Way to go Wally World!

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

FWIW: I didn't see any info about the recall regarding the QR, which is
what most of the claims here seem to base the accident on. I found a
site that says that the forks were recalled:
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/recalls/next_ultra.html. In the
shokbikes.org accounts I read, however, it sounds like the QRs were
improperly fastened. If that's the case, who's responsible?

/s

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Jeebus effing christ. Most LBS bikes have front QR wheels too.

It's a shame that kids sometimes get hurt, but these "adults" are not doing
their kids any favors by deflecting blame. These are going to be the same
people who cause your favorate trails to be shut down in the name of
"safety".

If anything, they should start a campaign to teach kids basic bike
maintenance. Or maybe other "adults".

"JohnH" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Jeebus effing christ. Most LBS bikes have front QR wheels too.

It's a shame that kids sometimes get hurt, but these "adults" are not

doing

Quoted message said:

their kids any favors by deflecting blame. These are going to be the same
people who cause your favorate trails to be shut down in the name of
"safety".

If anything, they should start a campaign to teach kids basic bike
maintenance. Or maybe other "adults".

But how many of these parents ride bikes and know what a front QR is? It
comes down to the fact that in most of these stories wal-mart does not
supply a manual with the bike nor do they have sales people that give a
safety lesson before they walk out of the store. those are both things that
I've got with every LBS bike purchase. As a seller of bicycles I believe
Wal-Mart has a duty to provide safety information. True, as parents they
should be proactive and seek the information out, but threes no intelligence
exam for new parents.

"slartibartfast" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"JohnH" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Jeebus effing christ. Most LBS bikes have front QR wheels too.

It's a shame that kids sometimes get hurt, but these "adults" are not

doing

Quoted message said:

their kids any favors by deflecting blame. These are going to be the

same

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

people who cause your favorate trails to be shut down in the name of
"safety".

If anything, they should start a campaign to teach kids basic bike
maintenance. Or maybe other "adults".

But how many of these parents ride bikes and know what a front QR is? It
comes down to the fact that in most of these stories wal-mart does not
supply a manual with the bike nor do they have sales people that give a
safety lesson before they walk out of the store. those are both things

that

Quoted message said:

I've got with every LBS bike purchase. As a seller of bicycles I believe
Wal-Mart has a duty to provide safety information. True, as parents they
should be proactive and seek the information out, but threes no

intelligence

Quoted message said:

exam for new parents.

damn spell checker.... That's supposed to read "but there's no intelligence
exam for new parents".

"slartibartfast" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"JohnH" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Jeebus effing christ. Most LBS bikes have front QR wheels too.

It's a shame that kids sometimes get hurt, but these "adults" are not

doing

Quoted message said:

their kids any favors by deflecting blame. These are going to be the
same
people who cause your favorate trails to be shut down in the name of
"safety".

If anything, they should start a campaign to teach kids basic bike
maintenance. Or maybe other "adults".

But how many of these parents ride bikes and know what a front QR is? It
comes down to the fact that in most of these stories wal-mart does not
supply a manual with the bike nor do they have sales people that give a
safety lesson before they walk out of the store. those are both things
that
I've got with every LBS bike purchase. As a seller of bicycles I believe
Wal-Mart has a duty to provide safety information. True, as parents they
should be proactive and seek the information out, but threes no
intelligence
exam for new parents.

I remember buying a 24" wheeled mountain bike for my 7 year old grandson 5
or 6 years ago. It was a good quality bike from a bike shop and did not
have QR's. I asked why, and the owner told me a child's bike should never
have QR because they will always mess with them. I thought that was sound
advice. Recently a friend bought a small mountain bike and it did have a
front QR, so it must be the thing now, however we put it on very tight and
put a cable tie around the fork through the QR lever.

