Poor Mans Rivendell?

"John Standard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Looking for a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar geometry
to the Romulus/Rambouillet for non loaded touring. Ideally, frame could work both single speed
and geared.

What wrong with getting a Romulus. At "under $1600", you get a complete sports-touring bike that
will serve your purpose.....

[email hidden] (John Standard) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Looking for a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar geometry
to the Romulus/Rambouillet for non loaded touring. Ideally, frame could work both single speed
and geared.

I seriously doubt you'll find near-identical geometry. But consider these as cheaper cousins of the
Romulus (which, IMO, is very modestly priced):

Surly Cross-Check (surlybikes.combikes.htmOpen ↗) Soma frames, built up as you like:
somafab.comsomafab.comOpen ↗

"John Standard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Looking for a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame

with similar geometry to the Romulus/Rambouillet for non > loaded touring.

Quoted message said:

Ideally, frame could work both single speed and geared.

One could argue that a Rambouillet/Romulus IS a poor man's Rivendell, given the price difference
between the custom Riv and the two production frames.

And why "non-lugged" ?. Seems you're intentionally leaving out Heron, which is an alternative to the
Rivendell stuff, as well as Bob Jackson, Marinoni and others who make frames with the more relaxed
geometry you seem to prefer, but all whom build with lugs. No disadvantage with lugs I can see.

www.heronbicycles.com/

ourworld.compuserve.comFBeaucheminOpen ↗

bobjacksoncycles.co.ukdefault.phpOpen ↗

gaansari.comgaansari.comOpen ↗

SB

John asks-<< Looking for a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar
geometry to the Romulus/Rambouillet for non loaded touring. Ideally, frame could work both single
speed and geared. >><BR><BR>

nobilettecycles.comnobilettecycles.comOpen ↗

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 vecchios.comvecchios.comOpen ↗ "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

What is the budget for a poor man's Rambouillet?

Surly is a good recommendation already said. So two checks for Surly. Why not a Cross Check and a
Steamroller when the budget allows.

Even lower? Fuji touring.

Lower yet? Wait for more money.

"John Standard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Looking for a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar geometry
to the Romulus/Rambouillet for non loaded touring. Ideally, frame could work both single speed
and geared.

Thanks in advance

Ask Mark Hickey from Habanero to build you a custom made titanium bike with the exact geometry that
you want for $900 bucks. It will not be steel, but titanium will perform just as good. Also,
titanium will not rust so it will be strudier for touring in this sense. Also, titanium will not
scratch and the paint will not chip because there isn't any paint to chip. The only negative about a
natural titanium finish is that they come in one color, Grey. However, they will always look new.

Andres

[email hidden] (John Standard) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Looking for a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar geometry
to the Romulus/Rambouillet for non loaded touring. Ideally, frame could work both single speed
and geared.

Thanks in advance

Quoted message said:

exact geometry that you want for $900

$995 B

(remove clothes to reply)

[email hidden] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

nobilettecycles.comnobilettecycles.comOpen ↗

Peter,

They do look like nice frames, but the price list seems to put them out of the range of someone
wanting an alternative to a Riv Romulus ($1500 for complete bike minus saddle, pedals, and bar
tape). Best I can tell from Mark's site it would cost $1475 for a frame+fork.

- rick warner

[email hidden] (todd fahrner) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I seriously doubt you'll find near-identical geometry. But consider these as cheaper cousins of
the Romulus (which, IMO, is very modestly priced):

Surly Cross-Check (surlybikes.combikes.htmOpen ↗) Soma frames, built up as you like:
somafab.comsomafab.comOpen ↗

Both nice choices, though a bit high through the BB (have a Soma Double Cross sitting in my den, so
I am familiar with them ;-) ). Another difference is that the Romulus uses standard reach side pull
brakes, the Surly and Soma cross frames are designed for canti's. Pluses and minuses to each, but a
difference.

My own preference if I was the original poster would be to save the pennies and get and Atlantis and
build it up - but hey, that's me and I like the long stays.

- rick warner

"Rick Warner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Surly Cross-Check (surlybikes.combikes.htmOpen ↗) Soma frames, built up as you like:
somafab.comsomafab.comOpen ↗

Both nice choices, though a bit high through the BB (have a Soma Double Cross sitting in my den,
so I am familiar with them ;-) ). Another difference is that the Romulus uses standard reach side
pull brakes, the Surly and Soma cross frames are designed for canti's. Pluses and minuses to each,
but a difference.

