bikes on cars on trains

Can't help on the aerodynamics, I'm afraid. Obviously the petrol
consumption will rise a bit, but as a percentage of the whole holiday
it will be a small amount - you're only talking about a few pounds each
way.

I wouldn't have thought buying there would be a good idea, unless you
arrange before you set off. You probably don't want to spend the first
part of your holiday traipsing round bike shops to find the bikes you
want. And then there's the initial servicing a new bike needs.

We've always taken bikes when we went Eurocamping. They're very handy
round the campsite and you get to see the countryside better. Not much
thieving goes on on campsites - obviously there's opportunists anywhere
but you won't get professional thieves with bolt croppers, so any small
lock will do. Many people leave their bikes unlocked, and they're
usually lucky.

Be aware that most cheap travel insurance won't cover bikes (probably
because so many people leave them unlocked) so you''ll need to make
sure your house policy covers them abroad.

As for racks - if you haven't go a towbar, the roof is better. If
you're making an overnight stop or sightseeing on the way down, make
sure you have a means of locking them to the car.

"davek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm planning the family summer holiday at the moment (we're going to the
Ile de Re, near La Rochelle in France) and deciding what is the best
option with regard to taking the bikes. Have done a good bit of research
already but would appreciate further comments / ideas / criticisms /
whatever...

I managed to find roofbox.co.uk, which seems to be an excellent resource
for info about different types of car cycle carriers. I don't have a
towball, and don't intend to fit one, so the choice is between
rear-door-mounted carriers and roof racks.

If possible, reconsider fitting a towbar. My car didn't have one and I had
one fitted specifically for a bike carrier and I'm very glad I did. Well
worth the initial expense. A towbar-mounted bike carrier is extremely
stable. I've travelled to Italy, France & Germany with bikes thus and the
bikes remained safe & secure throughout, even on some very, very potholed &
cobbled Italian roads :-) Plus there is the advantage that I don't have to
worry about height of vehicle in any way. In the past, I have transported
bikes on a roof rack, no problems as regards bikes staying there BUT, there
was *noticeable* increase in wind noise which was a PITA. The other thing
*I* find in favour of towbar-mounted bike carrier is ease of getting bikes
on & off it. Weedy moi and mechanically-challenged moi can easily fit the
bike carrier to the towbar and fit the bikes to the carrier. I found it
impossible for me to get the bikes on the roof fitting without assistance
from personal bike/car mechanic (husband). Whatever decision you make, have
a great holiday.

Cheers, helen s

davek said:

There are two important factors influencing my choice:
1. Height - we're crossing the channel on the Eurotunnel. That shouldn't
be a problem, since their website says they can easily accommodate
overheight cars with advance notice. (Anyone have any experience of
doing this? Is it really that painless?) But I'm also concerned about
other height-related hazards en route, eg car parks.

We used to have one of the rear mounted hanging ones and went through on
the train as a large vehicle. All that happens is they stick you in a
single level carriage.

Quoted message said:

2. Fuel consumption - we've got a fairly long drive (~500 miles) down to
the Ile, so I'm assuming the extra weight and drag of a couple of bikes
on the back/top of the car could make a significant difference to how
much petrol we use.

Just a bit. Between carrying everything including the kitchen sink and
hanging bikes on the back, my folks see a significant (~10mpg) drop in
efficiency. On the upside, if you drive a diesel, the fuel is cheaper.

Jon

Jon Senior said:

We used to have one of the rear mounted hanging ones and went through

on

Quoted message said:

the train as a large vehicle. All that happens is they stick you in a

Quoted message said:

single level carriage.

Sounds simple enough. Did you need to notify them in advance?

Quoted message said:

significant (~10mpg) drop in
efficiency.

Ouch. That's nasty. Still, only to be expected, I guess.

d.

wafflycat said:

If possible, reconsider fitting a towbar. My car didn't have one and

I had

Quoted message said:

one fitted specifically for a bike carrier and I'm very glad I did.

Well

Quoted message said:

worth the initial expense.

The expense is what puts me off, but I'll certainly give it some more
thought - they do seem to be widely recommended.

Quoted message said:

Whatever decision you make, have
a great holiday.

