TACX Trainers

I got the TACX Speedbreaker for when i was recovering from a knee reconstruction. Its a windtrainer so it simulates riding on the road alot better than mag trainers.
The resistence mechanism increases in watts exponentially (the harder u pedal the more resistence) compared to a mag trainer where u can only set it on one resistence level at a time. (I think the maximum wattage on the tacx mags are about 400w, whereas on the speedbreaker its something like 1500w). This is only a concern if u plan on doing maximum anaerobic efforts ie sprints.

Ive tried a Minoura Interim and it is [censored] compared to the tacx.

Only problem with windtrainers is the noise, especially if u put some serious power through it.

Generally cycling on an indoor trainer will be more time efficient (no rolling down hills or stopping at lights) than out on the road. Provided u put the effort in and set a specific program to do the results are good.

Jonny

Thanx for the reply Jonny,

I have the TacX Basic model already, and am thinking of up grading, so i can upload and download rides via Computer

Thanx
Keebler

Turbos are generally not advocated for rides in excess of 1 hour, so I generally find mine good for 5 things:
1/ Warm up before a race
2/ Recovery spins
3/ Interval training
4/ Short time-trial racing against other 'web-riders' on the Tacx i-magic.
5/ Isolated Leg training

In terms of training, whatever intervals you do on the roads can generally just be transferred to the the turbo

Thanks,

How are they in terms of building strength??

Strength training is usually done in a gym in the off-season. On the bike strength training, to the extent that it is done on the roads, can also be done on a trainer. Good examples would include isolated leg training (although I should point out that Ric in particular does not advocate this. However, I've found that my muscles get quite sore doing it, so that's fine for me!), and either varying the resistance or adjusting the gears so that you are pedalling at a relatively low cadence but still gettting a good work out. On the tacx i-magic, there are several 'hills' to climb - but the hills are in fact just extra roller resistance, but the effect is the same, and I go up them just as slowly!

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by KEEBLER
Thanks,

How are they in terms of building strength??

During cycling, it's virtually impossible to build strength for most people. The forces required in cycling are very low.

Shibumi, you're right, i don't advocate sinle leg training. I can't find any evidence to support it's use (other than anecdotal, n=1). Muscles, can get sore for a lot of reasons, lots of them completely unrelated to cycling performance. You certainly wouldn't build strength with single leg reps. You're going to need very high forces and powers at very low cadence to even approach that.

Ric

First thanxs for the replies,

If I can't build strength with cycling, then what can i do (on a trainer) to help better my climbing skills. I am relatively new to the cycling arena, and when i climb hills or try to ride fast, my legs feel like their going to die only after a short distance. I am trying to create a program for my trainer which will better my climbing skills and help me achieve a faster average speed. Maybe its not strength thats the problem????

Please help

Keebler

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by KEEBLER
First thanxs for the replies,

If I can't build strength with cycling, then what can i do (on a trainer) to help better my climbing skills. I am relatively new to the cycling arena, and when i climb hills or try to ride fast, my legs feel like their going to die only after a short distance. I am trying to create a program for my trainer which will better my climbing skills and help me achieve a faster average speed. Maybe its not strength thats the problem????

Please help

Keebler

Endurance cycling isn't strength limited (except in rare circumstances, e.g., someone with a limb disability). Although, it oftens feels during, e.g., uphill riding, that you're limitede by strength this isn't the case. The two most important factors are VO2 max (and power at VO2 max) and power at lactate threshold. For a review on strength in cycling see: http://www.cyclingnews.com/fitness/?id=strengthstern

To prevent your legs feeling like they are going to die, try to start the hills at an easier pace/power and gear down a little, trying to take the climb at a steady effort.

Try to concentrate on endurance, moderate intensity efforts. You'll soon improve. Also, try contacting a coach. If you shoot me an email i'll try to help.

Ric

KEEBLER:

You can get very strong on a trainer. Why don't you do some isolated leg training (ILT)??? It will make your legs stronger and improve many other areas of your cycling.

Some coaches don't believe in it, others do!!! Coaches and riders at the world-class level believe in it, so give it a shot and see for yourself if it is true or not.

You can do your ILT with the front wheel elevated to simulate climbing quite effectively. ILT will fatigue your legs quite rapidly, forcing additional muscle fiber recruitment. This will lead to hypertrophy (growth) and enhanced neuromuscular fitness, all of which make you stronger.

If you study the bodies of time-trial specialists, you will often find they have larger butts and thighs than "normal" road riders. This is extra muscle they have packed on from pushing big gears while seated.

More muscle means more strength, which leads to increased power output. Power= work/time, or in the cyling world, pedal force/time. Stronger mucles produce more pedal force, and last longer before fatiguing.

Put your bike in a 53x11 on the road and ride at 10 mph. That doesn't require much power at all, yet it will feel much harder that riding in a 39x21 at the same speed. The main difference between the two gears is pedal force. Stronger muscles generate higher pedal forces easier than weaker ones.

Find out for yourself what the truth is!!!

Good luck!!!

Obviously, J-Mat is deluded about the truth.

