hyperthyroidism / rust / oxidative stress

Physiologically, it's much more likely the other way around. In other
words, the oxidative stress suppresses the thyroid. This is at least
one of the major reasons for the "obesity epidemic." Once the thyroid
is suppressed (by oxidative stress), metabolism slows, and you get fat.
I eat as much sugar, butter, coconut product, fruit, dark chocolate,
cheese, yogurt, etc. as I like, and yet at 40, I'm thin as a rail,
while my friends and family, who eat typical high unsaturated fat and
oxidized cholesterol diets, are either overweight or obese. This is
simple stuff, if you know a little biochemistry and physiology. My
book, which should be out in less than a year, will explain all of this
in the simplest terms possible, so that anyone interested can
understand exactly what's going on.

i

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

This is at least one of the major reasons for the "obesity epidemic."

http://www.ecologos.org/obese.htm

Laurie

"Laurie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

This is at least one of the major reasons for the "obesity epidemic."

http://www.ecologos.org/obese.htm

Laurie

What he is saying is that the cellular part for eating , the local cultural
diet, and psychological/emotional conditioning center in the brain is
damaged by oxidative stress.
That fits beautifully within his theory.

Quoted message said:

What in the world are you trying to say here? I'll make it clear: are
you unaware of what suppresses the thyroid? And if so, are you aware
of the thyroid's role in metabolism? And if so, are you aware of what
happens when metabolism is slowed significantly? You seem to be the
most aggressively ignorant person who has ever posted here. Go ahead
and show us that you are not.

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What in the world are you trying to say here? I'll make it clear: are
you unaware of what suppresses the thyroid? And if so, are you aware
of the thyroid's role in metabolism? And if so, are you aware of what
happens when metabolism is slowed significantly? You seem to be the
most aggressively ignorant person who has ever posted here. Go ahead
and show us that you are not.

Suppresses the thyroid?
"We aimed to determine whether patients with subclinical hyperthyroidism "
Let me show you my ignore here just a little bit about the thyroid.
Hyperthyroidism is an autoimmune disease involving antibody damage to the
organ. The antibody mimics the TSH that binds to the TSH receptor and is
known as a thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin. The release of the thyroxin
causes the symptoms of hyperthyroidism and it is called graves disease.
In hypothyroidism the autoantibody causes damage to the organ and not the
receptor with an initial high release of thyroxin with subsequent damage to
the organ and diminishing release of the hormone.
In both diseases you see high levels of microsomal antibodies and
anti-thyroglobulin antibodies which damage the organ.
The end result is antibody induced damage which terminates with like all
cell death various lipid degenerative changes.
Fatty degradation of cells is normal and common.
Looking a damaged cells and looking for oxidative stress is ??????
Why not look at red blood cells that are coated with antibody and check for
oxidative stress?
Give me a break

Note to the last post:

I did not realize that Robert was talking about the link posted by
Laurie. I'm not sure what Robert was getting at, but I thought he was
commenting upon one of my posts. I'll apologize for being harsh, but I
thought he was being sarcastic. I took a quick look at that web page
Laurie posted, and it has a bunch of abstracts on it. Some of them
were useful, others were not. In my upcoming book, I will explain how
an overall framework can be used to make sense of all the abstracts,
reports, and claims out there. In the meantime, remember than a
linoleic acid molecule is a linoleic acid molecule, regardless of
whether it came from an animal or a plant. At the level of
biochemistry, that is what matters. At the nutritional science level,
you get such molecules in your body by eating a complex package of
molecules, some of which are unique to certain plants or animals, and
some of which are "generic," like linoleic acid. So, while linoleic
acid (an omega 6 fatty acid) is not something you want more than trace
amounts of in your diet, if it comes from lard, it has no antioxdiant
protection, whereas if it comes from good quality nuts, it does. This
is very important for maintaining health.

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Note to the last post:

Cesk Fysiol. 2003 Feb;52(1):34-41. Related Articles, Links

[Lipid metabolism in atherogenesis]

[Article in Czech]

Bobkova D, Poledne R.

Laborator pro vyzkum aterosklerozy, Centrum experimentalniho vyzkumu chorob
srdce a cev, IKEM, Praha.

Lipoprotein (LP) metabolism plays a pivotal role in atherogenesis. Breakdown
of triglyceride (TG) rich lipoproteins, both of exogenous--chylomicrones and
endogenous--very low density lipoproteiny (VLDL) produces remnant
lipoproteins after repeated action of lipoprotein lipase (LPL). Atherogenity
of remnant lipoprotein has been proved. Also atheroprotective high density
lipoproteins (HDL) are produced from surface of TG rich lipoproteins during
their lipolysis. Protective role of HDL particles in atherogenesis is
manifested by reverse cholesterol transport from all extrahepatic cells to
the liver including cells of the arterial wall. Plasma concentration of
atherogenic low density lipoproteins (LPL) is regulated by the production
rate of VLDL in the liver on the one hand and their utilization by selective
LDL receptors (mainly in the liver) on the other hand. Number of functioning
LDL receptors is regulated genetically (gene for own LDL receptor and gene
for both ligands--apoprotein B and apoprotein E) and also by environmental
factors. Diet low in saturated fat and cholesterol and rich in dietary
fibres increases number of LDL receptors and consequently decreases LDL
cholesterol concentration. Monocytes entering arterial wall when intravasal
and then subendothelial concentration of LDL is increased absorb LDL and
predominantly oxidized LDL by scavenger receptors. During this repeated
process they are changed to macrophages, residual macrophages and foam
cells. Production of foam cells represents a starting point in atherogenesis
but their high presence is typical also for advanced vulnerable
atherosclerotic lesions, which are prone to rupture producing clinical
complication--myocardial infarction and stroke.

