Also wondering....

x-no-archive: yes

SzaszFan said:

I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins to
something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned from
Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.

Most folks modify their personal eating habits based upon what's
successful for them.

I disagree that SBD is less restrictive; I think it's differently
restrictive.

Quoted message said:

I thing Atkins is great because its teaching me moderation (or right
now, complete denial) of all the things that have gotten me in trouble
in the past (carb-loaded chips, candy, high-carb beer).

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never have
any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want to sit
down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again, maybe have
some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.

As you continue and gradually add back some carbs to find your own
critical level, you'll know how many you can eat per day and still be
successful. Then you can decide which foods work for you and which
don't. You may decide to eat less or more fat, include fruit rather
than starch, or vary it.

You don't need a commercial diet plan to do that for you, you're already
back in control, right?

Susan

SzaszFan said:

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never
have any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want
to sit down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again,
maybe have some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.

You are misunderstanding Atkins. Please read the rest of the book.
In OWL you add in more carb sources, and in maintenance you add in
even more.

"Pasta" will make you fat.

Low carbers who return to carbs often regain rapidly. (so they say)

"SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins to
something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned from
Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.

I thing Atkins is great because its teaching me moderation (or right
now, complete denial) of all the things that have gotten me in trouble
in the past (carb-loaded chips, candy, high-carb beer).

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never have
any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want to sit
down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again, maybe have
some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.

Anyways, those are my thoughts. I'm on day 5 of Atkins induction and
I've basically stuck to it... comments welcomed.

-SF

Control I think is what its all about for me. Regarding the other
comments, yes, I have the Atkins book, and yes, I've been reading it.
I'm not misunderstanding it, I am just having trouble agreeing with
everything in it, lock, stock and barrel.

I *know* that this will cause me to lose weight. That's why I'm doing
it. I just checked the scales today (I know I shouldn't have) and I've
already dropped approximately 3 pounds (probably just a fluctuation or
water weight, but I don't care).

I just don't want this to be a religion for me. Its more about
replacing bad habits with moderate, healthy habits, with the option to
eat, drink and be merry (indulge) every once in a while.

One of the bad habits I had gotten into recently was stress-eating two
jumbo-sized chocolate bars almost every evening after a heavy,
carb-laden meal which typically included 2-3 full-carb "micro" brews.
Consequently, I have gained approximately 25 pounds over the past year
and a half (20 of it in the past eight months), despite the fact I
excercise (typically running and biking) about 3-5 times per week.

Anyways, you can do a little light flaming of my post if you like. I am
all for lowering my carb intake and making it a regular habit for me.
However, I'm really trying to find out how extreme this has to be, and
for how long. I know that lots of intelligent people disagree on how
low-carbing should properly be done.

Susan said:

x-no-archive: yes

SzaszFan said:

I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned

from

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.

Most folks modify their personal eating habits based upon what's
successful for them.

I disagree that SBD is less restrictive; I think it's differently
restrictive.

Quoted message said:

I thing Atkins is great because its teaching me moderation (or

right

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

now, complete denial) of all the things that have gotten me in

trouble

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in the past (carb-loaded chips, candy, high-carb beer).

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never

have

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want to

sit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again, maybe have
some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.

As you continue and gradually add back some carbs to find your own
critical level, you'll know how many you can eat per day and still be

Quoted message said:

successful. Then you can decide which foods work for you and which
don't. You may decide to eat less or more fat, include fruit rather
than starch, or vary it.

You don't need a commercial diet plan to do that for you, you're

already

Quoted message said:

back in control, right?

Susan

"SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyways, you can do a little light flaming of my post if you like. I am
all for lowering my carb intake and making it a regular habit for me.
However, I'm really trying to find out how extreme this has to be, and
for how long. I know that lots of intelligent people disagree on how
low-carbing should properly be done.

There is no law that says you have to do Atkins just because you bought the
book. Read several different low carb diets books, find out what things
they have in common and what are the differences. Read up some on
nutrition, make up your own diet based on what you learn. Also I think
there is a book out on that, comparing the diets to help you decide which
one might work better for you. I don't recall the name of it, though.

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

"SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins to
something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned from
Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.

