Simple chain cleaning question

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm going to replace the chain on my bike on Saturday. Got the new
chain (SRAM PC68) which according to Nashbar is the correct one for my
7 gear cassette, although SRAM doesn't say so.

Now I'm not going to start a chain cleaning thread. I went through the
old messages and there were plenty on the subject.

No, my question is: the new chain is sticky. Am I supposed to clean it
before using or is it ready to use? You'd think that it would say in
the instructions but no, that isn't covered.

I would recommend it. That sticky stuff in a sort of assembly type
substance, it is thick and sticky, and is put on just to prevent surface
rust while it is sitting around in the warehouse waiting to be sold.

Ken

dgk said:

Now I'm not going to start a chain cleaning thread. I went through the old
messages and there were plenty on the subject.

Oh yes you are starting a religious war...

LOL

I know that the stuff's just used to keep the chains rust free in
storage...but I usually just wipe the outside of the chain down with a
solvent to remove the sticky on the outside. A rag moistened with wd40 is
good for this (good solvent, bad lube). Then scrub your chain relatively
dry with a cleanish rag. All the slippery goodness is on the inside
where it won't suck up dirt.

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm going to replace the chain on my bike on Saturday. Got the new
chain (SRAM PC68) which according to Nashbar is the correct one for my
7 gear cassette, although SRAM doesn't say so.

Now I'm not going to start a chain cleaning thread. I went through the
old messages and there were plenty on the subject.

No, my question is: the new chain is sticky. Am I supposed to clean it
before using or is it ready to use? You'd think that it would say in
the instructions but no, that isn't covered.

Oh boy, not another "Is the stuff that ships on my chain lube?", thread. I
am running as fast as I can out the door.

For more fun ask about helmets saving lives.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Frank Drackman said:

Oh boy, not another "Is the stuff that ships on my chain lube?", thread. I
am running as fast as I can out the door.

For more fun ask about helmets saving lives.

I like the ones about hanging bicycles by the wheels.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

Tom Keats said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Frank Drackman said:

Oh boy, not another "Is the stuff that ships on my chain lube?", thread. I
am running as fast as I can out the door.

For more fun ask about helmets saving lives.

I like the ones about hanging bicycles by the wheels.

Yes I've (almost) learned my lesson. Perhaps we have a thread on how to
hang your helmet.

"gds" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tom Keats said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Frank Drackman said:

Oh boy, not another "Is the stuff that ships on my chain lube?",

thread. I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

am running as fast as I can out the door.

For more fun ask about helmets saving lives.

I like the ones about hanging bicycles by the wheels.

Yes I've (almost) learned my lesson. Perhaps we have a thread on how to
hang your helmet.

Helmet? My bike is supposed to have a helmet? Where is it attached?

--

-----
Joe S.

On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 19:56:56 GMT, maxo <[email hidden]> wrote:

<On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 15:24:59 -0400, dgk wrote:
<
<> Now I'm not going to start a chain cleaning thread. I went through the old
<> messages and there were plenty on the subject.
<
<Oh yes you are starting a religious war...
<
<LOL
<
<I know that the stuff's just used to keep the chains rust free in

My understanding is that you lube, wax or whatever to keep the chain from
rusting. If it rusts, a link(s) will tighten and the chain will skip. I "use"
the factory lube until the first time I'm caught in the rain, then I toss it
into the cleaning bottle.

<storage...but I usually just wipe the outside of the chain down with a
<solvent to remove the sticky on the outside. A rag moistened with wd40 is
<good for this (good solvent, bad lube). Then scrub your chain relatively
<dry with a cleanish rag. All the slippery goodness is on the inside
<where it won't suck up dirt.

Alternatively, you can toss the chain in a plastic container with solvent, I use
paint thinner(cheap), shake, hang out to dry, mount and relube. You clean the
chain to prolong it's life and indirectly the rings and cogs. If you don't want
to keep it clean, just replace them them more often.

If it doesn't rust, it'll perform. If you also keep it clean, it'll perform
longer. PC-48 is a good choice for 7sp, at half the cost of a PC68.

William Holiday said:

Alternatively, you can toss the chain in a plastic container with
solvent, I use paint thinner(cheap), shake, hang out to dry, mount and
relube. You clean the chain to prolong it's life and indirectly the
rings and cogs. If you don't want to keep it clean, just replace them
them more often.

I'm new to the chain shakin' in the plastic bottle method, but I'm keen to
try it. Problem is that I'm riding a single speed with full coverage
skinny fenders most all the time, and a KMC heavy duty nickel chain--well
the damn thing just doesn't seem to get dirty. LOL Haven't touched it in
three months and it's still silent and shiny bright. 😄

I'm a Simple Green kind of guy, the detergent action seems to lift the
schmutz better than plain solvent, though there's always opportunities
when you need the heavy stinky artillery. :P

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

William Holiday said:

Alternatively, you can toss the chain in a plastic container with
solvent, I use paint thinner(cheap), shake, hang out to dry, mount and
relube. You clean the chain to prolong it's life and indirectly the
rings and cogs. If you don't want to keep it clean, just replace them
them more often.