Ric

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by KEEBLER
First thanxs for the replies,

If I can't build strength with cycling, then what can i do (on a trainer) to help better my climbing skills. I am relatively new to the cycling arena, and when i climb hills or try to ride fast, my legs feel like their going to die only after a short distance. I am trying to create a program for my trainer which will better my climbing skills and help me achieve a faster average speed. Maybe its not strength thats the problem????

Please help

Keebler

On your trainer do sessions that improve VO2max and latacte threshold for improving longer hills. For shorter hills do efforts that increase anaerobic capacity. Trainers are great for improving aerobic and anaerobic capacity, but as Ric said your strength won't increase significantly.

First here i would like to thank ric for his loooong and thorough e-mail, I see your point. And it makes sense to me.

2lap It appears strength is not what im missing, rather, like you also reccomended, i have to improve my VO2 max and latacte threshhold.

@ric I will ck out your web site ,

Thanks Again

Keebler

2lap What sessions would you reccomend for increasing those two
I.e hill climbing and crit training ????

to increase Vo2 max, try sessions of ~ 4-mins, starting at 3 efforts, with sveral plus mins recovery in between. these can be done uphill, on the flat or on the trainer.

to increase LT, endurance sessions (e.g., zone 2), tempo (e.g., zone 3) and TT type efforts (zone 4) will all be beneficial. Durations for these will be very dependent upon 1) time you have available to train, 2) your current fitness level

Ric

Originally posted by J-MAT
KEEBLER:

If you study the bodies of time-trial specialists, you will often find they have larger butts and thighs than "normal" road riders. This is extra muscle they have packed on from pushing big gears while seated.

Quoted message said:

Think there is a paper in this, I know some girls that could provide very reliable measures! Although I have never studied the bodies of TT specialists with any passion, I never noticed any difference in the worlds best TTers (boardman, indurain, armstrong, miller, etc) or pursuiters (McGee, Wiggins, etc.). Its also funny how the best TTers and pursuiters in the world also happen to be the best 'normal' road riders in the world! Is it because they happen to be gifted metabolicaly and not in the strength department? I don't recal any of these riders pushing big gears at lowish cadences!

More muscle means more strength, which leads to increased power output. Power= work/time, or in the cyling world, pedal force/time. Stronger mucles produce more pedal force, and last longer before fatiguing.

Quoted message said:

What about track sprinters, arguably the strongest riders in the world yet fatigue the quickest! I've never seen a track sprinter in the tour perhaps they would fatigue (particularly on the climbs) and not last the distance! Also the power at the end of a 1km TT for a track sprinter is often less than 1/3 of the peak power produced at the start of the 1Km TT; thats a huge rate of fatigue!!!

Put your bike in a 53x11 on the road and ride at 10 mph. That doesn't require much power at all, yet it will feel much harder that riding in a 39x21 at the same speed. The main difference between the two gears is pedal force. Stronger muscles generate higher pedal forces easier than weaker ones.

Quoted message said:

You need to be more specific! What do you mean by easier; less metabolic cost, smaller percentage of muscle recruited, etc?Actualy, stronger muscles can generate higher maximal forces than weaker muscles. During endurance cycling, riders never exert the maximal force on the pedals so increaseing the strength (maximal force) will not change ability to cycle in endurance events!!!

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by KEEBLER
2lap What sessions would you reccomend for increasing those two
I.e hill climbing and crit training ????

Refer to Ric's post, he is spot on. I think that Ric refers to the British Cycling 6 Zones of training in his port.

I'm actually referring to the set of zones that i developed, see: http://www.cyclingnews.com/fitness/?id=powerstern

However, i assume that the zones from the BC(F) have been developed using the same physiological principles as mine, and as such should be similar enough to interchange them for some sessions (i.e., endurance based ones).

I assume that physiological principles are the same or very similar as, when i was an undergrad, i was under the tutelage of the physiologist who developed the BCF zones (i.e., Peter Keen, and Louis Passfield).

Ric

Quoted post said:

Put your bike in a 53x11 on the road and ride at 10 mph. That doesn't require much power at all, yet it will feel much harder that riding in a 39x21 at the same speed. The main difference between the two gears is pedal force. Stronger muscles generate higher pedal forces easier than weaker ones.

Changing gears doesnt give you stronger muscles though!

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by ricstern
I'm actually referring to the set of zones that i developed, see: http://www.cyclingnews.com/fitness/?id=powerstern

However, i assume that the zones from the BC(F) have been developed using the same physiological principles as mine, and as such should be similar enough to interchange them for some sessions (i.e., endurance based ones).

I assume that physiological principles are the same or very similar as, when i was an undergrad, i was under the tutelage of the physiologist who developed the BCF zones (i.e., Peter Keen, and Louis Passfield).

Ric

I'll have a look at yours and BC's and do a comparison. As you suggest they are likely to be the same (except for HR v's Power). As long as the principles behind any zone system are both sound and understood by the user, I don't think there is a problem using any system. I like the fact that power Zones can take account of intensities outside the normal HR range (i.e. anaerobic).