Theory behind unintended unclipping from Eggbeaters?

Ivar Hesselager said:

A number of posts in another thread testify that the Eggbeater pedals
from CrankBrothers after a certain amount of wear develop low tension
in the spring, resulting in unintended unclipping.

I haven't had that experience with my egg beaters (yet) but maybe
that's because my 5 years of good experiences are divided between two
diffenrent pairs, since I had my road racer stolen two years ago.

Exept for the cleats beeing unreasonably expensive, I am very
satisfied with those pedals. I am about to buy another set, this
time the titanium version. And since the price is 187 Euro, I want
them to last for many years (5+). If it is true the spring wears out
in a couple of years, I will be looking for another brand.

I am surprised to read, that low tension in the spring should be a
problem, since Crank Brothers on their homepage
( http://www.crankbrothers.com/tech_eggbeater.php ) claim, that the
tension does not have any influence on unclipping.

Quote:
Is the spring tension adjustable?
No, it's not necessary. With the egg beater, the spring tension is not
what keeps you from pulling out of the pedal. ......... With the egg
beater, the medium spring tension allows easy unclipping when twisting
your foot, yet won't let you pull out otherwise.
Unquote.

The way I understand the mechanism of this beautifully simple pedal,
the above quote tells the truth.

Could it be that the reason for the testified unintended unclipping
from the Eggbeaters is not soft springs, but worn down cleats?

Hopefully
Ivar of Denmark

I have Eggbeaters on both of my mountain bikes. My experience is that the
brass (?) cleats are too damned soft, so they wear out too damned fast (and
like you said, they're too damned expensive!). Still, the pedal system
works really well -- especially if they've improved the bearings (mine have
some play that I can't adjust out any more)...

I'd think really hard before springing (no pun intended) for the Ti
versions, especially for off-road use. (I use Look-alikes from Performance
on my road bike.) I've seen the "base" Eggbeaters for as little as $49.

Bill S.

"Ivar Hesselager" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:opszhdb3lvxtdc4g@ivarsnotebook:

Quoted message said:

Could it be that the reason for the testified unintended unclipping from
the Eggbeaters is not soft springs, but worn down cleats?

The spring on one of my Eggbeaters wore out as well. The pedal developed
noticable play between the 2 parts of the cage and even new cleats would pop
out with minimal pressure. I sent it back and Crank rebuilt the pedal under
warranty. Unfortunately, the warranty period has now ended.

Now that I know that I am not the only one experiencing this problem, I am
definately not going to buy an expensive Crank pedal in the future. I don't
mind a $50 pedal wearing out after 2 years, though.

Ivar Hesselager said:

A number of posts in another thread testify that the Eggbeater pedals from
CrankBrothers after a certain amount of wear develop low tension in the
spring, resulting in unintended unclipping.

I haven't had that experience with my egg beaters (yet) but maybe that's
because my 5 years of good experiences are divided between two diffenrent
pairs, since I had my road racer stolen two years ago.

Exept for the cleats beeing unreasonably expensive, I am very satisfied
with those pedals. I am about to buy another set, this time the titanium
version. And since the price is 187 Euro, I want them to last for many
years (5+). If it is true the spring wears out in a couple of years, I
will be looking for another brand.

I am surprised to read, that low tension in the spring should be a
problem, since Crank Brothers on their homepage
( http://www.crankbrothers.com/tech_eggbeater.php ) claim, that the
tension does not have any influence on unclipping.

Crank Brothers pedals are nice, but not as durable as others. I bought
2 pairs of Candy SL's NEW on e-bay for ~$60 each ($120 for 2 pair).
They are nice, but I don't think they are worth the $120 a pair price
tag - the ti are even more. They last about 3 years, cleats are
expensive and rebuilds are expensive. I need a rebuild kit and a new
set of cleats every season (~$35-$40 for both). I'm thinking I'll try
Time brand pedals next.

I've heard you can use Time cleats with Eggbeater pedals. Are they any
better?

