What's the diff between a decent $1300 and jaw dropping $3000 mtn

"Destroy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I realize that the price increase is usually from the increase in quality and lighter weight
components on a bike but what does that translate to when its ridden?

I've never ridden a $3000 mtn bike and am basically wondering what does it do, feel, handle, pedal
like compared to a lesser bike. Is it really that different?

What would/does one notice different when riding both bikes?

This comparison assumes both bikes are FS and disc braked btw.

The 3K bike will have better wheels, suspension (front and back) and components.

$1300 can buy a really nice hardtail, but is pretty much entry level for FS
w/d-brakes (IMO).

Still, fit is everything. You can always upgrade stuff on a quality frame.

Bits Buyer Bill

$1700 is the difference in a nutshell. I have a 01 Giant Warp DS-1, paid $899 for it. I have been
upgrading it slowly, replacing the stock cranks and bb with a RaceFace setup, and upgrading to the
Sram X.0 shifters and rear derailleur. The bike came with the Hayes mechanical disk brakes,and I
replaced those with the same, and now an 8" front rotor. So now I figure I have a ~$1400 bike. Next
on the list, new wheelset, and maybe a new rear shock and forks, although the suspension works great
for me as it is. I would call it a cross country/freeride setup as it is now. I have ridden a few
high dollar bikes, and I cannot tell any difference. Mechanical disks properly set up and maintained
are just as good as hydraulic, plus they don't leak. They both start to fade when the heat builds
up. Some of the bikes are lighter, but it really depends on the bike setup. The difference in weight
is most noticeable in the cross country bikes, not in the freeride or downhill category. The key to
a great bike is getting it fitted to your body... correct seat height and position, and especially
the bars and stem. I have ridden with many people on high dollar bikes and can keep up with them
anywhere, though I do fall back a little on long climbs to the lighter cross country riders, but
usually fly by them coming back down. As far as quality, I am upgrading to higher quality parts, but
had very good luck and longevity with the cheaper parts my bike came with, except the cranks and
bb... they were truely a POS. The trick here is proper maintenance and I believe again the bike
setup to your body. If you are more in control and more comfortable on the bike, you are less likely
to crash. Less wipeouts mean less parts replacing, and higher quality parts are obviously more
expensive! If you are into serious downhilling, freeriding, and hucking 4'+ drops. It doesn't matter
how much money you spend, you will be fixing and replacing parts constantly. My best story was a
trip a few weeks ago to Brianhead, UT. Some punk kid was looking at my bike and talking [censored]... POS
Giant, blah blah blah. He had a very nice Intense freeride bike, said he paid $2600 for it. At the
end of the Bunker Creek trail, a 12 mile downhill run, he was bloody and bruised, and about 20
minutes behind me and my POS. Save some $$$, you can get an awesome bike for $1300 to $1500. Even
when you start replacing parts down the road, you are still way ahead.

"Destroy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I realize that the price increase is usually from the increase in quality and lighter weight
components on a bike but what does that translate to when its ridden?

I've never ridden a $3000 mtn bike and am basically wondering what does it do, feel, handle, pedal
like compared to a lesser bike. Is it really that different?

What would/does one notice different when riding both bikes?

This comparison assumes both bikes are FS and disc braked btw.

From: "dave89144" <[email hidden]> Newsgroups: alt.mountain-bike Subject: Re: What's the
diff between a decent $1300 and jaw dropping $3000 mtn bike? Message-ID:
<OM_Va.32644$Ne.20244@fed1read03> Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2003 19:02:34 -0700 Organization: Cox
Communications

Quoted message said:

$1700 is the difference in a nutshell.

How uninformative and incorrect of you.

Quoted message said:

I have a 01 Giant Warp DS-1, paid $899 for it.

Warning sign #1.

Quoted message said:

I have been upgrading it slowly, replacing the stock cranks and bb with a RaceFace setup, and
upgrading to the Sram X.0 shifters and rear derailleur.

If you paid full-pop for a better speced bike to begin with, you would not have had to spend non-OEM
retail for parts you replaced the original [censored] spec parts with.

Quoted message said:

The bike came with the Hayes mechanical disk brakes, and I replaced those with the same, and now
an 8" front rotor.

That's just plain idiotic. Replace something you already have? I suppose you have a single crown
fork up front as well, don't you?

Quoted message said:

So now I figure I have a ~$1400 bike.

No, you still have a POS because you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear.

Quoted message said:

Next on the list, new wheelset, and maybe a new rear shock and forks, although the suspension
works great for me as it is.

Yeah, why not replace parts that don't need replacing? You are getting more idiotic by the
line here.

Quoted message said:

I would call it a cross country/freeride setup as it is now.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA...now THAT'S funny!

Quoted message said:

I have ridden a few high dollar bikes, and I cannot tell any difference.

Tell us barney, what bikes and which sidewalk?

Quoted message said:

Mechanical disks properly set up and maintained are just as good as hydraulic, plus they don't
leak. They both start to fade when the heat builds up.

Mechanical vs Hydraulic is debatable, especially in wet vs dry environs. You need to get out more.
As far as fade goes, try metallic compound pads for mechanical disc brakes the next time you feel
the need to "upgrade".

Quoted message said:

Some of the bikes are lighter, but it really depends on the bike setup. The difference in weight
is most noticeable in the cross country bikes, not in the freeride or downhill category.

That may be true in some cases, but is definitely not a rule. You also seem to have forgotten, or
just do not know that the manufacturing process and materials used in most botique frames are FAR
superior to joe blow cookie cutter bikes.