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Having worked at the toy department of Wally World and being a fairly
avid biker, I have to say that they were lucky to have me.
Every bike I sold, I warned parents about fit, helmet use, and I carried
a toolkit so that I could check and tighten bolts and nuts and brakes
and seats if necessary. You see- they don't have bike mechanics, they
have bike builders- and in my experience, it's usually the nephew of the
guy that owns the bike stand, or the compressor, that does the work.
They pay these guys 7 bucks a bike- 7 bucks CANADIAN a bike. With tools-
what tools...IF they the proper tools- that were so worn, they'd damage
the bike in putting it together. Wouldn't clamp them on the bike stand
correctly, and score the crappy paint.
Basically, they pull 'em out of the shipping box, throw the wheels on,
and tighten a few screws. Maybe. I found bikes that had loose bottom
brackets- we had twenty bikes come back for that problem alone...since
they came out of the box with the bottom bracket already installed,
nobody thought to check em. Loose stems, handlebars, pedals put on the
wrong side that would loosen as you pedalled...oh yeah, I saw it
all.Loose chains, unsecured seatposts, broken seats, loose QR-
especially on the front. Defective design in FS bikes, where, if a kid
did what kids do with a FS bike- expect to be able to drop off a wall
over something- the seat postwas too long and wouldn't clear the shock
bolt, and it would shear the shock off if the bike bottomed out.Yeah- it
would take a big hit to make that happen, but hey- kids figure these
bikes can take anything.
Flat tires...tires overfilled, and left in an incredibly hot
storeroom..POPPOPPOP! you'd wheel 'em down to the floor, and the tires
were rolling off the rim...And this was not just one building company-
in the 3 years I was there- we went through 4.
Finally- I would just send people off to the LBS so they could get a
good bike- and a good fit.
Parents that didn't know the first thing about a bike buying way too big
bikes for their kids so they could grow into them...
People buying a $300 bicycle and wouldn't shell out more than 5 bucks
for a crappy lock...
One woman actually physically threatened me, because I told her she
would have to maintain the bike- make sure things were tightened
occasionally, and a bit of oil now and then. She was a nut case- kept
trying to tell me that when we were kids, why you didn't have go do that
kind of thing...yep.Seriously- went off the deep end and screamed at
me...and physically threatened me.
I made sure I told the kids and their parents that they would have to
maintain the bike..but it fell on deaf ears.
Oh- and the returns! The returns... taco-ed wheels, 2 bikes that were
returned, supposedly bought a month before- that were so stiff with
bright orange rust that is was obvious they'd been out all winter-
probably two, and the people had scammed a neighbour's or friends
receipt from new bikes that were just bought.

Ah- the horror! The horror!
<runs off to hide in the closet in a fetal poistion>

Kimba
don't get me started...

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Jeebus effing christ. Most LBS bikes have front QR wheels too.

It's a shame that kids sometimes get hurt, but these "adults" are not doing
their kids any favors by deflecting blame. These are going to be the same
people who cause your favorate trails to be shut down in the name of
"safety".

If anything, they should start a campaign to teach kids basic bike
maintenance. Or maybe other "adults".

Right on John.
Didn't gun manufactures just get some legislation that states they
cannot be sued because their product was used in a crime.
IMHO, this is not unlike the discussion we had a few months back (or was
that MTBR?) regarding working on the neighborhood kid's bikes.

I am no fan of Walmart bikes and I have never bought one for my kids,
but to equate a loose q.r. with a defective bike is simply inaccurate.
Defective means it broke under normal use.

Cheap and stupid (or lazy) is a dangerous combination, if you want to
save money, you'll have to do some of the thinking (speaking to parents
here) for yourself.

--
Craig Brossman, Durango Colorado

Owner/Operator of the Pekingnese Ranch.

I know of one LBS that basically threw my bike together... later costing me
a broken pelvis. So, while I'm NOT defending Wal-Mart, this is not just a
Wal-Mart thing. The shop where I bought my bike is considered one of the
best in Tennessee!

"iamkimba" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:7VNaf.403115$1i.321318@pd7tw2no...