I've been low carb for almost three years and I've been at my present
weight, which I'm happy with, for probably two years. My objective is to
stay below 180 lbs and I've found the approach that works for me. YMMV.
I go to the gym six days a week for an hour or so. Three days I do cardio
and three weights with a trainer (alternating days). I keep this as a very
high priority and I rarely miss a day.
I don't weigh, measure or count any component of what I eat. Day-to-day I
eat no starchy vegetables, no fruit, no sugar except for a small amount of
dark chocolate after lunch. I have three meals a day and no snacks in
between and I take a multi-vit, calcium citrate and a whey shake each day.
I drink water, tea (three cups a day) vodka and sherry.
I go out to eat two or three times a month and I eat and drink whatever I
like. Yesterday we went to a steak house for lunch; I had a crab cake to
start, followed by tenderloin of beef with french fries and vegetables and I
had a big piece of berry [censored] for dessert. loaded with sugar and flour! Oh,
and two glasses of red wine. But then I had an avocado for dinner last
night, piperade for lunch today and I'll have an avocado this evening.
I weigh every day and write the result on a post it on the door of the
fridge. If it starts to creep up I cut back immediately, so it doesn't go
more than two or three pounds before I catch it.
I don't feel at all deprived!

It's called maintenance. You need to read the whole book, induction is only
a small part of Atkins.

In news:[email hidden],
SzaszFan <[email hidden]> stated
| I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins to
| something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned from
| Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.
|
| I thing Atkins is great because its teaching me moderation (or right
| now, complete denial) of all the things that have gotten me in trouble
| in the past (carb-loaded chips, candy, high-carb beer).
|
| Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never have
| any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want to sit
| down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again, maybe have
| some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.
|
| Anyways, those are my thoughts. I'm on day 5 of Atkins induction and
| I've basically stuck to it... comments welcomed.
|
| -SF

SzaszFan said:

I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins to
something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned from
Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.

I thing Atkins is great because its teaching me moderation (or right
now, complete denial) of all the things that have gotten me in trouble
in the past (carb-loaded chips, candy, high-carb beer).

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never have
any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want to sit
down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again, maybe have
some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.

Anyways, those are my thoughts. I'm on day 5 of Atkins induction and
I've basically stuck to it... comments welcomed.

-SF

Really learning WILLPOWER is probably more involved than just staying on
Atkins while you lose whatever initial weight you wish to lose.

If you really do learn WILLPOIWER, then you probably won't need any
specific diet plan, but will naturally EAT LESS and EXERCISE MORE.

I don't know how to learn willpower as an isolated skill.

If you find out how to learno it (distinct from doing it, much as
learning Calculus is different from doing it), please let us know.

Jim

Perdu, you really struck a chord with me. Your last two paragraphs are
exactly it (for me, anyway). I have small failures probably once a
week. The reason I believe LC is easier than most approaches is
because I am not SO hungry like I have been on other plans. I remember
being on Weight Watchers back in '99 and sitting, thinking about the
ice cream or Cheetos, or whatever else I didn't allot points for that
day. Then I would eventually give in, running to the kitchen screaming
in my head, "But I'm STARVING!!!" I know that on LC, if I get hungry,
I can grab a controlled-carb snack, like a hard-boiled egg or handful
of nuts, and I'm actually going to get SATISFIED, not hungrier or
fatter.

At any rate, emotionally we still have to do all the same work any
weight-loser must. We just don't have that added nagging hunger
coupled with blood sugar dips and peaks, which I think makes it a whole
lot easier.

--
Jen in ND
184/174/140

"Perdu" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 27 Apr 2005 09:04:53 -0700, "SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> said :

Quoted message said:

Anyways, you can do a little light flaming of my post if you like. I am
all for lowering my carb intake and making it a regular habit for me.
However, I'm really trying to find out how extreme this has to be, and
for how long. I know that lots of intelligent people disagree on how
low-carbing should properly be done.

Flame yourself. It's all personal. None of us here are qualified to flame
you. Although there will be volunteers who thinks so. Filter it.

To the point : You can't do this with an attitude of reserving the right
to be indulging every now and then. What you will learn that if you follow
this correctly, your indulgence needs and levels as well as its quality
will become manageable and will take a different form.