-Nate

The Crank Bros. website used to humorously describe their triple Ti
pedals as "fiscally irresponsible". It's foolish to purchase any of
their Ti models since thay have no advantage over the all stainless
model and they still have the less than stellar inboard bushings.
Regular eggbeaters are already lighter that most pedals except for the
likes of Speedplays, M2, etc. The small decrease in weight isn't worth
it. You could make up the difference with minimalistic road shoes if
one is set on being an ultra weight weenie. Maybe compromize by
shoe-gooing some lugs onto a set of high zoot Carnacs 🙂 Anybody
considering blowing their money on the titanium models would be better
served by investing in the superior bearings of the Quattros or Look
4x4s instead.

I wonder what the durability is like with the titanium bodies
considering that the design depends on softer sacrifical cleats to
mitigate grinding against the retention mechanism. Older Time ATACs
that used spring steel for the retention bars had a reputation for
wearing down the pedals. I would be concerned about the same happening
with the Ti eggbeaters.

Regarding the unintended clipouts. This can be exacerbated by people
who have too much foot pronation such that they are always riding at
the limit of the float or who let their foot flop around enough to
release the cleat. The release angle decreases over time because of
cleat wear so these riders may only start experiencing problems after
putting some mileage into their cleats. Eggbeaters have very little
resistance when clipping out and they don't "suck" your foot into
alignment like SPDs so riders transitioning from such pedals may have
bad habits that don't work well on the eggbeaters. My most heavily used
pedals (7000 miles) have developed play in the wing to body interface
but I haven't experienced any unintended releases so far. They would
have to develop a lot more slop before the bars were wide enough to
pull out of (aside from use with a heavily worn cleat). I wonder if the
people complaining about pulling out with new cleats have bent the bars
after bashing them on a rock.

In article <opszhdb3lvxtdc4g@ivarsnotebook>, Ivar Hesselager

Quoted message said:

A number of posts in another thread testify that the Eggbeater pedals
from
CrankBrothers after a certain amount of wear develop low tension in the

spring, resulting in unintended unclipping.

I haven't had that experience with my egg beaters (yet) but maybe
that's
because my 5 years of good experiences are divided between two
diffenrent
pairs, since I had my road racer stolen two years ago.

Exept for the cleats beeing unreasonably expensive, I am very satisfied

with those pedals. I am about to buy another set, this time the
titanium
version. And since the price is 187 Euro, I want them to last for many
years (5+). If it is true the spring wears out in a couple of years, I
will be looking for another brand.

I am surprised to read, that low tension in the spring should be a
problem, since Crank Brothers on their homepage
( http://www.crankbrothers.com/tech_eggbeater.php ) claim, that the
tension does not have any influence on unclipping.

Quote:
Is the spring tension adjustable?
No, it's not necessary. With the egg beater, the spring tension is not
what keeps you from pulling out of the pedal. ......... With the egg
beater, the medium spring tension allows easy unclipping when twisting
your foot, yet won't let you pull out otherwise.
Unquote.

The way I understand the mechanism of this beautifully simple pedal,
the
above quote tells the truth.

Could it be that the reason for the testified unintended unclipping
from
the Eggbeaters is not soft springs, but worn down cleats?

Hopefully
Ivar of Denmark

In my case no: even with new cleats, and with different Beaters
experiencing the same loss of spring preload, the problem of an
insecure cleat engagement persisted. But occasional unintended cleat
releases were not the only aggravation of the condition, though they
did occur more frequently with prolonged use; an annoying degree of
movement between at the cleat/pedal interface was the primary
irritation. That is, between the foot pulling upward and pushing
downward during the pedalling cycle you could feel the 'click' of the
cleat shifting within the pedal's wings as the load direction changed.
I found this maddening - and there was absolutely nothing to be done
about it.

Ivar, by way of comment on your two pairs of Beaters not exhibiting the
aforementioned problems, let me elaborate on my experience. Over the
years I've had a total of 4 pairs of Beaters: Two were first generation
Steel Beaters with ChroMo spindles; Two were the all Stainless Steel
"S" model. All the pedals were installed on road bikes. While all the
models suffered diminished spring preload with use, the rate of
decrease in tension, and attendant play between the pedal's wings, was
by no means consistent - I removed a pair of Stainless models after
only 1 1/2 years while an almost 3 year old ChroMo model is still in
service.

