another charity cyclist dies

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

Yes I was running the Great North Run and there did appear to be rather a
lot of people needing attention at the side of the road.

It was a hot day as well which didn't help.

Sam Salt

"Sam Salt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

Yes I was running the Great North Run and there did appear to be rather a
lot of people needing attention at the side of the road.

It was a hot day as well which didn't help.

Four people died on the Great North ...

However I'm a little surprised at the OP's comment "lessons to be learned
from these events". What lessons can be learnt from this? Every policeman I
know is in good condition, and I'm presuming that this guy was just from his
age. He also had 55 qualified first aiders with him. I cannot take any
lessons from this.

Quoted message said:

However I'm a little surprised at the OP's comment "lessons to be
learned from these events".

Defibs and first aiders trained to use them? Measures taken to provide a
faster response from people in trouble? More water stops on hot days?
Good advice given on health and fitness well in advance of the race (I
think the organisers of the London marathon do this)...

Sam Salt said:

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

Yes I was running the Great North Run and there did appear to be rather a
lot of people needing attention at the side of the road.

It was a hot day as well which didn't help.

There is no doubt that you are at greater risk of dying during exercise
than when resting but the exercise improves your life expectancy
overall. Assuming the GNR was a two hour event, that death rate is
about 24 times the background death rate in a normal population of that
size and this was an exceptional year.

There are questions though in my mind about these endurance events for
people who are basically not acclimatised to them. Lots train but lots
skimp on the training too.

--
Tony

"I did make a mistake once - I thought I'd made a mistake but I hadn't"
Anon

elyob said:

"Sam Salt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

Yes I was running the Great North Run and there did appear to be rather a
lot of people needing attention at the side of the road.

It was a hot day as well which didn't help.

Four people died on the Great North ...

However I'm a little surprised at the OP's comment "lessons to be learned
from these events". What lessons can be learnt from this? Every policeman I
know is in good condition, and I'm presuming that this guy was just from his
age. He also had 55 qualified first aiders with him. I cannot take any
lessons from this.

You guys must have healthier policemen.
I have met several who could not conceivably pass any fitness test.
And at least one who had heart attack writted all over him. Which
reminds me, its been two years I must check and see if he is still alive .

in message <[email hidden]>,

MartinM (') said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

Everybody dies. I've just got back from a friend's father's funeral.
Death is not a tragedy, it's just an inevitable event. And, given that
one is going to die, is it better to die suddenly while doing something
you enjoy, or slowly and lingeringly, in a hospital bed, surrounded by
unfamiliar people and pumped full of a slew of medicines?

Earlier this year a person I knew slightly - a close friend of my
sister's - died of a heart attack while climbing Everest. I had very
mixed feelings; that is not at all a bad way to go.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; If God does not write LISP, God writes some code so similar to
;; LISP as to make no difference.

Simon Brooke said:

Earlier this year a person I knew slightly - a close friend of my
sister's - died of a heart attack while climbing Everest. I had very
mixed feelings; that is not at all a bad way to go.

On the way down, or on the way up, for me there'd be a difference...

Jim.

elyob said:

"Sam Salt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

Yes I was running the Great North Run and there did appear to be rather a
lot of people needing attention at the side of the road.

It was a hot day as well which didn't help.

Four people died on the Great North ...

However I'm a little surprised at the OP's comment "lessons to be learned
from these events". What lessons can be learnt from this? Every policeman I
know is in good condition, and I'm presuming that this guy was just from his
age. He also had 55 qualified first aiders with him. I cannot take any
lessons from this.

I was absolutely not passing any comments about the individual event;
it was as we all agree a very sad occurnce; in fact the Metro carried a
headline about the Great North fatalities which was along the lines of
the "health risks" in doing this sort of thing which I do not subscribe
to either.

elyob said:

However I'm a little surprised at the OP's comment "lessons to be learned
from these events". What lessons can be learnt from this? Every policeman I
know is in good condition, and I'm presuming that this guy was just from his
age.

37 is not a particularly old age to be dying after about 50 miles on a
bike; but to be fair I have known younger men suffer heart attacks
without riding a bike.

Tony Raven said:

Sam Salt said:

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

Yes I was running the Great North Run and there did appear to be rather a
lot of people needing attention at the side of the road.

It was a hot day as well which didn't help.

There is no doubt that you are at greater risk of dying during exercise
than when resting but the exercise improves your life expectancy
overall. Assuming the GNR was a two hour event, that death rate is
about 24 times the background death rate in a normal population of that
size and this was an exceptional year.

There are questions though in my mind about these endurance events for
people who are basically not acclimatised to them. Lots train but lots
skimp on the training too.

I ran the course in about 1hr 57mins (7000th/50000) and my impression was
that most (80%-90%)of the people I saw being resuscitated were 'elite'
runners who wear orange numbers to indicate they expect their time to be <
1.35. I thought some of them looked pretty ill, but I was shocked and
upset to hear how many died.

It could well be that the people at the back of the course were as badly
affected, but it certainly wasn't only the unprepared who were having
problems.

AC

Mark Thompson said:

Quoted message said:

However I'm a little surprised at the OP's comment "lessons to be
learned from these events".

Defibs and first aiders trained to use them?