Quoted message said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Having worked at the toy department of Wally World and being a fairly avid
biker, I have to say that they were lucky to have me.
Every bike I sold, I warned parents about fit, helmet use, and I carried a
toolkit so that I could check and tighten bolts and nuts and brakes and
seats if necessary. You see- they don't have bike mechanics, they have
bike builders- and in my experience, it's usually the nephew of the guy
that owns the bike stand, or the compressor, that does the work. They pay
these guys 7 bucks a bike- 7 bucks CANADIAN a bike. With tools- what
tools...IF they the proper tools- that were so worn, they'd damage the
bike in putting it together. Wouldn't clamp them on the bike stand
correctly, and score the crappy paint.
Basically, they pull 'em out of the shipping box, throw the wheels on,
and tighten a few screws. Maybe. I found bikes that had loose bottom
brackets- we had twenty bikes come back for that problem alone...since
they came out of the box with the bottom bracket already installed, nobody
thought to check em. Loose stems, handlebars, pedals put on the wrong side
that would loosen as you pedalled...oh yeah, I saw it all.Loose chains,
unsecured seatposts, broken seats, loose QR- especially on the front.
Defective design in FS bikes, where, if a kid did what kids do with a FS
bike- expect to be able to drop off a wall over something- the seat
postwas too long and wouldn't clear the shock bolt, and it would shear the
shock off if the bike bottomed out.Yeah- it would take a big hit to make
that happen, but hey- kids figure these bikes can take anything.
Flat tires...tires overfilled, and left in an incredibly hot
storeroom..POPPOPPOP! you'd wheel 'em down to the floor, and the tires
were rolling off the rim...And this was not just one building company- in
the 3 years I was there- we went through 4.
Finally- I would just send people off to the LBS so they could get a good
bike- and a good fit.
Parents that didn't know the first thing about a bike buying way too big
bikes for their kids so they could grow into them...
People buying a $300 bicycle and wouldn't shell out more than 5 bucks for
a crappy lock...
One woman actually physically threatened me, because I told her she would
have to maintain the bike- make sure things were tightened occasionally,
and a bit of oil now and then. She was a nut case- kept trying to tell me
that when we were kids, why you didn't have go do that kind of
thing...yep.Seriously- went off the deep end and screamed at me...and
physically threatened me.
I made sure I told the kids and their parents that they would have to
maintain the bike..but it fell on deaf ears.
Oh- and the returns! The returns... taco-ed wheels, 2 bikes that were
returned, supposedly bought a month before- that were so stiff with bright
orange rust that is was obvious they'd been out all winter- probably two,
and the people had scammed a neighbour's or friends receipt from new bikes
that were just bought.

Ah- the horror! The horror!
<runs off to hide in the closet in a fetal poistion>

Kimba
don't get me started...

iamkimba said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Having worked at the toy department of Wally World and being a fairly
avid biker, I have to say that they were lucky to have me.
Every bike I sold, I warned parents about fit, helmet use, and I carried
a toolkit so that I could check and tighten bolts and nuts and brakes
and seats if necessary. You see- they don't have bike mechanics, they
have bike builders- and in my experience, it's usually the nephew of the
guy that owns the bike stand, or the compressor, that does the work.
They pay these guys 7 bucks a bike- 7 bucks CANADIAN a bike. With tools-
what tools...IF they the proper tools- that were so worn, they'd damage
the bike in putting it together. Wouldn't clamp them on the bike stand
correctly, and score the crappy paint.

<snipping the worst thing since the Hindenburg>

Quoted message said:

Ah- the horror! The horror!
<runs off to hide in the closet in a fetal poistion>

Kimba
don't get me started...

You should send your story to that Website. I have watched what goes on
in the Wally World by me and I believe everything you say. I can hear
the loose parts rattling when a parent takes the shiny BSO off the rack
for the kid to try.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

iamkimba said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Having worked at the toy department of Wally World and being a fairly
avid biker,

Kimba, is that you?

Penny

Yeah, I won't defend WallyWorld, but like others here I place at least
partial blame on parents. Your kid is riding a mechanical device with
moving parts, at a pretty good speed sometimes. To place all the blame on a
retailer is unrealistic. They should responsible for proper assembly and
normal warranty problems.

Not to get too far OT, but this extreme case of Darwinism has always stuck
with me:

I saw a write up last year on two guys that tried to sue a lawnmower maker.
They decided to set the mower on high speed, lift it up (one on each side)
and run it along their hedge for a quick trim job. When they each lots
parts of their hands, they tried to sue because the explicit warnings on the
lawnmower casing had worn off. The saddest part is that it made it to
court...

"Ride-A-Lot" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

Looks like some people need to mix in a HELMET!

x1134x

LMFAO! Not 1 of the stories actually pointed to walmart selling a
defective part.