I speculate whether this is attributable to manufacturing issues (Crank
Bros contracting different suppliers with different standards?). Of
course, type and frequency of use bears on the situation, but where it
relates to my pedals, it doesn't explain the discrepancy in the rate of
tension deterioration between different sets of beaters. My suspicion
is that not all beaters are created equal - some are more durable than
others; perhaps Ivar your two pairs are of a better grade.

But I'll reiterate: with use every one of my beaters has developed a
loss of spring preload and play between the wings. In your post you
quoted Crank Bros website: "Is the spring tension adjustable? No, it's
not necessary...." I disagree; Crank Bros is waxing disingenuous here.
The only basis for making such a claim is if the pedal's spring doesn't
relax or its stops don't wear with use; and despite the merits of the
Beaters I doubt Crank Bros. would stand behind such an assertion.

The simplicity and elegance of the pedal's design notwithstanding, ALL
parts wear. And with no recourse to compensating for that wear (i.e.,
spring adjustment) the dilemma is quite simple: the greater the play in
the pedal's wings the further they must be separated (by the cleat) in
order to attain the degree of spring force equal to that in a new pair
of pedals and sufficient to ensure secure engagement. So, unless Crank
Bros is supplying automatically expanding cleats ;-) reduced engagement
force is the inevitable outcome.

Maybe Crank Bros. has changed the specs of their current models to
address the issue - I don't know. But this time around I'm not giving
them the benefit of the doubt.

Luke

Luke

Actually, I find Eggbeater cleats AND pedals to be reasonably priced
here in the U.S. Let's see, I picked up an Eggbeater C set on EBay
for $53 which included shipping, and the road cleats from REI for $25,
which included a spare set of rubber walking outriggers. Compare that
with the bottom-of-the-line Speedplay X/3 or X/5 at $120 and
replacement cleats at $39.
After two weeks of riding on the C pedals, I find them quite practical,
even if they do wear out after a couple of years.

30 Oct 2005 17:16:15 -0800, amakyonin <[email hidden]> skrev:

Anybody

Quoted message said:

considering blowing their money on the titanium models would be better
served by investing in the superior bearings of the Quattros or Look
4x4s instead.

Is that a fact? How do you know those bearings are superior? Will I be
able to see wshats wrong with the bearings in the eggbeater, if I take it
apart?
I like the eggbeater because of its original minimalistic concept and the
walkability of the cleats. And I see the Quattro design as a give in to
market hype about "large platform", which must be unimportant under a
stiff sole.
And since the Look 4x4 is a copy of the CrankBrothers concept I would
prefer to stay true to the inventer. But if the bearings even in the
Ti-version in fact are inferior and the spring will not last for at least
five years, I would rather stick to the cheaper SL-version. It wan't so
much the weight savings I was going for.

Ivar

Quoted message said:

I wonder what the durability is like with the titanium bodies
considering that the design depends on softer sacrifical cleats to
mitigate grinding against the retention mechanism. Older Time ATACs
that used spring steel for the retention bars had a reputation for
wearing down the pedals. I would be concerned about the same happening
with the Ti eggbeaters.

Quoted message said:

Regarding the unintended clipouts. This can be exacerbated by people
who have too much foot pronation such that they are always riding at
the limit of the float or who let their foot flop around enough to
release the cleat. The release angle decreases over time because of
cleat wear so these riders may only start experiencing problems after
putting some mileage into their cleats. Eggbeaters have very little
resistance when clipping out and they don't "suck" your foot into
alignment like SPDs so riders transitioning from such pedals may have
bad habits that don't work well on the eggbeaters. My most heavily used
pedals (7000 miles) have developed play in the wing to body interface
but I haven't experienced any unintended releases so far. They would
have to develop a lot more slop before the bars were wide enough to
pull out of (aside from use with a heavily worn cleat). I wonder if the
people complaining about pulling out with new cleats have bent the bars
after bashing them on a r

ock.