Follow the first steps strictly. The induction. By the time you need to
move on your results will have changed your attitude.

There is Fun to be had here as well. The feeling of energy. New way of
eating. New foods to explore. And examining of old habits that were
hurtful, realizing what amount of damage they had done. You will be
looking
at candy bars and you will shake your head. And if you will see someone
you
love eat one, your heart will hurt.

I agree that a lot of people do this "religiously" and take the book and
the lifestyle way too seriously. It is not for me, as well. I had
individualized this process every step of the way. And I'm totally
freakin'
stoked at the results and the layers of results.

Hope you stick with it strictly at first. Then, individualize it to your
needs and then whatever left after the needs had been filled, to your
comfort.

What a good post - "layers of results", I really like that one!

Nicky.

--
A1c 10.5/4.5/<6 Weight 95/77/72Kg
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
T2 DX 05/2004

Perdu, thank you for the thoughtful and very encouraging post. This is
my plan - stick with the plan strictly and then individualize. I think
Dr. Atkins low-carb dieting plan makes sense, but I also think Dr. Dean
Edell's philosophy of "Eat Drink & Be Merry" makes sense, and I'm sure
there's a sensible marriage of the two to be found.

Gotta get through Induction first. Day Six here we come...

Perdu said:

On 27 Apr 2005 09:04:53 -0700, "SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> said

:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyways, you can do a little light flaming of my post if you like.

I am

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

all for lowering my carb intake and making it a regular habit for

me.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

However, I'm really trying to find out how extreme this has to be,

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

for how long. I know that lots of intelligent people disagree on

how

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

low-carbing should properly be done.

Flame yourself. It's all personal. None of us here are qualified to

flame

Quoted message said:

you. Although there will be volunteers who thinks so. Filter it.

To the point : You can't do this with an attitude of reserving the

right

Quoted message said:

to be indulging every now and then. What you will learn that if you

follow

Quoted message said:

this correctly, your indulgence needs and levels as well as its

quality

Quoted message said:

will become manageable and will take a different form.

Follow the first steps strictly. The induction. By the time you need

to

Quoted message said:

move on your results will have changed your attitude.

There is Fun to be had here as well. The feeling of energy. New way

of

Quoted message said:

eating. New foods to explore. And examining of old habits that were
hurtful, realizing what amount of damage they had done. You will be

looking

Quoted message said:

at candy bars and you will shake your head. And if you will see

someone you

Quoted message said:

love eat one, your heart will hurt.

I agree that a lot of people do this "religiously" and take the book

and

Quoted message said:

the lifestyle way too seriously. It is not for me, as well. I had
individualized this process every step of the way. And I'm totally

freakin'

Quoted message said:

stoked at the results and the layers of results.

Hope you stick with it strictly at first. Then, individualize it to

your

Quoted message said:

needs and then whatever left after the needs had been filled, to your
comfort.

--

Perdu

x-no-archive: yes

SzaszFan said:

Control I think is what its all about for me. Regarding the other
comments, yes, I have the Atkins book, and yes, I've been reading it.
I'm not misunderstanding it, I am just having trouble agreeing with
everything in it, lock, stock and barrel.

I disagree with a lot of the Atkins book, so do a lot of other folks
here. Take what makes sense to you and leave the rest. The important
thing is that by lowering carbs, you regained glycemic control and
control of your appetite.

Quoted message said:

I *know* that this will cause me to lose weight. That's why I'm doing
it. I just checked the scales today (I know I shouldn't have) and I've
already dropped approximately 3 pounds (probably just a fluctuation or
water weight, but I don't care).

I just don't want this to be a religion for me. Its more about
replacing bad habits with moderate, healthy habits, with the option to
eat, drink and be merry (indulge) every once in a while.

I don't know where you got the idea that low carbing is a cult, many
folks here eat 100 grams per day or more, many can't or choose not to.
We each have to find the foods that make us feel good, healthy, and that
don't trigger cravings and loss of control. I doubt there are many long
term low carbers here who follow Atkins or any other diet plan exactly
as written.