I will, thank you! :-)

d.

davek wrote:

[tunnelery]

I've taken my motorcar through the tunnel with a brace of MTB's on a Pendle
towbar-mounted wheel support rack. No advance warning, no extra fare, no
prombles at all. Even with the bikes on the back, it's probably narrower
than a Roller...

Didn't notice much increase in fuel consumption either, as long as I kept to
about 120-130 km/h on the autoroute. Trying to keep up with the Natives was
counter-productive coz we had to stop for gas more often.

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Electricity comes from other planets.

Dave Larrington said:

Didn't notice much increase in fuel consumption either, as long as I kept to
about 120-130 km/h on the autoroute.

On the contrary, my experience of bombing down the autoroutes with
bikes on the back and a roofbox[1] on top, is that you can actually
seen the needle of the fuel guage moving.

Brendan
[1] Last year we used a trailer instead, with the bikes on top of
it, and that seemed to be rather more fuel efficient than the
aerodynamically disastrous roofbox.
--
Brendan Halpin, Department of Sociology, University of Limerick, Ireland
Tel: w +353-61-213147 f +353-61-202569 h +353-61-338562; Room F2-025 x 3147
[email hidden] http://www.ul.ie/sociology/brendan.halpin.html

Brendan Halpin said:

seen the needle of the fuel guage moving.

s/seen/see/ and s/guage/gauge/

I can tolerate one msitake, two is too muhc.

Brendan
--
Brendan Halpin, Department of Sociology, University of Limerick, Ireland
Tel: w +353-61-213147 f +353-61-202569 h +353-61-338562; Room F2-025 x 3147
[email hidden] http://www.ul.ie/sociology/brendan.halpin.html

Brendan Halpin said:

On the contrary, my experience of bombing down the autoroutes with
bikes on the back and a roofbox[1] on top, is that you can actually
seen the needle of the fuel guage moving.

I didn't have a roofbox, which I suspect makes most of the difference.

A Leftpondian chum reported that on the way to Battle Mountain in 2002, he
had descended from the mountains behind Salt Lake City and set off west on
I-80, into a ferocious headwind. Given that he was driving a Cadillac
Escalade and towing a trailer bigger than most BRITONS' houses, it will not
come as a surprise to hear that the fule consumption readout dropped to
about 4 mpg...

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Barley, barley, barley, world cruise. You never see a farmer on a bike.

Dave Larrington said:

the fule consumption readout dropped to
about 4 mpg...

fule consumption? would that be 4 molesworths per gallon?

chiz.

d.

On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:58:40 +0000, Jon Senior

jon_AT_restlesslemon_DOT_co_DOT_uk said:

davek said:

There are two important factors influencing my choice:
1. Height - we're crossing the channel on the Eurotunnel. That shouldn't
be a problem, since their website says they can easily accommodate
overheight cars with advance notice. (Anyone have any experience of
doing this? Is it really that painless?) But I'm also concerned about
other height-related hazards en route, eg car parks.

Put a big sticker on the dash reminding you.

Quoted message said:

We used to have one of the rear mounted hanging ones and went through on
the train as a large vehicle. All that happens is they stick you in a
single level carriage.

My experience too. We told them we were 1.8m tall, which _I think_
meant they charged more, BICBW. Keep schtumm seem the best way. We
were behind a coach of rugby players on tour and were treated to one
of them completing a forfeit of running the length of our carriage
nekkid as a jay.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2. Fuel consumption - we've got a fairly long drive (~500 miles) down to
the Ile, so I'm assuming the extra weight and drag of a couple of bikes
on the back/top of the car could make a significant difference to how
much petrol we use.

I guess fuel consumption is going to depend how aerodynamic your car
is in the first place. I've got a Laguna, so any sticky up bits stuff
the fuel consumption big time.

Tim

davek said:

Sounds simple enough. Did you need to notify them in advance?

Once, but we also did it by just rolling up to the height markers and
turning off when they went thud.

Quoted message said:

Ouch. That's nasty. Still, only to be expected, I guess.

Fraid so. I did have some grand ideas about making a transparent sock
that would fit over the boot and form a continuous surface over the
bikes. Then I put my bike on a train and cycled instead.

Jon

"davek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm planning the family summer holiday at the moment (we're going to the
Ile de Re, near La Rochelle in France) and deciding what is the best
option with regard to taking the bikes. Have done a good bit of research
already but would appreciate further comments / ideas / criticisms /
whatever...