I can re-tell the all the stories in one: Kids wasn't smart enough to
use a QR, went to pop a wheelie, front wheel fell off, kid got hurt.
Sure he'll tell mom he was just riding along, but we all know the QR
let go of the wheel when inverted force was put on it. Now as to the
manual, that could be wal-mart's liability because NEXT does send
manuals with the bikes, WAL-mart probably accepted a return w/ out the
manual and put it back on the shelf. Most of the manuals are zip-tied
to the frame of the bike.

So now I'm coming to realize all these "horror" stories about bad
walmart bikes are just idiots popping wheelies with loose QRs. And I
was SOOOO looking forward to hearing and impalement story. . . . .

x1134x

I sent my previous post to the email address listed on the site, I
couldn't help myself {:-(

x1134x

x1134x said:

LMFAO! Not 1 of the stories actually pointed to walmart selling a
defective part.

I can re-tell the all the stories in one: Kids wasn't smart enough to
use a QR, went to pop a wheelie, front wheel fell off, kid got hurt.
Sure he'll tell mom he was just riding along, but we all know the QR
let go of the wheel when inverted force was put on it. Now as to the
manual, that could be wal-mart's liability because NEXT does send
manuals with the bikes, WAL-mart probably accepted a return w/ out the
manual and put it back on the shelf. Most of the manuals are zip-tied
to the frame of the bike.

So now I'm coming to realize all these "horror" stories about bad
walmart bikes are just idiots popping wheelies with loose QRs. And I
was SOOOO looking forward to hearing and impalement story. . . . .

Here ya go:

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml99/99127.html

Shawn

small change said:

iamkimba said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

http://www.shokbikes.org/

Having worked at the toy department of Wally World and being a fairly
avid biker,

Kimba, is that you?

Penny

Yep - tis me.
sitting in the absolute downpour of North Vancouver.

I am!
Kimba
drowned in the deluge

x1134x said:

LMFAO! Not 1 of the stories actually pointed to walmart selling a
defective part.

I can re-tell the all the stories in one: Kids wasn't smart enough to
use a QR, went to pop a wheelie, front wheel fell off, kid got hurt.
Sure he'll tell mom he was just riding along, but we all know the QR
let go of the wheel when inverted force was put on it. Now as to the
manual, that could be wal-mart's liability because NEXT does send
manuals with the bikes, WAL-mart probably accepted a return w/ out the
manual and put it back on the shelf. Most of the manuals are zip-tied
to the frame of the bike.

So now I'm coming to realize all these "horror" stories about bad
walmart bikes are just idiots popping wheelies with loose QRs. And I
was SOOOO looking forward to hearing and impalement story. . . . .

well- maybe you missed my point-
the bikes were defective in the store I worked at-
one, because of crappy design which caused the seatpost to shear off the
shock bolt...
and because of shoddy manufacturing of the bikes in the store.

These are things that I caught- and fixed. But you have to remember, I
wasn't the only associate in the store, I didn't work 24/7 and anyone
would just wheel out a bike and not do a check- explain common sense
maintenance- or indeed- 80- percent of the bikes had no owners booklet.
Not even how to adjust a shock to a riders weight, let alone how to
maintain it.
Some 60 year old grandma who's only concern is her grandkids and who
hasn't been on a bike in 50 years...selling a bike to some kid who
want's to do drops...uh yeah...
And yes - we had accidents..because a bike collapsed after a kid put it
over a ramp- we sold him that ramp- it was total metal fatigue.
And yeah- because the nuts on the front fork weren't tightened properly
a kid popped a wheelie and the front wheel flew off- and these are not
QR either.Or- they popped a wheelie- and the handlebars and the stem
came out of the tube...because the Ahead wasn't tightened properly. That
happened so often that I lost count- that I would have to tighten the
ahead... It *is* shoddy workmanship, and Wal mart should be responsible
for the condition of the bikes they put on the sales floor.

And yes-
A lot of the problem is that kids aren't wearing helmets - and more
commonly not wearing them properly.
but- I notice those kids in the photos have laregely soft tissue
injuries to their faces, but usually not to their scalps- so I suspect
most of them were wearing helmets.
BTW- My last OTB adventure caused me to not strike my head, and I was
wearing a helmet- but I did have A BLACK EYE AND FACIAL LACERATIONS...SO
YOU CAN'T SAY THAT THOSE INJURIES WERE BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T WEARING A
HELMET.
Walmart DOES sell defective bikes- it's not always the manufacturer- in
our store it was the builders.
People went out on a 30 mile ride...got out 15 miles and had to walk
back- because the pedal sheared off? Cause it wasn't properly tightened?
C'mon???

