Right now I've got a 53/39 crankset and a 12/23 cassette. All except the times when there is a tailwind on the flats, I am in the small ring, in rear cogs 14-23. So meaning, 39x14 - 39x23. Small enough for any hills I've encountered, and since I ride at an average cadence of 100 rpm it takes me to about 22 mph max, in that small ring. (I never use the two smallest cogs in the small ring, or two largest in the large ring)
At the end of the season, I'd like to do my first cat 5 race. In a course that is not super flat but not super hilly, will the pack be going above and below 22 mph a lot? Because if 22 mph is the mark where I need to go into the big ring, then I'm thinking I might need a wider gear range in back, so I could just stay in the big ring. That is logical, because I don't want to be shifting the front gears a lot...right? Maybe a 12/27 cassette. This would allow me to climb all but the nastiest of hills in the large ring...or not?
Ehhh...not sure about this, so advice is appreciated. And yes I could get a compact crank, but if I only need a new cassette I'd rather save my money. Thanks.
Right now I've got a 53/39 crankset and a 12/23 cassette. All except the times when there is a tailwind on the flats, I am in the small ring, in rear cogs 14-23. So meaning, 39x14 - 39x23. Small enough for any hills I've encountered, and since I ride at an average cadence of 100 rpm it takes me to about 22 mph max, in that small ring. (I never use the two smallest cogs in the small ring, or two largest in the large ring)
At the end of the season, I'd like to do my first cat 5 race. In a course that is not super flat but not super hilly, will the pack be going above and below 22 mph a lot? Because if 22 mph is the mark where I need to go into the big ring, then I'm thinking I might need a wider gear range in back, so I could just stay in the big ring. That is logical, because I don't want to be shifting the front gears a lot...right? Maybe a 12/27 cassette. This would allow me to climb all but the nastiest of hills in the large ring...or not?
Ehhh...not sure about this, so advice is appreciated. And yes I could get a compact crank, but if I only need a new cassette I'd rather save my money. Thanks.
To stay in the pack, you will need to be able to ride in the big ring, I use a 12/25 cassette for flat and moderlately hilly terrain. I raced Cat5 last night and the pack rode from about 22-30mph. I think I only used 3 gears 53/14 -53/17 (maybe thats four gears). I spent most of the time in 53/15. I would start training yourself into the big chainring. Start by riding in your 53/19, or get a 12/25 or 12/27 and then you can start in an even easier gear. Try to move down a gear every couple of weeks. It shouldn't take too long and you'll find yourself riding the big ring and in the middle of your cassette. Why wait until the end of the season to try racing, if you enjoy it youv'e got a long wait unitl you can try again. Worse case, you'll get dropped, learn a lot and come back stronger and smarter.
don't worry about gearing. a standard 39/53 and 12x23 setup works fine for nearly all road racing situations, in all cats. you may dip down to 17 or 18 mph while in the big ring in the pack for a few seconds. don't worry about it.
12-23 sounds like pretty typical race gearing. I'd be surprised if there was a need to go wider than that unless there were pretty big climbs on the course. I'd guess you're more likely to be above 22 mph than much below, so you can stay in the big ring and only drop down to the 39 before a big climb.
If they drop below 22 mph, then you just pedal a little slower in an easy gear.
Hey thanks for the info so far. It seems like 12/23 should be ok...but just to be sure I don't have to switch into the small ring when not on a hill, would there be any real disadvantage in a race if I used 12/27 instead of 12/23? I am assuming the weight difference is negligible, the only thing that comes to mind is the wider range, so there is more difference in between the shifts.
So would there be any other disadvantages of a 12/27 other than spending money?
A rolling CAT 5 or 4/5 race is likely to average around 22 mph meaning yes, you will drop below and jump above 22 mph a lot. If you are going to start racing it is probably a good idea to start easing yourself into the big ring a bit. Remember that riding in a pack can feel a lot like riding with a tailwind, and you will be able to accelerate to a higher top speed turning a bigger gear. I am not suggesting that you mash 53/12 all day but maybe get comfortable spinning at 90 rpm in 53/17 or 53/19. A high cadence is good but we don't all necessarily need to pedal all the time the way Lance does when he attacks in the mountains. Turning big gears some of the time will help to build power, too.
....And I forgot: The smaller cogs on a 12/27 are no different than 12/25. The difference is that instead of the largest four going 19, 21, 23, 25 they go 19, 21, 24, 27. So considering that you won't be using the really easy gears on the flats or short rollers anyway, the 12/27 is probably overkill unless you do a race with a really big climb.
Hey thanks for the info so far. It seems like 12/23 should be ok...but just to be sure I don't have to switch into the small ring when not on a hill, would there be any real disadvantage in a race if I used 12/27 instead of 12/23? I am assuming the weight difference is negligible, the only thing that comes to mind is the wider range, so there is more difference in between the shifts.
So would there be any other disadvantages of a 12/27 other than spending money?
Believe the normal 12-23 9 speed cassette has a 16 gear. 53/16 is a good gear to have for crits....sometimes just what you need between 15 and 17.
If you have to change to the small ring, that shouldn't be a big deal. In fact, it's a quick way to downshift 2-3 gears when you round a corner and head uphill. I'd keep the 12-23, unless you really needed the lower gears for climbing in the 39 ring.