Quoted message said:

The key to a great bike is getting it fitted to your body... correct seat height and position, and
especially the bars and stem.

This is an especially funny notion coming from you, joe budget, since a good CUSTOM frame will
always fit everyone better than any cookie cutter.

Quoted message said:

I have ridden with many people on high dollar bikes and can keep up with them anywhere, though I
do fall back a little on long climbs to the lighter cross country riders, but usually fly by them
coming back down.

Holy [censored], it's BATMAN! I was wondering when you would come out of the Bat-Cave. Can I have your
autograph? BTW, there are a lot of lamers out there on high-zoot (or what they think are high-zoot)
mountain bikes. I'm glad you have had the chance to meet some of the many.

Quoted message said:

As far as quality, I am upgrading to higher quality parts, but had very good luck and longevity
with the cheaper parts my bike came with, except the cranks and bb... they were truely a POS.

Make sure to keep us posted as parts break, Batman. With your powers, that shouldn't take very long
because you are so much faster than the rest of us mere mortals.

Quoted message said:

The trick here is proper maintenance and I believe again the bike setup to your body. If you are
more in control and more comfortable on the bike, you are less likely to crash. Less wipeouts mean
less parts replacing, and higher quality parts are obviously more expensive!

Let's give Batman a cigar for stating the obvious!

Quoted message said:

If you are into serious downhilling, freeriding, and hucking 4'+ drops. It doesn't matter how much
money you spend, you will be fixing and replacing parts constantly.

If you are a serious dumbass, you will believe Batman's words and be a dumbass constantly.

Quoted message said:

My best story was a trip a few weeks ago to Brianhead, UT. Some punk kid was looking at my bike
and talking [censored]... POS Giant, blah blah blah. He had a very nice Intense freeride bike, said he
paid $2600 for it. At the end of the Bunker Creek trail, a 12 mile downhill run, he was bloody and
bruised, and about 20 minutes behind me and my POS.

Sounds like you were both on POS bikes. BTW, it usually takes a fair amount of time (like 20 minutes
for example) to gather oneself together after a bloody and bruising crash. He sounds like almost as
much of a dumbass as you do.

Quoted message said:

Save some $$$, you can get an awesome bike for $1300 to $1500.

For full suspension, forget Batman's lame advice above. Putting a dress on a cow and calling it a
hot chick would be less ridiculous than "fixing up" a crappy frame. It all starts with the frame and
a lame frame will always make for a lame bike, no matter how you spec it.

Quoted message said:

Even when you start replacing parts down the road, you are still way ahead.

What a boneheaded statement. It's "when" you start replacing parts, so he admits that it is at least
an eventuality, even for the seldom riding Batman. Non-OEM retail is for suckers and Batman here
seems to be the King of the suckers.

JD

Destroy said:

I realize that the price increase is usually from the increase in quality and lighter weight
components on a bike but what does that translate to when its ridden?

I've never ridden a $3000 mtn bike and am basically wondering what does it do, feel, handle, pedal
like compared to a lesser bike. Is it really that different?

What would/does one notice different when riding both bikes?

This comparison assumes both bikes are FS and disc braked btw.

Weight, reliability, and durability.

An XT or XTR drive train will outlast a Deore or LX setup and also be lighter.

On the $3k bike, you'll also probably find a high-end wheelset, like the Crossmax XL. This bike will
also usually have a top of the line fork, high quality seatpost, hbar, and stem, and hydraulic discs
vs. mechanical.

For me the main selling point of a high-end MTB over a low end model is all about wheels and forks
these days. Both of these items are extremely expensive to swap out later.

Barry

RE/

Quoted message said:

I've never ridden a $3000 mtn bike and am basically wondering what does it do, feel, handle, pedal
like compared to a lesser bike. Is it really that different?

Mine cost about $3,800 - and closer to $4,500 now that I've replaced the rear wheel/gears with an
(expensive...) internal hub.

Seems to me like the Law Of Diminishing Returns sets in pretty hard in the case of bike components.

I also think there's a substantial penalty incurred when one assembles their own parts rather than
buying a pre-built bike. The manufacurers have to be getting volume discounts and there's more
likelihood of finding distressed merchandise or at least marked-down merchandise.

Make no mistake, my current bike is clearly better bike than another I had costing than half
that amount.

But is it over twice as good? A judgement call....but my judgement would be "no way".

OTOH, my wheels are solid as a rock: Hope hubs, Mavic 517 rims, and SS double-butted spokes. The
wheels on the factory bike were [censored]. The spokes started breaking out after less than a thousand
miles and the front wheel couldn't be removed without first removing the disc caliper.

The other components on the factory bike worked - but not as well as what I have now. The disk
brakes on it were bottom-of-the-line Magura - which are ok, but not in the same class as the
Hope C2's I have now: the C2's levers are vastly more adjustable, comfortable, and functional.
The factory bike's discs were drilled in a goofey 4-bolt pattern while the rest of the world
uses 6 bolts.

turned out to be elastomer and got loose sooner than I thought it should and didn't work all that
well in cold weather. It also came with a maintainence schedule/procedure that made me uneasy just
trying to read it. The current bike has a 'zocci x-fly 100 that needs an oil change every year or so
and maybe new seals eventually...period. They both work, but the 'zocci feels and works better.

All-in-all, I have no regrets about sinking so much money into something that gives me so many hours
of pleasure....but it's clearly another judgement call and I'm open to accusations of having more
money than common sense....Geeze, if my wife ever finds out how much this thing cost she'd probably
try to have me certified and committed....

-----------------------
PeteCresswell