Another budget alternative from Surly is the Pacer surlybikes.compacer.htmOpen ↗

It uses standard or long reach calipers with room for 32 mm tires or 28 mm with fenders, has BB drop
of 72 mm (compared to 66 mm for the Cross-Check), but has shorter stays (41.5 cm).

[email hidden] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

rick-<< Best I can tell from Mark's site it would cost $1475 for a frame+fork. >><BR><BR>

tig framesets start at $1150.pure custom...

That is not clear on the price list posted on the web site. Do not need to sell me; I have my custom
steel tourer in the works (frame/fork is done, waiting for parts). That said, if the original poster
is balking at the price of a Riv, $950 or whatever for the Rambouillet or Atlantis frameset, I doubt
they will buy off on $1150 for a custom. Of course, they might be happier with the custom ;-)

- rick warner

Thanks to all for the feedback. As far as I know , the only suggestion that meets all the criteria
of a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar geometry to the
Romulus/Rambouillet,that ideally could work both single speed and geared is the Surly Cross-Check.
And it's within my budget. I'll check it out. Thanks again.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Rick

Warner) said:

if the original poster is balking at the price of a Riv, $950 or whatever for the Rambouillet or
Atlantis frameset, I doubt they will buy off on $1150 for a custom.

A nice reminder of the difference between how enthusiasts view buying equipment (for any hobby)
compared to non-enthusiasts. A $3000 bike to an enthusiast is often a reasonable to good deal- but
to a non-enthusiast it is insane.

But then like many in this newsgroup, most of my bikes are each worth more than my car.

John Standard said:

Pacer needs the Surly Singleator ; Cross-Check is single speed out of the box.

Nah, the Singleator and similar kludges are obsolte since the introduction of the White Industries
ENO eccentric hub.

See: sheldonbrown.comwhite hubs.htmlOpen ↗

and: sheldonbrown.orgrambouilletOpen ↗

Sheldon "Eccentric" Brown +------------------------------------------+
| To have doubted one's first principles | is the mark of a civilized man. | -- Oliver Wendell
| Holmes |
+------------------------------------------+ Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts Phone
617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041 harriscyclery.comharriscyclery.comOpen ↗ Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
captainbike.comcaptainbike.comOpen ↗ sheldonbrown.comsheldonbrown.comOpen ↗

Sheldon Brown said:

Nah, the Singleator and similar kludges are obsolte since the introduction of the White Industries
ENO eccentric hub.

Well, okay, maybe, but being locked into a single manufacturer of stuff is never good. It may be
superbly engineered, but IMHO even the eccentric hub is still a kludge to compensate for not having
vertical dropouts.

Jasper

[email hidden] (John Standard) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Thanks to all for the feedback. As far as I know , the only suggestion that meets all the criteria
of a current production , off the shelf , non lugged steel frame with similar geometry to the
Romulus/Rambouillet,that ideally could work both single speed and geared is the Surly Cross-Check.
And it's within my budget. I'll check it out. Thanks again.

Still curious as to why the non-lugged requirement. Is it price, or do you not like the look?

- rick warner

Quoted message said:

Still curious as to why the non-lugged requirement. Is it price, or do you not like the look?

- rick warner

It is price.

Jasper Janssen said:

Sheldon Brown said:

Nah, the Singleator and similar kludges are obsolte since the introduction of the White Industries
ENO eccentric hub.

Well, okay, maybe, but being locked into a single manufacturer of stuff is never good. It may be
superbly engineered, but IMHO even the eccentric hub is still a kludge to compensate for not having
vertical dropouts.

I'm thinking Jasper meant horizontal dropouts, but regardless I would be interesting in hearing from
anyone with experience with this "kludge." Looks like an interesting innovation.

Phil

Phil B said:

On Thu, 03 Jul 2003 19:51:37 GMT, Jasper Janssen <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Well, okay, maybe, but being locked into a single manufacturer of stuff is never good. It may be
superbly engineered, but IMHO even the eccentric hub is still a kludge to compensate for not
having vertical dropouts.

I'm thinking Jasper meant horizontal dropouts, but regardless I would

Oh. D'oh. 'Course I did. Or maybe I mean to not say "not". Either way, my mistake.

Quoted message said:

be interesting in hearing from anyone with experience with this "kludge." Looks like an interesting
innovation.

That'd be Sheldon Brown over there, and I do agree the things look gorgeous and very effective from
the photos. My main concern is that one day down the road when it does fail, it or a similar product
might not be made any more, but I do recognise that if you for some reason want to make a
singlespeeder out of a vertical dropout equipped frame, that's the way to go. Personally I'd try
very hard to find a frame with horizontal slots, especially because of the geared hub thing.

Jasper