Quoted message said:

--
Sendt med Operas banebrydende nyhedsgruppe-
og e-postklient: http://www.opera.com/m2/

30 Oct 2005 17:16:15 -0800, amakyonin <[email hidden]> skrev:

Anybody

Quoted message said:

considering blowing their money on the titanium models would be better
served by investing in the superior bearings of the Quattros or Look
4x4s instead.

Is that a fact? How do you know those bearings are superior? Will I be
able to see wshats wrong with the bearings in the eggbeater, if I take it
apart?
I like the eggbeater because of its original minimalistic concept and the
walkability of the cleats. And I see the Quattro design as a give in to
market hype about "large platform", which must be unimportant under a
stiff sole.
And since the Look 4x4 is a copy of the CrankBrothers concept I would
prefer to stay true to the inventer. But if the bearings even in the
Ti-version in fact are inferior and the spring will not last for at least
five years, I would rather stick to the cheaper SL-version. It wan't so
much the weight savings I was going for.

Ivar

Quoted message said:

I wonder what the durability is like with the titanium bodies
considering that the design depends on softer sacrifical cleats to
mitigate grinding against the retention mechanism. Older Time ATACs
that used spring steel for the retention bars had a reputation for
wearing down the pedals. I would be concerned about the same happening
with the Ti eggbeaters.

Quoted message said:

Regarding the unintended clipouts. This can be exacerbated by people
who have too much foot pronation such that they are always riding at
the limit of the float or who let their foot flop around enough to
release the cleat. The release angle decreases over time because of
cleat wear so these riders may only start experiencing problems after
putting some mileage into their cleats. Eggbeaters have very little
resistance when clipping out and they don't "suck" your foot into
alignment like SPDs so riders transitioning from such pedals may have
bad habits that don't work well on the eggbeaters. My most heavily used
pedals (7000 miles) have developed play in the wing to body interface
but I haven't experienced any unintended releases so far. They would
have to develop a lot more slop before the bars were wide enough to
pull out of (aside from use with a heavily worn cleat). I wonder if the
people complaining about pulling out with new cleats have bent the bars
after bashing them on a r

ock.

Quoted message said:

--
Sendt med Operas banebrydende nyhedsgruppe-
og e-postklient: http://www.opera.com/m2/

30 Oct 2005 17:16:15 -0800, amakyonin <[email hidden]> skrev:

Anybody

Quoted message said:

considering blowing their money on the titanium models would be better
served by investing in the superior bearings of the Quattros or Look
4x4s instead.

Is that a fact? How do you know those bearings are superior? Will I be
able to see wshats wrong with the bearings in the eggbeater, if I take it
apart?
I like the eggbeater because of its original minimalistic concept and the
walkability of the cleats. And I see the Quattro design as a give in to
market hype about "large platform", which must be unimportant under a
stiff sole.
And since the Look 4x4 is a copy of the CrankBrothers concept I would
prefer to stay true to the inventer. But if the bearings even in the
Ti-version in fact are inferior and the spring will not last for at least
five years, I would rather stick to the cheaper SL-version. It wan't so
much the weight savings I was going for.

Ivar

Quoted message said:

I wonder what the durability is like with the titanium bodies
considering that the design depends on softer sacrifical cleats to
mitigate grinding against the retention mechanism. Older Time ATACs
that used spring steel for the retention bars had a reputation for
wearing down the pedals. I would be concerned about the same happening
with the Ti eggbeaters.

Quoted message said:

Regarding the unintended clipouts. This can be exacerbated by people
who have too much foot pronation such that they are always riding at
the limit of the float or who let their foot flop around enough to
release the cleat. The release angle decreases over time because of
cleat wear so these riders may only start experiencing problems after
putting some mileage into their cleats. Eggbeaters have very little
resistance when clipping out and they don't "suck" your foot into
alignment like SPDs so riders transitioning from such pedals may have
bad habits that don't work well on the eggbeaters. My most heavily used
pedals (7000 miles) have developed play in the wing to body interface
but I haven't experienced any unintended releases so far. They would
have to develop a lot more slop before the bars were wide enough to
pull out of (aside from use with a heavily worn cleat). I wonder if the
people complaining about pulling out with new cleats have bent the bars
after bashing them on a r

ock.