Quoted message said:

I am!
Kimba
told ya not to get me started....

iamkimba said:

well- maybe you missed my point-

Dude, I wasn't responding to you, You'll notice responses are INDENTED
further than the post they are respondidng to, and in this usenet group
responders usually always QUOTE the previous post that they are talking
about. I was replying to the very 1st post of this thread.
(Ride-alot's)

Quoted message said:

the bikes were defective in the store I worked at-
one, because of crappy design which caused the seatpost to shear off the
shock bolt...

Not if its assembled properly, the shock should bottom out long before
the seatpost becomes a factor.

Quoted message said:

and because of shoddy manufacturing of the bikes in the store.

I didn't know walmart hired welders to make bikes in house. hmmm.
Perhaps by 'manufacturing' you meant "assembly" .

Quoted message said:

These are things that I caught- and fixed. But you have to remember, I
wasn't the only associate in the store, I didn't work 24/7 and anyone
would just wheel out a bike and not do a check- explain common sense
maintenance- or indeed- 80- percent of the bikes had no owners booklet.
Not even how to adjust a shock to a riders weight, let alone how to
maintain it.
Some 60 year old grandma who's only concern is her grandkids and who
hasn't been on a bike in 50 years...selling a bike to some kid who
want's to do drops...uh yeah...

So that GRANDMA is responsible, not the parent of the child?

Quoted message said:

And yes - we had accidents..because a bike collapsed after a kid put it
over a ramp- we sold him that ramp- it was total metal fatigue.
And yeah- because the nuts on the front fork weren't tightened properly
a kid popped a wheelie and the front wheel flew off- and these are not
QR either.Or- they popped a wheelie- and the handlebars and the stem
came out of the tube...because the Ahead wasn't tightened properly. That
happened so often that I lost count- that I would have to tighten the
ahead... It *is* shoddy workmanship, and Wal mart should be responsible
for the condition of the bikes they put on the sales floor.

It is shoddy *assembly*.

Quoted message said:

And yes-
A lot of the problem is that kids aren't wearing helmets - and more
commonly not wearing them properly.
but- I notice those kids in the photos have laregely soft tissue
injuries to their faces, but usually not to their scalps- so I suspect
most of them were wearing helmets.

There were a couple who had some good 3rd degree roadrash on the
forehead, which would indicate lack of a helmet.

Quoted message said:

BTW- My last OTB adventure caused me to not strike my head, and I was
wearing a helmet- but I did have A BLACK EYE AND FACIAL LACERATIONS...SO
YOU CAN'T SAY THAT THOSE INJURIES WERE BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T WEARING A
HELMET.

I didn't, i believe I said: "Looks like some people need to mix in a
HELMET!"
Key in on that word: "some" and ponder it a bit before you put more
words in my post.

Quoted message said:

Walmart DOES sell defective bikes- it's not always the manufacturer- in
our store it was the builders.

Sounds to me like a lot of bike makers had to recall and reinforce
front forks due not to faulty forks but due to the damage done to the
fork after the wheel fell off.

Quoted message said:

People went out on a 30 mile ride...got out 15 miles and had to walk
back- because the pedal sheared off? Cause it wasn't properly tightened?

Look up the word "shear" It either "sheared" (the metal of the spindle
failed,) or the threads came loose. Pedals are designed to
auto-tighten. That's why you have a reverse threaded left, so that as
you pedal the force tends to TIGHTEN the pedal, not loosen it.

Again I fully understand the problem of poor assembly. I re-assembled
my entire bike when I bought it. But I'm still going to blame the
parents for not requiring helmets (in *some* cases) AND for not
inspecting the bike thouroghly. . . I'm sorry I just feel this is
*their* responsibility --whether they bought the bike at wal-mart, OR
at a full-service LBS.

x1134x

x1134x said:

iamkimba said:

well- maybe you missed my point-

Dude, I wasn't responding to you,

x1134x

Dude, check your gender... She's a chick!
_____
Slack