I managed to find roofbox.co.uk, which seems to be an excellent resource
for info about different types of car cycle carriers. I don't have a
towball, and don't intend to fit one, so the choice is between
rear-door-mounted carriers and roof racks.

One thing I have set my mind on is that if I go for a rear mounted
carrier, I'm going for one with wheel support, rather than one you "hang"
the bikes on. That feels like an obvious decision and seems to be backed
up by the info on roofbox.

There are two important factors influencing my choice:
1. Height - we're crossing the channel on the Eurotunnel. That shouldn't
be a problem, since their website says they can easily accommodate
overheight cars with advance notice. (Anyone have any experience of doing
this? Is it really that painless?) But I'm also concerned about other
height-related hazards en route, eg car parks.
2. Fuel consumption - we've got a fairly long drive (~500 miles) down to
the Ile, so I'm assuming the extra weight and drag of a couple of bikes on
the back/top of the car could make a significant difference to how much
petrol we use.

I'm not sure whether rear mounted or roof mounted is better with regard to
the latter. I've noted lots of useful tips from past discussions of this
subject in URC - eg remove pedals for ease of fitting, use pipe lagging to
protect paintwork, secure wheels to stop them rotating, etc. - but the
matter of aerodynamics seems to draw conflicting opinions.

In any case, I'm intending to minimise the effects as far as possible by
not driving fast, but that doesn't really answer my question...

Likewise, I'm not sure which is better for protecting the bike from the
elements - neither is ideal, obviously, but there just won't be space
inside the car, so that is not an option.

For my Renault Scenic, roofbox recommends the Atera Linea (£205) or the
Tradekar Jumbo (£140) - both look great, but a bit pricey. These are both
rear-door-mounted carriers with wheel support. Another option in similar
vein but much cheaper is the Thule ClipOn High (£98). Roofbox doesn't
specifically recommend any roof carriers for my car. Rear mounted carriers
seem to be the simpler option.

I could happily go for the Atera if it really is the best - the main
reason for the purchase is the journey in August, but I'm also looking to
get lots of use out of whatever I buy in the long term. Anyone have any
experience of the Atera? Is it really that good? Its light weight seems to
be in its favour, but how much of a difference does that make in practice,
especially when it is laden with bikes?

Either the Thule or the Tradekar look likely choices at the moment, being
neither the most basic nor the most expensive options.

Another possibility is to not take our bikes and just hire some bikes when
we get there. It would be cheaper, probably, and more convenient in some
ways, but I am instinctively drawn towards having /my/ bike with me on
holiday, rather than someone else's. (When we went to CenterParcs, I was
very disappointed with the quality and condition of the hire bikes and I'm
not keen to go through that experience again, though I expect there are
hire shops that can lend you something much better than what you get at
CenterParcs, especially in France).

I'm also considering the possibility of not taking any bikes with us but
buying bikes for the whole family when we get there - wife and son both
need new bikes and I'm sure I could find an excuse why I /need/ one, too.

(Anyone know about availability of Puky bikes in France? Are they easier
to come by than they are in the UK? And how do prices compare?)

Whatever we do, I must remember to get some decent locks - we'll be
staying on a campsite (Eurocamp) so security is an issue.

Can't wait, though - I'm long overdue a decent break (last proper family
holiday was two summers ago, and that wasn't an especially restful
occasion) and the prospect of some nice family bike outings in the French
countryside is very exciting - in a peaceful, relaxing kind of way. Aside
from the driving there and back, I'm planning to not use the car at all
while we're there, if I can help it.

Well first off enjoy your holiday - as regards the rest I would invest in a
towbar and get a rack to fit - I'm not sure that it wouldn't be competitive
given the quoted price of the Linea. I am assuming your Scenic will be full
so no space for an in-vehicle rack - my favourite choice.

As regards bikes I am a fairly frequent visitor to France and have both
browsed shops and hired bikes. sadly I have not seen Puky bikes in any bike
shops; however if buying for children Decathlon seem to have expanded their
range this year with some quite good stuff. Also for those here who ride
small wheels they seem to do a superb range of inner tube sizes - own brand
at reasonable prices. As regards hire bikes I have never found one to hire
in holiday resorts that would top the £200 mark here - this doesn't mean
they can't be fun but they do have the obvious limitations. On the other
hand I remember vividly getting a puncture on Ile Yeu and phoning the shop
from a bar only to have a replacement bike delivered 15 minutes later so
although the bike was made of recycled gas-pipe I had a great day out.

