Giant XTC4?

in message <[email hidden]>, Wally

(') said:

Been looking at 2nd-hand bikes... Any thoughts on the Giant XTC4 (2004
model, I think), for trail riding and light off-roading? The one I'm
interested in has a 21" frame - I'm 5'10", 11st, with 32" inside leg.

So far as I can tell, the only downside of this bike is the SunTour
fork, but I don't really know how the other bits rate, other than the
MPH3 hydraulic brakes are probably decent (I guess).

My LBS sells them, and I've had a good look at one. Reasonably nice XC
hardtail, well up to more than just 'light' off roading. As you say the
fork isn't wonderful, and the disks are (I think) Giant's own brand.
But not a bad bike. Reasonable value at £500 new, and if you can get a
good one for under about £300 second hand (and it fits you) I'd call
that a bargain.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; better than your average performing pineapple

Simon Brooke said:

My LBS sells them, and I've had a good look at one. Reasonably nice XC
hardtail, well up to more than just 'light' off roading. As you say
the fork isn't wonderful,

My feeling is that the fork can be changed for something better if I feel
the need. Seems to me that the frame is a good alloy (6061 Aluxx Flowform,
apparently), and I think starting with a good frame is a sensible move.

Quoted message said:

and the disks are (I think) Giant's own
brand.

Yup, EBCoop say they're very good copies of Hope brakes.

Quoted message said:

But not a bad bike. Reasonable value at £500 new, and if you
can get a good one for under about £300 second hand (and it fits you)
I'd call that a bargain.

Sounds like it's worth pursuing - next step is to get a look at it. Just
found out that the owner is 6'1" with a 32" inside leg, so I guess the
saddle and top bar heights will suit - maybe he has a longer reach,
though...

--
Wally
www.artbywally.com/FiatPandaRally/index.htm
www.wally.myby.co.uk

Wally said:

Sounds like it's worth pursuing - next step is to get a look at it. Just
found out that the owner is 6'1" with a 32" inside leg, so I guess the
saddle and top bar heights will suit - maybe he has a longer reach,
though...

Hub @ Glentress ex hire? One of those is what I rode on both of my trips
off-road. Seems a pretty nice bike. Brakes are perfectly adequate and
have the advantage of adjustability from the bars.

If you weren't looking ex-hire, then I'd recommend it. They probably
don't take as much of a kicking as you might expect as the hirers tend
to be novices who take it slow. ;-)

Jon

Jon Senior said:

Wally said:

Sounds like it's worth pursuing - next step is to get a look at it.
Just found out that the owner is 6'1" with a 32" inside leg, so I
guess the saddle and top bar heights will suit - maybe he has a
longer reach, though...

Hub @ Glentress ex hire? One of those is what I rode on both of my
trips off-road. Seems a pretty nice bike. Brakes are perfectly
adequate and have the advantage of adjustability from the bars.

If you weren't looking ex-hire, then I'd recommend it. They probably
don't take as much of a kicking as you might expect as the hirers tend
to be novices who take it slow. ;-)

Slow or not, the bikes tend to be in use a lot more of the time than the
average "proper" mountain biker's own bike, and there's less time to look
after them. I'd always be wary of expensive drivetrain parts dying all at
once on hire bikes...

In article <[email hidden]>, doki

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Hub @ Glentress ex hire? One of those is what I rode on both of
my trips off-road. Seems a pretty nice bike. Brakes are perfectly
adequate and have the advantage of adjustability from the bars.

If you weren't looking ex-hire, then I'd recommend it. They
probably don't take as much of a kicking as you might expect as
the hirers tend to be novices who take it slow. ;-)

Or teenage hooligans who try to wreck them.

Quoted message said:

Slow or not, the bikes tend to be in use a lot more of the time
than the average "proper" mountain biker's own bike, and there's
less time to look after them. I'd always be wary of expensive
drivetrain parts dying all at once on hire bikes...

Useage over a year is probably not a lot different from private bikes
- I don't hire a lot in the winter but in good weather in the summer
useage is high (and weather dependent). Most hire bikes are well
maintained - it's not good for business or profitability if you have
to go and collect breakdowns.

--
A T (Sandy) Morton
on the Bicycle Island
In the Global Village
http://www.millport.net

Wally ([email hidden]) wrote:
: Been looking at 2nd-hand bikes... Any thoughts on the Giant XTC4 (2004
: model, I think), for trail riding and light off-roading? The one I'm
: interested in has a 21" frame - I'm 5'10", 11st, with 32" inside leg.
: So far as I can tell, the only downside of this bike is the SunTour fork,
: but I don't really know how the other bits rate, other than the MPH3
: hydraulic brakes are probably decent (I guess).