So I need to start using the big ring as much as I can you're saying? Like 53x19...? I actually tried today, but my legs got dog tired right away. Burning in my quads. I average 17 mph solo usually, and 53x19 is a lot faster than 17 mph.
So I need to start using the big ring as much as I can you're saying? Like 53x19...? I actually tried today, but my legs got dog tired right away. Burning in my quads. I average 17 mph solo usually, and 53x19 is a lot faster than 17 mph.
53 x 19 should be good for around 19-20 mph at 90 cadence. Agree that takes a good bit more power than 17 mph, but drafting in a pack should make up most of the difference.
Suggest you start doing 53 x 19 work 1-2 times a week, but don't give up your base endurance miles. Lots of options for big-ring (and lactate) interval training. One way would be to do intervals of 2 to 4 minutes, depending on the leg pain, then spin to recover for that same amount of time, and repeat until you're tired for the day. You could use a power meter or HRM to get a better handle on the correct intensity to produce quickest gains. A little of this hard work should get you big initial improvements. Good luck.
There a two issues getting mixed up in this thread. One is "fitness" - just do your race, you will find out if you're strong enough, since all the theorizing in the world won't provide that answer. It is difficult to tell from a solo average speed what you can do in a race, partly because drafting reduces your power requirement by 30%, and partly because the "real question" will be the power you can put out for fairly short stretches - races tend to be quite "peaky". Back to your original question about gearing. As has been pointed out, 53x39 and 12x23 is almost the "standard" for most races (you will rarely see wider ranges unless it is a real climber's course, and narrower is a criterium set-up). Don't worry about switching from the 53 to the 39 and back - you want the gear that works for your legs. (I'm a spinner like you are - in Prospect Park, for example, I drop to the small ring for the one climb, go right back into the big ring at the top for the rest of the lap, and do this every lap - why not?) Also, even though "cross chaining" is frowned upon as a "normal technique" in a race you just grab the gear you need. I'll use the 53x23 combination on a short climb if I need it, no problem. The only proviso is that if you're in the 53x23 (biggest ring - biggest cog) and drop to the 39, you have a darn good chance of dropping your chain - a bad thing! So if you're going to drop to the small ring, make sure you are somewhere closer to the middle of the rear cogs. But my bottom line is don't worry about the shifting - if your derailleurs are adjusted, they will handle any combination, in a race its all about keeping your cadence where you need it to be.
Is Jan. That's not true. 😄 I usually go up that little incline during the race with my 53 x 19. Between 18 mph to 20 mph. When guys attack, I switch to 53 x 17. Roughly about 23 mph.
palewin said:
There a two issues getting mixed up in this thread. One is "fitness" - just do your race, you will find out if you're strong enough, since all the theorizing in the world won't provide that answer. It is difficult to tell from a solo average speed what you can do in a race, partly because drafting reduces your power requirement by 30%, and partly because the "real question" will be the power you can put out for fairly short stretches - races tend to be quite "peaky". Back to your original question about gearing. As has been pointed out, 53x39 and 12x23 is almost the "standard" for most races (you will rarely see wider ranges unless it is a real climber's course, and narrower is a criterium set-up). Don't worry about switching from the 53 to the 39 and back - you want the gear that works for your legs. (I'm a spinner like you are - in Prospect Park, for example, I drop to the small ring for the one climb, go right back into the big ring at the top for the rest of the lap, and do this every lap - why not?) Also, even though "cross chaining" is frowned upon as a "normal technique" in a race you just grab the gear you need. I'll use the 53x23 combination on a short climb if I need it, no problem. The only proviso is that if you're in the 53x23 (biggest ring - biggest cog) and drop to the 39, you have a darn good chance of dropping your chain - a bad thing! So if you're going to drop to the small ring, make sure you are somewhere closer to the middle of the rear cogs. But my bottom line is don't worry about the shifting - if your derailleurs are adjusted, they will handle any combination, in a race its all about keeping your cadence where you need it to be.
Why wait, it is the start of the season. You need to go out in whatever form you are in, last however long you last...get dropped and by the end of the season, do that Cat 5 race and finish.
There is no point in waiting, get out and race today before you let the whole season pass you by.
Forget about your speed or how fast you can go. Start riding with a group and learn to ride in groups...You can easily go 3-4mph faster in a group when drafting and using different gears, mainly getting out of your small ring.
Just race...every race has different average speeds the flat Cat 4 races I have done this year are averaging 20-26mph...all races are different
Why wait, it is the start of the season. You need to go out in whatever form you are in, last however long you last...get dropped and by the end of the season, do that Cat 5 race and finish.
There is no point in waiting, get out and race today before you let the whole season pass you by.
Forget about your speed or how fast you can go. Start riding with a group and learn to ride in groups...You can easily go 3-4mph faster in a group when drafting and using different gears, mainly getting out of your small ring.
Just race...every race has different average speeds the flat Cat 4 races I have done this year are averaging 20-26mph...all races are different
Good luck!
Good advice. The only way to learn how to race is to race.....just do it. Swapping cassette cogs isn't going to prepare anyone for crit racing.
Agree with Frenk also. "Hills" around here aren't climbed in the big ring. I read that Lance used a 39x27 in the Tour de Georgia big climb stage on Saturday, and Team Navigator Insurance ran triples. Even the pro's need low gears for the steep stuff.