HTH
Julia

One thing the other posters appear to have neglected is that the
continental authorities are rather hot on making sure you do not
obscure your tail lights and numberplate. If you buy a rear-mounted
rack, you either need to make sure it can be fitted so that the bikes
do not obscure anything even from odd angles. If they do obscure your
lights or plate, you will need to have an electrical connection for a
number plate board, which needs to be fitted at the same height as your
original number plate.

HTH, HAND etc.

Alan

JBB said:

Well first off enjoy your holiday

Thank you!

- as regards the rest I would invest in a

Quoted message said:

towbar and get a rack to fit - I'm not sure that it wouldn't be

competitive

Quoted message said:

given the quoted price of the Linea.

Mmmm, yes, Helen said the same so I can see it is definitely worth
considering.

Quoted message said:

I am assuming your Scenic will be full
so no space for an in-vehicle rack - my favourite choice.

Yes, the car is liable to be full - if not on the way there then
definitely on the way back (several cases of wine are bound to take up
a fair bit of space)

Quoted message said:

As regards bikes ... Decathlon seem to have expanded their
range this year with some quite good stuff.

You're not the first person to say that! I shall definitely be looking
in at Decathlon. It also occurs to me that I could probably get some
decent clothing cheaper over there than here.

Quoted message said:

As regards hire bikes I have never found one to hire
in holiday resorts that would top the £200 mark here - this doesn't

mean

Quoted message said:

they can't be fun but they do have the obvious limitations.

Indeed - I've kind of made my mind up that I definitely want to be
riding /my/ bike, even if it is more inconvenient from a transportation
point of view.

On the other

Quoted message said:

hand I remember vividly getting a puncture on Ile Yeu and phoning the

shop

Quoted message said:

from a bar only to have a replacement bike delivered 15 minutes later

so

Quoted message said:

although the bike was made of recycled gas-pipe I had a great day

out.

Good point, though I can usually repair a puncture myself in the same
time, so perhaps not such an important consideration.

How's the Ile d'Yeu? That's very close to where I used to go on family
holidays from the ages of about 10-14, though we always stayed on the
mainland and never actually made it across to the island.

d.

The Luggage said:

One thing the other posters appear to have neglected is that the
continental authorities are rather hot on making sure you do not
obscure your tail lights and numberplate.

Cheers for pointing that out. It does bother me the number of cars I
see going around in the UK with bikes on the back and no lighting
board, so it's something I'm wary of anyway, but will be sure to pay
extra careful attention. (Likewise, must remember to get a red warning
triangle etc)

d.

"davek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

As regards hire bikes I have never found one to hire
in holiday resorts that would top the £200 mark here - this doesn't

mean

Quoted message said:

they can't be fun but they do have the obvious limitations.

Indeed - I've kind of made my mind up that I definitely want to be
riding /my/ bike, even if it is more inconvenient from a transportation
point of view.

On the other

Quoted message said:

hand I remember vividly getting a puncture on Ile Yeu and phoning the

shop

Quoted message said:

from a bar only to have a replacement bike delivered 15 minutes later

so

Quoted message said:

although the bike was made of recycled gas-pipe I had a great day

out.

|Good point, though I can usually repair a puncture myself in the same
|time, so perhaps not such an important consideration.

With hire bikes you don't seem to get a pump and puncture outfit so really I
was delighted with the level of service.

|How's the Ile d'Yeu? That's very close to where I used to go on family
|holidays from the ages of about 10-14, though we always stayed on the
|mainland and never actually made it across to the island.

Ile d'Yeu is delightful although a fair way offshore (about 30 miles I
think), one port on the east side and a smaller one on the other, cliffs,
beaches and an old castle; not many cars and a load of bikes. We were
sailing so hired although now we have a couple of EBC bikes that go in the
cockpit locker in bags. One thing to be warned about if you visit one of the
offlying islands is the fare for taking a bike means it is sometimes cheaper
to hire one when you get there. fare for August seem to be 13.80 for an
adult and 8.80 for a pushbike.

HTH
Julia