I'm 5'9" and both my MTBs are 17" ... a 21" frame is pretty big for
someone 5'10".
Blair.

Wally said:

Been looking at 2nd-hand bikes... Any thoughts on the Giant XTC4 (2004
model, I think), for trail riding and light off-roading? The one I'm
interested in has a 21" frame - I'm 5'10", 11st, with 32" inside leg.

So far as I can tell, the only downside of this bike is the SunTour
fork, but I don't really know how the other bits rate, other than the
MPH3 hydraulic brakes are probably decent (I guess).

What the other bloke said. 6 foot 1 and riding an 18" frame.

in message <[email hidden]>, B.G. Finlay

(') said:

Wally ([email hidden]) wrote:
: Been looking at 2nd-hand bikes... Any thoughts on the Giant XTC4
: (2004 model, I think), for trail riding and light off-roading? The
: one I'm interested in has a 21" frame - I'm 5'10", 11st, with 32"
: inside leg. So far as I can tell, the only downside of this bike is
: the SunTour fork, but I don't really know how the other bits rate,
: other than the MPH3 hydraulic brakes are probably decent (I guess).

I'm 5'9" and both my MTBs are 17" ... a 21" frame is pretty big for
someone 5'10".

Can't (easily) tell with mountain bikes. I've got one with an 18" frame
and one with the 21" - the 18" one is bigger. It all depends on the
geometry, to the raw numbers aren't very useful.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Age equals angst multiplied by the speed of fright squared.
;; the Worlock

doki said:

Slow or not, the bikes tend to be in use a lot more of the time than the
average "proper" mountain biker's own bike, and there's less time to look
after them. I'd always be wary of expensive drivetrain parts dying all at
once on hire bikes...

Not so much slow as in "not fast", but slow as in "don't throw
themselves headlong off 10 foot dropoffs"! ;-) They do get some serious
use, but no more so than a normal second hand bike and they are run on a
reasonable rotation system (AFAICT). I've not heard anything bad from
anyone who's hired there, and the Bike Station has run at least one
social and several outreach events there with no complaints.

Obviously they won't be as good as a new bike, but they are a reasonable
saving (Enough to raise the class of bike you'd choose by a couple of
notches!).

Jon

I had a look at the bike this evening. Here are my observations...

The seat post seemed to get tight with about 5" of travel still to go, so
the saddle was a bit high to get my leg over. However, it seemed fine once I
was on it - didn't have a problem with distance to pedals. Straddling the
top tube with my feet on the ground, there was 2-3" clearance.

It has a few scratches and bits of chipped paint, and worn paint where
cables have been chafing against the tubes.

The front tyre is worn and needs replaced, the rear looks fine.

The rear brake pads need replaced (fronts are fine). No rubbing or
squealing. I thought the brakes were excellent in use - the sort of brakes
I've always felt a bike should have.

Pushing sideways against the cranks revealed some play in the bottom
bracket - very slight, but it was definitely there. Can this be adjusted, or
are these things 'sealed for life' these days?

The Manitou Axel Comp front shocks had some slight pitting in the stanchions
(apparently, these are both sprung and oil-damped). Trying to push down on
the forks with the front brake locked, I didn't feel I was getting much
compression, although the seller seemed to manage more than me.

The gears had some sort of white grease on them, rather than oil. I didn't
really look close enough at these parts, because I'm not really sure what to
look for. I can only assume that they are in reasonable condition,
commensurate with the use the bike has had. When I first pedalled down the
street, there was a clicking, as if the chain wasn't quite meshed properly
with one of the cogs, but this disappeared after a few shifts up and down.

The starting price (no bids yet) is £250. Currently, these can be had for
£450 new, with £50 of cycling clothing thrown in, or £400 new elsewhere.
This one has been used mainly for trail riding and farting about at
Glentress, once a fortnight for a year. Seems to me that a spend of £30-50
on bits is required, plus attention to the BB, and maybe the forks. I told
the seller that, given the condition and current new price, I'd be willing
to go £200 on it. He has someone else looking at it on Sunday evening, and
the auction ends on Monday.

Opinions?

--
Wally
www.artbywally.com/FiatPandaRally/index.htm
www.wally.myby.co.uk

in message <[email hidden]>, Wally

(') said:

I had a look at the bike this evening. Here are my observations...

The seat post seemed to get tight with about 5" of travel still to go,
so the saddle was a bit high to get my leg over. However, it seemed
fine once I was on it - didn't have a problem with distance to pedals.
Straddling the top tube with my feet on the ground, there was 2-3"
clearance.