I'm new to the chain shakin' in the plastic bottle method, but I'm keen to
try it. Problem is that I'm riding a single speed with full coverage
skinny fenders most all the time, and a KMC heavy duty nickel chain--well
the damn thing just doesn't seem to get dirty. LOL Haven't touched it in
three months and it's still silent and shiny bright. 😄

I'm a Simple Green kind of guy, the detergent action seems to lift the
schmutz better than plain solvent, though there's always opportunities
when you need the heavy stinky artillery. :P

Simple green is a pretty decent cleaner, but it takes longer to "really"
work. BOTOH it is not as harsh as some stuff that people use. I go for the
generic green stuff, and have been lubing with 2 stroke oil, but I think I
am going to go with a wax type lube next time.

Ken

"Helmet? My bike is supposed to have a helmet? Where is it attached?"

Draped over the stem, where it acts as an airfoil. --Roy Zipris

William Holiday said:

Alternatively, you can toss the chain in a plastic container with solvent, I use
paint thinner(cheap), shake, hang out to dry, mount and relube. You clean the
chain to prolong it's life and indirectly the rings and cogs. If you don't want
to keep it clean, just replace them them more often.

If it doesn't rust, it'll perform. If you also keep it clean, it'll perform
longer. PC-48 is a good choice for 7sp, at half the cost of a PC68.

A poster on this list performed an experiment where he cleaned half his
chain only, he reported no difference in chain wear. So far no one else
has confirmed this by repeating the experiment, but I've stopped
cleaning my chains.

On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:35:43 -0700, Dane Jackson <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

dgk said:

No, my question is: the new chain is sticky. Am I supposed to clean it
before using or is it ready to use? You'd think that it would say in
the instructions but no, that isn't covered.

Just wipe the outside off with a clean cloth, maybe use a little cleaner
on the cloth if you really want to. The lube that comes on the SRAM chains
is fine. Just apply some oil every so often after it rains or when it
starts to squeak.

Primitive rule #1 of chain maintenance: NEVER lubricate a dirty chain.

See: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/chain-care.html

jeverett3<AT>earthlink<DOT>net http://home.earthlink.net/~jeverett3

Frank Drackman said:

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm going to replace the chain on my bike on Saturday. Got the new
chain (SRAM PC68) which according to Nashbar is the correct one for my
7 gear cassette, although SRAM doesn't say so.

Now I'm not going to start a chain cleaning thread. I went through the
old messages and there were plenty on the subject.

No, my question is: the new chain is sticky. Am I supposed to clean it
before using or is it ready to use? You'd think that it would say in
the instructions but no, that isn't covered.

Oh boy, not another "Is the stuff that ships on my chain lube?", thread. I
am running as fast as I can out the door.

Sorry. I did find a thread from 10/29/2004 which did cover the same
subject. The concensus seems to be to use Simple Green to remove the
gunk, rinse it with water, dry it off - possibly using WD40, and then
lube.

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Frank Drackman said:

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm going to replace the chain on my bike on Saturday. Got the new
chain (SRAM PC68) which according to Nashbar is the correct one for my
7 gear cassette, although SRAM doesn't say so.

Now I'm not going to start a chain cleaning thread. I went through the
old messages and there were plenty on the subject.

No, my question is: the new chain is sticky. Am I supposed to clean it
before using or is it ready to use? You'd think that it would say in
the instructions but no, that isn't covered.

Oh boy, not another "Is the stuff that ships on my chain lube?", thread.
I
am running as fast as I can out the door.

Sorry. I did find a thread from 10/29/2004 which did cover the same
subject. The concensus seems to be to use Simple Green to remove the
gunk, rinse it with water, dry it off - possibly using WD40, and then
lube.

That is pretty much the method I use. I have used this method both on and
off the bike. On the bike is far more difficult. I recommend removal of the
chain. I skip the WD-40 step, although I can see where this would be useful
to displace the water from the rinse cycle.

Ken

John Everett said:

On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:35:43 -0700, Dane Jackson <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

dgk said:

No, my question is: the new chain is sticky. Am I supposed to clean it
before using or is it ready to use? You'd think that it would say in
the instructions but no, that isn't covered.

Just wipe the outside off with a clean cloth, maybe use a little cleaner
on the cloth if you really want to. The lube that comes on the SRAM chains
is fine. Just apply some oil every so often after it rains or when it
starts to squeak.

Primitive rule #1 of chain maintenance: NEVER lubricate a dirty chain.

See: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/chain-care.html

Sigh. I just knew someone wouldn't be able to resist. I was even
trying not to incite anyone.