Quoted message said:

--
Sendt med Operas banebrydende nyhedsgruppe-
og e-postklient: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Thanks to you all for sharing experiences and opinions on eggbeaters. I
can't make out why the experiences are so different. Maybe my way of
pedaling or the shape of my shoe sole or just plain luck, has kept me from
the bad experiences others have encountered. Still I think I should not
spend the doubble amount of money on the Ti version if there is a risk
that the spring will wear out in a couple of years. But I like the
eggbeaters so much that I will stick to them and probably buy the SL
version again.
Ivar of Denmark

Thanks to you all for sharing experiences and opinions on eggbeaters. I
can't make out why the experiences are so different. Maybe my way of
pedaling or the shape of my shoe sole or just plain luck, has kept me from
the bad experiences others have encountered. Still I think I should not
spend the doubble amount of money on the Ti version if there is a risk
that the spring will wear out in a couple of years. But I like the
eggbeaters so much that I will stick to them and probably buy the SL
version again.
Ivar of Denmark

Thanks to you all for sharing experiences and opinions on eggbeaters. I
can't make out why the experiences are so different. Maybe my way of
pedaling or the shape of my shoe sole or just plain luck, has kept me from
the bad experiences others have encountered. Still I think I should not
spend the doubble amount of money on the Ti version if there is a risk
that the spring will wear out in a couple of years. But I like the
eggbeaters so much that I will stick to them and probably buy the SL
version again.
Ivar of Denmark

Eggbeater bearings are [censored] -- at least both pairs of mine were. The
look model is superior in this area.

-Nate

Eggbeater bearings are [censored] -- at least both pairs of mine were. The
look model is superior in this area.

-Nate

Eggbeater bearings are [censored] -- at least both pairs of mine were. The
look model is superior in this area.

-Nate

Ivar Hesselager said:

30 Oct 2005 17:16:15 -0800, amakyonin <[email hidden]> skrev:

Is that a fact? How do you know those bearings are superior? Will I be
able to see wshats wrong with the bearings in the eggbeater, if I take it
apart?

I have destroyed a pair of the original Eggbeaters because I didn't
service them often enough (I did them every 500 miles, sometimes less).
Even with a rebuild kit it was never the same because the spindle was
too scored and would eat up the new bushing. Any grit that gets into
the interface also eats into the bushing. I have neglected the 4x4s for
over 2000 miles at a time and they still look great inside with just
minor wear marks on the spindle as is to be expected. Small amounts of
dirt still get in but the metal needle bearings are obviously more wear
resistant than a plastic bush. The original design admittedly had
problems with its seals and they look improved in the newer designs but
the bushing is always an inferior bearing solution. I have a pair of
second generation Eggbeater S pedals (essentially the same as the
current SL) but don't have enough mileage on them to comment on their
durability.

When you spin the pedal of an eggbeater with your hand you will be
lucky if the body makes one complete revolution because there is so
much drag on the bushing. Conversely, the 4x4s spin much more freely
and you won't be able to count the revolutions. Part of this is that
they come from the factory with a light oil for lubrication instead of
the grease used in the Crank Brothers. I have been using a mixture of a
light coat of grease on the spindle and heavy weight oil in the
bearings and still get good results and low bearing drag. You really
need to use a full load of grease to get any useful life out of the
plastic bushings.

Quoted message said:

And since the Look 4x4 is a copy of the CrankBrothers concept I would
prefer to stay true to the inventer. But if the bearings even in the
Ti-version in fact are inferior and the spring will not last for at least
five years, I would rather stick to the cheaper SL-version. It wan't so
much the weight savings I was going for.