Dunno about defibs specifically, but there were a lot of first-aiders
around and they had a lot of kit spread about them.

Quoted message said:

Measures taken to provide a faster response from people in trouble?

They say the ambulances took quite a while to reach one person. There was
one part of the course where we all moved to the left to allow an
ambulance to pass - not ideal, but there are side roads along much of
the course so access seemed pretty good.

Quoted message said:

More water stops on hot days?

But not many more - overhydration as bad as dehydration. Close to the
front-runners, there was water to spare though I thought the showers could
have been turned up a bit higher.

Quoted message said:

Good advice given on health and fitness well in advance of the race (I
think the organisers of the London marathon do this)...

They sent out an information pack. I didn't read it in detail this year,
but in previous years it had training schedules etc.

There's always room for improvement and I guess these things are difficult
to evaluate from the outside, but my impression was that the event was
generally very well organised. The Guardian says there have been 8 deaths
over the last 24 years, which is proportionately less than yesterday
even taking into account there are more competitors now. It's tragic that
so many people died yesterday, but given the numbers are so small I'm not
sure how much significance one should read into it (statistical noise).

Yesterday's lesson for me was that cycling isn't good training for
running. Cycling is completely painless and I could still cruise along at
20 the afternoon after the race, but up and down stairs is quite shaky.

AC

AC said:

I ran the course in about 1hr 57mins (7000th/50000) and my impression was
that most (80%-90%)of the people I saw being resuscitated were 'elite'
runners who wear orange numbers to indicate they expect their time to be <
1.35. I thought some of them looked pretty ill, but I was shocked and
upset to hear how many died.

It could well be that the people at the back of the course were as badly
affected, but it certainly wasn't only the unprepared who were having
problems.

Jim Fix?

--
Tony

"I did make a mistake once - I thought I'd made a mistake but I hadn't"
Anon

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

With all due respect to the relatives of the deceased -

"Hot" weather in Gateshead near the end of September? Hmmmm.

Coming from up there & having lived in Low Fell for a while & worked in
Sooth Sheelds for a while - yes, hot weather is occasionally possible 🙂

Cheers, helen s

in message <[email hidden]>, Jim Ley

(') said:

Simon Brooke said:

Earlier this year a person I knew slightly - a close friend of my
sister's - died of a heart attack while climbing Everest. I had very
mixed feelings; that is not at all a bad way to go.

On the way down, or on the way up, for me there'd be a difference...

Up, but within two thousand feet of the top, and much too high to get his
body down again, so he's still up there. Not a bad way to go, and not a
bad place to be buried:
<URL:http://www.aiai.ed.ac.uk/project/everest/blog/weblog.pl?month=200507>

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Life would be much easier if I had the source code.

Quoted message said:

With all due respect to the relatives of the deceased -

"Hot" weather in Gateshead near the end of September? Hmmmm.

Again, with due respect to all, I'm surprised no one has mentioned
'performance enhancing substances'.

Silly me, it was runners, not cyclists.

John B

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>,

MartinM (') said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon.

Everybody dies. I've just got back from a friend's father's funeral.
Death is not a tragedy, it's just an inevitable event.

I would suggest that death at the age of 37 is sufficiently rare to be
shocking, and therefore perceived as a tragedy to those left behind.

JohnB said:

Quoted message said:

With all due respect to the relatives of the deceased -

"Hot" weather in Gateshead near the end of September? Hmmmm.

Again, with due respect to all, I'm surprised no one has mentioned
'performance enhancing substances'.

Silly me, it was runners, not cyclists.

having just read the Tom Simpson book I would be tempted to say "not
nowadays" but is it really still a big problem? not something I see
much about outside the Tour.

MartinM said:

from the Metro;

"a 37 year old father of one police officer collapsed and died whilst
taking part in a 100 mile bike ride in North Devon. The rider was half
way through the event when he collapsed whilst riding up a steep hill.
The remaining 55 policemen on the ride decided to continue".

and on the same day 4 participants in the Great North Run also died.

whilst there are always lessons to be learned from these events it is
still a great tragedy for all the families concerned.

One of the lessons for participants might be found in the health
screening effect of public sporting events, like the exercise tests
that cardiologists administer. With the same infrequent negative
outcomes...
As a bloke with a 'glass half full' outlook on life I wonder how many
participants actually notice unwelcome symptoms and seek advice, thus
*improving* their life expectancy almost immediately

Pete Connors
--
mono<losethis>treme@ntl<andthis>world.com

Simon Brooke said:

Up, but within two thousand feet of the top, and much too high to get his
body down again, so he's still up there. Not a bad way to go, and not a
bad place to be buried:

Yeah, except that with so many obviously unsuitable people attempting
to climb Everest these days it is in danger of becoming a bit of a
graveyard.

And letting these people go up Everest in the first place surely counts
as some form of assisted suicide. I'm not sure that's such a great
thing.

It's also a very different scenario to taking part in a "fun" run.
Anyone that attempts to climb Everest is probably aware that it's an
extremely dangerous thing to do. I doubt anyone enters an event like
the Great North Run imagining it's the last thing they'll ever do. By
all means let the great unfit masses enter these races, but at least
make sure they are aware of the risk to their lives.

d.