Quoted message said:

One of the bad habits I had gotten into recently was stress-eating two
jumbo-sized chocolate bars almost every evening after a heavy,
carb-laden meal which typically included 2-3 full-carb "micro" brews.
Consequently, I have gained approximately 25 pounds over the past year
and a half (20 of it in the past eight months), despite the fact I
excercise (typically running and biking) about 3-5 times per week.

I can see how low carbing could help you break such a cycle. Keep the
exercise up, though! :-)

Quoted message said:

Anyways, you can do a little light flaming of my post if you like. I am
all for lowering my carb intake and making it a regular habit for me.
However, I'm really trying to find out how extreme this has to be, and
for how long. I know that lots of intelligent people disagree on how
low-carbing should properly be done.

You seem to be inviting flames for no reason that I can see. We each
have our own individual ways of tailoring lower carb eating to meet our
needs.

Susan

In article <[email hidden]>,

Perdu said:

On 27 Apr 2005 06:58:39 -0700, "SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> said :

Quoted message said:

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never have
any of this stuff for the rest of my life.

Early on in life I had summarized that Cyanide, Acid, Bleach and the like
was poison. And that I should probably never ingest any of it. And I was
fine with that, for the rest of my life.

On a much lesser scale, without being a fanatic, I'm becoming OK with
never ever having another potato chip. Or Cheetos. Or even white bread.

Exactly. Before low-carb, I was a pastaholic. People who know me well
even made jokes about how much pasta I ate and all the different ways I
made it. When I started low-carb, I said I'd have a small serving of
pasta no more than once a week, if I really wanted it. Well, it was a
couple of months before I _really_ wanted it, and I finally had some.
After I ate it I was all "Huh? Why did I use to like this so much?"
Haven't had any since, haven't wanted it since. My tastes changed.

None Given said:

"SzaszFan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyways, you can do a little light flaming of my post if you like.

I am

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

all for lowering my carb intake and making it a regular habit for

me.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

However, I'm really trying to find out how extreme this has to be,

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

for how long. I know that lots of intelligent people disagree on

how

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

low-carbing should properly be done.

There is no law that says you have to do Atkins just because you

bought the

Quoted message said:

book. Read several different low carb diets books, find out what

things

Quoted message said:

they have in common and what are the differences. Read up some on
nutrition, make up your own diet based on what you learn. Also I

think

Quoted message said:

there is a book out on that, comparing the diets to help you decide

which

Quoted message said:

one might work better for you. I don't recall the name of it,

though.

Quoted message said:

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

Are you thinking of "Living the Low Carb Life" by Jonny Bowden? GREAT
book that compares different ways of eating; it helped me make my
choice.

....joy

"Joy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Are you thinking of "Living the Low Carb Life" by Jonny Bowden? GREAT
book that compares different ways of eating; it helped me make my
choice.

I don't know, maybe. Did Dana Carpender write one like that also? I think
she writes mostly cookbooks, though.

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

"Bob..............................(with thanks to privacy.net)"
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm on the exact diet you mention. the zero-carb eat dink and be merry
diet. it's great )

Mostly the drink and be merry part?

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

That's my plan exactly. I have done Atkins since January 3 of this
year and I have lost 51 pounds so far with only twenty more to go for
my ideal body weight. I tried South Beach last summer and lost about
ten, but I fell off the wagon and gained it all back over Thanksgiving
and Christmas. I am now much more motivated and expect to follow it
more religiously like I have Atkins.

I think South Beach is much easier to follow on a day to day basis and
if I find myself gaining, I will probably go back to Atkins
maintenance.

LinuxGeek
254/203/184

SzaszFan said:

I'm wondering if anyone has transitioned successfully from Atkins to
something more resembling the South Beach Diet... or transitioned

from

Quoted message said:

Atkins to something slightly less restrictive.

I thing Atkins is great because its teaching me moderation (or right
now, complete denial) of all the things that have gotten me in

trouble

Quoted message said:

in the past (carb-loaded chips, candy, high-carb beer).

Of course, I don't see it as realistic to tell myself I can never

have

Quoted message said:

any of this stuff for the rest of my life. And frankly, I want to sit
down to a plate of (preferably whole-wheat) pasta again, maybe have
some ice cream, etc. But in moderation.

Anyways, those are my thoughts. I'm on day 5 of Atkins induction and
I've basically stuck to it... comments welcomed.

-SF