The Look 4x4 pedal is a sub-licensed design. I'm sure Crank Brothers
are getting a cut of every sale. The cast body is almost identical to
the Crank Bros. except for the "Look" name in relief instead of "Crank"
"Bros" and the machining for the needle bearing and end cap. The end
caps are plastic and slightly smaller than the CB aluminum caps. This
means you can't use the CB grease injector port although that isn't an
appropriate way to lube these pedals anyway. The outboard bearings are
the same standard BB cartridge used on other CB pedals. The spindle is
unlike any other CB design. It's plain carbon steel (hollowed) and they
use a left-hand thread on one of the retention nuts (I think the right
side) where CB uses right-hand threads on both nuts. I think it uses an
8mm hex for spindle mounting whereas CB use 6mm. One nice treat is that
Look provides stainless cleat screws instead of carbon steel so you
don't have issues with them rusting and rounding out as with the CB
models. The cleats are the same shape as the CB versions. They have a
slightly lighter color than the CB versions but seem to wear just the
same. The only minor detraction is that the exposed portion of the
spindle rusts after the paint has been rubbed off by your shoe. The
carbon steel spindle is necessary, though, to provide a good inner race
for the needle bearings.

Ivar Hesselager said:

30 Oct 2005 17:16:15 -0800, amakyonin <[email hidden]> skrev:

Is that a fact? How do you know those bearings are superior? Will I be
able to see wshats wrong with the bearings in the eggbeater, if I take it
apart?

I have destroyed a pair of the original Eggbeaters because I didn't
service them often enough (I did them every 500 miles, sometimes less).
Even with a rebuild kit it was never the same because the spindle was
too scored and would eat up the new bushing. Any grit that gets into
the interface also eats into the bushing. I have neglected the 4x4s for
over 2000 miles at a time and they still look great inside with just
minor wear marks on the spindle as is to be expected. Small amounts of
dirt still get in but the metal needle bearings are obviously more wear
resistant than a plastic bush. The original design admittedly had
problems with its seals and they look improved in the newer designs but
the bushing is always an inferior bearing solution. I have a pair of
second generation Eggbeater S pedals (essentially the same as the
current SL) but don't have enough mileage on them to comment on their
durability.

When you spin the pedal of an eggbeater with your hand you will be
lucky if the body makes one complete revolution because there is so
much drag on the bushing. Conversely, the 4x4s spin much more freely
and you won't be able to count the revolutions. Part of this is that
they come from the factory with a light oil for lubrication instead of
the grease used in the Crank Brothers. I have been using a mixture of a
light coat of grease on the spindle and heavy weight oil in the
bearings and still get good results and low bearing drag. You really
need to use a full load of grease to get any useful life out of the
plastic bushings.

Quoted message said:

And since the Look 4x4 is a copy of the CrankBrothers concept I would
prefer to stay true to the inventer. But if the bearings even in the
Ti-version in fact are inferior and the spring will not last for at least
five years, I would rather stick to the cheaper SL-version. It wan't so
much the weight savings I was going for.

The Look 4x4 pedal is a sub-licensed design. I'm sure Crank Brothers
are getting a cut of every sale. The cast body is almost identical to
the Crank Bros. except for the "Look" name in relief instead of "Crank"
"Bros" and the machining for the needle bearing and end cap. The end
caps are plastic and slightly smaller than the CB aluminum caps. This
means you can't use the CB grease injector port although that isn't an
appropriate way to lube these pedals anyway. The outboard bearings are
the same standard BB cartridge used on other CB pedals. The spindle is
unlike any other CB design. It's plain carbon steel (hollowed) and they
use a left-hand thread on one of the retention nuts (I think the right
side) where CB uses right-hand threads on both nuts. I think it uses an
8mm hex for spindle mounting whereas CB use 6mm. One nice treat is that
Look provides stainless cleat screws instead of carbon steel so you
don't have issues with them rusting and rounding out as with the CB
models. The cleats are the same shape as the CB versions. They have a
slightly lighter color than the CB versions but seem to wear just the
same. The only minor detraction is that the exposed portion of the
spindle rusts after the paint has been rubbed off by your shoe. The
carbon steel spindle is necessary, though, to provide a good inner race
for the needle bearings.