Suffice it to say (as Peter Cole points out elsewhere in the thread),
at least one person (I believe it was Carl Fogel) ran an experiment about
this exact topic. He ran a chain with two pieces. One was washed and
lubed, one was only lubed. Over the life of the chain he was never able
to detect any difference.

Even if he *had*, or someone repeated it and did repudiate his claims,
I still wouldn't wash my chain.

Lets do some math:

1 SRAM pc-59 chain = $15

Cleaner sufficient to clean chain over it's lifespan ( $2 )
Time spent cleaning it (say 10 times, every 300 miles over 3000 miles): 3 hours
Say you get 1000 extra miles from cleaning it (i.e. from 2000 -> 3000)

Savings from not having to buy chains as often.
$7.50 - $2 (cleaning fluid) - 3 hours of your time.

So you've saved a whole $5.50 at the cost of four hours of labor.

I don't know about you, but I get paid *significantly* more than $2 an hour.

Feel free to go on cleaning your chain, it doesn't bother me a whit.

Link to Carl Fogel's discussion in question:

http://tinyurl.com/cwsgc

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
668:
The neighbor of the beast.

Dane Jackson said:

Time spent cleaning it (say 10 times, every 300 miles over 3000 miles): 3 hours

Correction (fencepost error): This should be 9 times.

Quoted message said:

Say you get 1000 extra miles from cleaning it (i.e. from 2000 -> 3000)

Savings from not having to buy chains as often.
$7.50 - $2 (cleaning fluid) - 3 hours of your time.

So you've saved a whole $5.50 at the cost of four hours of labor.

Correction: That should be *three* hours for this ^^^ line also.

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
We may not like doctors, but at least they doctor. Bankers are not ever
popular but at least they bank. Policeman police and undertakers take
under. But lawyers do not give us law. We receive not the gladsome light
of jurisprudence, but rather precedents, objections, appeals, stays,
filings and forms, motions and counter-motions, all at $250 an hour.
-- Nolo News, summer 1989

Peter Cole said:

A poster on this list performed an experiment where he cleaned half his
chain only, he reported no difference in chain wear.

That's some dedication to science! ROFL!! Since both halves of the chain
share the same sprockets it seems a bit flawed, as the dirty parts will
'taint the clean.

Quoted message said:

So far no one else
has confirmed this by repeating the experiment, but I've stopped cleaning
my chains.

To be honest, the reasons I clean my chain and sprockets, which isn't too
horribly often:

*looks purty and shiny
*quieter
*less [censored] on my hands if I have to change a flat

I use fairly cheap chains, so longevity ain't on my short list. :P

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Cole said:

A poster on this list performed an experiment where he cleaned half his
chain only, he reported no difference in chain wear.

That's some dedication to science! ROFL!! Since both halves of the chain
share the same sprockets it seems a bit flawed, as the dirty parts will
'taint the clean.

I second that thought, seems like the tester needed to clean half his brain!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So far no one else
has confirmed this by repeating the experiment, but I've stopped cleaning
my chains.

To be honest, the reasons I clean my chain and sprockets, which isn't too
horribly often:

*looks purty and shiny
*quieter
*less [censored] on my hands if I have to change a flat

I use fairly cheap chains, so longevity ain't on my short list. :P

Yeah thats the way I look at it, BOTOH keeping the chain clean would most
likely extend the usable life of the chainrings and the freewheel /
cassette. And those can get kind of expensive.

Ken

Ken said:

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Cole said:

A poster on this list performed an experiment where he cleaned half his
chain only, he reported no difference in chain wear.

That's some dedication to science! ROFL!! Since both halves of the chain
share the same sprockets it seems a bit flawed, as the dirty parts will
'taint the clean.

I second that thought, seems like the tester needed to clean half his brain!

Dunno about that (I genuinely don't know). If the mad scientist's
goal was to determine whether chain life is extended when a chain's
/innards/ are thoroughly cleaned, then the test may still have been
valid . . . to a degree.

IIRC, it's not that he found /no difference/. I think he found that a
'thoroughly' cleaned chain actually had /shorter/ life--something many
of us might find counterintuitive.

Some (including me) theorized that the reason for this was: it's
difficult to lubricate a chain's innards thoroughly without an
immersion method. Superficial spraying/dripping likely wouldn't
penetrate the bushings and pins, leaving a spotlessly clean surface
devoid of lubricant -- a recipe for wear.

What I took from his experiment (link to the original thread below) is
this (and I like it because it simplifies my life!): either clean AND
lube via immersion or clean AND lube on the bike, (basically)
concentrating on the exposed surfaces.

My theory is just a theory. The guy who did the experiment understood
its limitations, as did we all, but we all applauded his effort and
found his results quite interesting.

Found it. Tom Gibbs's experiment:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.tech/browse_frm/thread/5111ea9559c08e30/d795cf15ef34b3c2?q=chain+halves+experiment+group:rec.bicycles.tech&rnum=1&hl=en#d795cf15ef34b3c2

or http://snipurl.com/fnkm