It has a few scratches and bits of chipped paint, and worn paint where
cables have been chafing against the tubes.

The front tyre is worn and needs replaced, the rear looks fine.

The rear brake pads need replaced (fronts are fine). No rubbing or
squealing. I thought the brakes were excellent in use - the sort of
brakes I've always felt a bike should have.

Pushing sideways against the cranks revealed some play in the bottom
bracket - very slight, but it was definitely there. Can this be
adjusted, or are these things 'sealed for life' these days?

Replace (fortunately easy and inexpensive).

Quoted message said:

The Manitou Axel Comp front shocks had some slight pitting in the
stanchions (apparently, these are both sprung and oil-damped). Trying
to push down on the forks with the front brake locked, I didn't feel I
was getting much compression, although the seller seemed to manage
more than me.

The gears had some sort of white grease on them, rather than oil. I
didn't really look close enough at these parts, because I'm not really
sure what to look for.

Look for wear in the chainrings and cassette. Again, it's easily
fixable, but it's all money. It's harder to spot with modern
'quickshift' irregularly shaped teeth, but the thing to look for is a
shark's fin shape - that's a /bad/ sign, particularly if it's on more
than the odd tooth.

Quoted message said:

I can only assume that they are in reasonable
condition, commensurate with the use the bike has had. When I first
pedalled down the street, there was a clicking, as if the chain wasn't
quite meshed properly with one of the cogs, but this disappeared after
a few shifts up and down.

The starting price (no bids yet) is £250.

Don't pay much more.

Quoted message said:

Currently, these can be had
for £450 new, with £50 of cycling clothing thrown in, or £400 new
elsewhere. This one has been used mainly for trail riding and farting
about at Glentress, once a fortnight for a year. Seems to me that a
spend of £30-50 on bits is required, plus attention to the BB, and
maybe the forks. I told the seller that, given the condition and
current new price, I'd be willing to go £200 on it.

That seems sensible, particularly if the forks are dodgy. Replacing
those will not be cheap.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

A message from our sponsor: This site is now in free fall

Simon Brooke said:

Quoted message said:

Pushing sideways against the cranks revealed some play in the bottom
bracket - very slight, but it was definitely there. Can this be
adjusted, or are these things 'sealed for life' these days?

Replace (fortunately easy and inexpensive).

Righto.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The gears had some sort of white grease on them, rather than oil. I
didn't really look close enough at these parts, because I'm not
really sure what to look for.

Look for wear in the chainrings and cassette. Again, it's easily
fixable, but it's all money. It's harder to spot with modern
'quickshift' irregularly shaped teeth, but the thing to look for is a
shark's fin shape - that's a /bad/ sign, particularly if it's on more
than the odd tooth.

Noted. If it goes further, I'll have a closer look at these.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The starting price (no bids yet) is 250.

Quoted message said:

Don't pay much more.

TBH, I'm not sure I want to pay that much for this bike. In general, I liked
it (it's far better than anything I've ever ridden before - felt solid, the
push-button gear changing was a breeze, and the brakes were brilliant), but
I kinda feel that the additional spend and effort make it a tough call
against a new bike of similar quality. I have a funny feeling that I'd be
replacing more bits than I'm presently aware need to be replaced, and I'm
not really into that. I'm also wondering if the frame was maybe a tad on the
large side - not much goolie swing space over the top tube if I have to put
my feet down on rough ground. My instinct is saying I should walk away.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I told the seller that, given the condition and
current new price, I'd be willing to go 200 on it.

Quoted message said:

That seems sensible, particularly if the forks are dodgy. Replacing
those will not be cheap.

Been looking at other Giant bikes on the web. The XTC SE looks interesting
at £500. Main difference from the used XTC4 seems to be Marzocchi Race
forks, 100mm travel, while the current XTC4 (also 500 quid) has 75mm SunTour
forks.

Even more interesting is some place called www.pedalon.co.uk, who do a deal
where you get credit points to spend on accessories to the value of up to
25% of the initial spend. Good range of stuff to choose from - tools,
lights, spares, clothes, computers, etc. The points to pounds exchange rate
seems to vary, but 1pt=£10 seems a reasonable average (£500 gets 10 points).
Since I don't have *any* bikey stuff (other than plenty of car-type tools),
I'm very tempted. So much for a 90 quid bike from Asda!

Any thoughts on the Marzocchi Race forks? Are they just springies, or do
they do damping as well?

--
Wally
www.artbywally.com/FiatPandaRally/index.htm
www.wally.myby.co.uk