Ivar Hesselager said:

30 Oct 2005 17:16:15 -0800, amakyonin <[email hidden]> skrev:

Is that a fact? How do you know those bearings are superior? Will I be
able to see wshats wrong with the bearings in the eggbeater, if I take it
apart?

I have destroyed a pair of the original Eggbeaters because I didn't
service them often enough (I did them every 500 miles, sometimes less).
Even with a rebuild kit it was never the same because the spindle was
too scored and would eat up the new bushing. Any grit that gets into
the interface also eats into the bushing. I have neglected the 4x4s for
over 2000 miles at a time and they still look great inside with just
minor wear marks on the spindle as is to be expected. Small amounts of
dirt still get in but the metal needle bearings are obviously more wear
resistant than a plastic bush. The original design admittedly had
problems with its seals and they look improved in the newer designs but
the bushing is always an inferior bearing solution. I have a pair of
second generation Eggbeater S pedals (essentially the same as the
current SL) but don't have enough mileage on them to comment on their
durability.

When you spin the pedal of an eggbeater with your hand you will be
lucky if the body makes one complete revolution because there is so
much drag on the bushing. Conversely, the 4x4s spin much more freely
and you won't be able to count the revolutions. Part of this is that
they come from the factory with a light oil for lubrication instead of
the grease used in the Crank Brothers. I have been using a mixture of a
light coat of grease on the spindle and heavy weight oil in the
bearings and still get good results and low bearing drag. You really
need to use a full load of grease to get any useful life out of the
plastic bushings.

Quoted message said:

And since the Look 4x4 is a copy of the CrankBrothers concept I would
prefer to stay true to the inventer. But if the bearings even in the
Ti-version in fact are inferior and the spring will not last for at least
five years, I would rather stick to the cheaper SL-version. It wan't so
much the weight savings I was going for.

The Look 4x4 pedal is a sub-licensed design. I'm sure Crank Brothers
are getting a cut of every sale. The cast body is almost identical to
the Crank Bros. except for the "Look" name in relief instead of "Crank"
"Bros" and the machining for the needle bearing and end cap. The end
caps are plastic and slightly smaller than the CB aluminum caps. This
means you can't use the CB grease injector port although that isn't an
appropriate way to lube these pedals anyway. The outboard bearings are
the same standard BB cartridge used on other CB pedals. The spindle is
unlike any other CB design. It's plain carbon steel (hollowed) and they
use a left-hand thread on one of the retention nuts (I think the right
side) where CB uses right-hand threads on both nuts. I think it uses an
8mm hex for spindle mounting whereas CB use 6mm. One nice treat is that
Look provides stainless cleat screws instead of carbon steel so you
don't have issues with them rusting and rounding out as with the CB
models. The cleats are the same shape as the CB versions. They have a
slightly lighter color than the CB versions but seem to wear just the
same. The only minor detraction is that the exposed portion of the
spindle rusts after the paint has been rubbed off by your shoe. The
carbon steel spindle is necessary, though, to provide a good inner race
for the needle bearings.

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In article <opszkx5inrxtdc4g@ivarsnotebook>,

Ivar Hesselager said:

Thanks to you all for sharing experiences and opinions on eggbeaters. I
can't make out why the experiences are so different. Maybe my way of
pedaling or the shape of my shoe sole or just plain luck, has kept me from
the bad experiences others have encountered. Still I think I should not
spend the doubble amount of money on the Ti version if there is a risk
that the spring will wear out in a couple of years. But I like the
eggbeaters so much that I will stick to them and probably buy the SL
version again.

_ I have not seen the spring problem either. I have one pair
that's seen two years use and there is no slop in the spring
at all. I have had problems with cleats wearing out and breaking
in half as well as some bearing problems.

_ I suspect Crank Brothers contracts all their manufacture and
they may have just had a bad run of parts.

_ Booker c.Bense

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