be
steamed
for just a couple of minutes (until they turn bright green). The same
goes
for brussell sprouts. Now spinach is best cooked quickly on a hot skillet
with a touch of olive oil and garlic... just let the spinach go limp with
the drops of water leftover from washing and from insided its leaves.

The microwave oven does have its uses... it makes it much easier to make a
white sauce... even with vegies in it. The way to create the sauce for
"confetti scalloped potatoes" is to take a glass 4-cup measure. Put in it
one small finely diced onion, two finely diced carrots, two finely diced
celery stalks, two tablespoons butter, and two tablespoons olive oil. Put
into the microwave at one to two minute increments until the vegies are
softened. Then add about a third of a cup of flour with salt, pepper and
some dried basil leaves... stir and microwave for about a minute or two
(lots of the timing has to do with the power of the oven). Then fill the
4-cup measure with enough milk to the 3 1/2 to 4 cup line. Microwave that
at one to two minute sections, stirring each time... until it comes to a
boil and thickens. This makes enough sauce for a scalloped potato (and
often with ham) cassarole that uses up to 9 potatoes (three layers of 3
potatoes each).

One of the best things I got from my dad was learning how to cook. It
certainly made it easier to manage being a cash strapped student when I
could create meals froms scatch rather than have to use the expensive
packages. I mean... what is with it with "Instant Rice"... a 20 pound bag
of plain rice is so much cheaper, and who doesn't have 20 minutes for rice
to steam unattended... what is so difficult about that?

I do not microwave my veggies because some flavor is lost. I do not use
instant
rice because it does not taste like rice. You are right, 20 minutes to
steam is
not very long and the flavor is great. I tried instant once and never
again.

Ora

True, I seldom microwave fresh vegies. It is convenient for warming up
frozen vegies, for starting baked potatoes to finish in the real oven and
for making hot water for tea. It is more of a supplement to the stove and
oven, not a replacement.

Yeah; ours broke down few weeks ago. Since we hardly ever use it, we
decided not to bother replacing it. So I thought. In fact, we just
don't *cook* in it.

I lasted a week before I ran out to buy another. If nothing else, it is
invaluable for reheating cups of tea you have forgotten about. Since I
hate shopping, I buy meat weekly, but here in Queensland, it's
necessary to (a) take an Esky (cool box) to the supermarket with you,
and (b) freeze any meat as soon as you get home. Defrosting overnight
is not an option unless you enjoy waking to the stench of rank chicken.

The mercola site which provided the nonsense john posted in full
mentioned not using microwaves for heating baby milk; I can't find the
Lee article in the Lancet that it quotes on pubmed or anywhere else. As
far as I can recall, the reason our midwife gave for that is the "hot
spots" that can occur in microwave-heated liquids, and the fact that
some people may forget to shake the damn stuff before giving it to
their baby. On the advice of our doctor, we merrily microwaved both
breast and later formula milk with no ill effects.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=7911811&query_hl=9&itool=pubmed_DocSum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=1518698&query_hl=5&itool=pubmed_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=8864939&query_hl=5&itool=pubmed_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=8889628&query_hl=9&itool=pubmed_DocSum

Cheers,

Cathy

"cathyb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

....snip..

Quoted message said:

I lasted a week before I ran out to buy another. If nothing else, it is
invaluable for reheating cups of tea you have forgotten about. Since I
hate shopping, I buy meat weekly, but here in Queensland, it's
necessary to (a) take an Esky (cool box) to the supermarket with you,
and (b) freeze any meat as soon as you get home.

I'm familiar with that scenario. The store is several miles away, and the
desert heat makes the car trunk much warmer than the air-conditioned
interior. Unlike most of my family, I opted for a maritime climate.

Defrosting overnight

Quoted message said:

is not an option unless you enjoy waking to the stench of rank chicken.

I stopped defrosting on the kitchen counter years ago, and did it in the
fridge (sometimes jumpstarted by the microwave oven). The first reason was
the acquisition of a cat... then the next reason is that the public health
people were telling us that it was bad and caused bacteria growth.

Quoted message said:

The mercola site which provided the nonsense john posted in full
mentioned not using microwaves for heating baby milk; I can't find the
Lee article in the Lancet that it quotes on pubmed or anywhere else. As
far as I can recall, the reason our midwife gave for that is the "hot
spots" that can occur in microwave-heated liquids, and the fact that
some people may forget to shake the damn stuff before giving it to
their baby. On the advice of our doctor, we merrily microwaved both
breast and later formula milk with no ill effects.

Exactly. Except for our oldest we made the minimum amount of formula (two
ounces) in the evening. Split it into two small bottles. Put a dose of his
phenobarbitol in each, fed him his evening dose, and put the morning dose in
the fridge. Then twelve hours later, microwaved the bottle for just a few
seconds, shook it, put on the nipple and gave him his morning dose.

I also found it easier to make baby food by steaming vegies and fruits.
Mushing them in the blender, and then freezing them in ice cube trays, and
then putting them away in zip-lock bags in the freezer. For a meal we could
take out a cube of food and gently warm it in the microwave oven. The cubes
were only about two tablespoons, which was much better than using half or
even just a quarter of a jar of bought food, where the remainder could get
tossed for being out in the warmth too long.

There are several who seem to equate the "microwaves" to nuclear radiation.
I knew someone in college who was so paranoid about microwaves he would not
go near the one they put in the dorm cafeteria. He also did not understand
that the teeny tiny amount of radioactive material in the 1970's era smoke
detectors were less risky than NOT being alerted to a house fire. Logic was
always lost on him.

Quoted message said:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=7911811&query_hl=9&itool=pubmed_DocSum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=1518698&query_hl=5&itool=pubmed_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=8864939&query_hl=5&itool=pubmed_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=8889628&query_hl=9&itool=pubmed_DocSum

Cheers,

Cathy