PMID: 12693188 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

In almost all cases of adult onset "diseases," excess biochemical
activity (usually in the form of AA metabolites) causes dysfunction.
The evidence is so overwhelming that it's actually funny. Do some
www.pubmed.com searches.

Here are a couple of recent ones:

Cell Biochem Funct. 2003 Dec;21(4):325-30.

Oxidative damage and antioxidant enzyme activities in experimental
hypothyroidism.

Yilmaz S, Ozan S, Benzer F, Canatan H.

Department of Biochemistry, College of Veterinary Medicine, Firat
(Euphrates) University, Elazig 23119, Turkey. [email hidden]

Free radicals are now well known to damage cellular components. To
investigate whether age and thyroid level affect peroxidation speed, we
examined the levels of malondialdehyde and antioxidant enzyme
activities in different age groups of hypothyroid rats. Hypothyroidism
was induced in 30- and 60-day-old Wistar Albino rats by the i.p.
administration of propylthiouracil (10 mg kg(-1) body weight) for 15
days. While malondialdehyde levels of 30- or 60-day-old hypothyroid
rats were increased in liver, they were decreased in the tissues of the
heart and thyroid. While glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase activity
levels did not change in heart, brain and liver tissues of 30-day-old
rats, they increased in brain and heart tissues of 60-day-old
experimental groups, but decreased in the liver. Catalase activities
decreased in the liver and heart of rats with hypothyroidism, but
increased in erythrocytes. In control groups while malondialdehyde
levels increased in brain, heart and thymus with regard to age, they
decreased in plasma. Glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase and catalase
activities were not affected by age in tissues of the thymus, thyroid
and brain, but they were decreased in the heart tissue. The changes in
the levels of lipid peroxidation and antioxidant enzyme activities
which were determined in different tissues of hypothyroid rats indicate
a cause for functional disorder of these tissues. Moreover, there may
be changes depending on age at lipid peroxidation and antioxidant
enzyme activity levels. Copyright 2003 John Wiley & Sons, Ltd.

Indian J Exp Biol. 2003 Nov;41(11):1334-7.

Changes in lipid peroxidation and free radical scavengers in kidney of
hypothyroid and hyperthyroid rats.

Sawant BU, Nadkarni GD, Thakare UR, Joseph LJ, Rajan MG.

Laboratory Nuclear Medicine Section, Isotope Group, (BARC), C/o Tata
Memorial Centre Annexe, Parel, Mumbai 400 012, India.
[email hidden]

Kidney weight was significantly decreased in hypothyroidism (induced by
Na131I administration) and increased in hyperthyroidism (induced by
thyroxine treatment) as compared to control in female Wistar rats. The
tissue lipid peroxidation level remained unchanged in hyperthyroid rats
but significantly increased in hypothyroid rats. Superoxide dismutase
was decreased in both experimental groups but more so in hyperthyroid
rats. Catalase was reduced significantly in hyperthyroid rats but
remained unaffected in hypothyroid rats. Tissue glutathione peroxidase
(GPx) activity was increased while reduced glutathione levels remained
unaltered in both hypothyroid and hyperthyroid rats. Plasma GPx
activity was significantly low in both the hypothyroid and hyperthyroid
rats. The results suggest alterations in the oxidative stress in
hypothyroid and hyperthyroid rat kidneys with concomitant changes of
free radical scavengers.

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In almost all cases of adult onset "diseases," excess biochemical
activity (usually in the form of AA metabolites) causes dysfunction.
The evidence is so overwhelming that it's actually funny. Do some

Propylthiouracil is used to kill the thyroid in hyperthyroidism and
thyroxine is used to treat hypothyroidism.

What else are they suggesting for hyperthyroidism and hypothyroidism?

Nothing? Thank you. Instead or rats maybe they can work their way up to dogs
in a few years.

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

..., remember than a linoleic acid molecule is a linoleic acid molecule,
regardless of whether it came from an animal or a plant.

....

Quoted message said:

So, while linoleic acid is not something you want more than trace amounts
of in your diet, *if it comes from lard*, it has no antioxdiant
protection, whereas if *it comes from good quality nuts*, it does.

Self contradiction; a sure method to upgrade one's credibility.

Laurie

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I took a quick look at that web page
Laurie posted, and it has a bunch of abstracts on it.

Why don't you take an -honest- look, and try refuting any concept there
with facts and logic, not insults?

Laurie

Laurie: exactly what is your claim? I'll take on all comers, but you
have to clearly articulate your ideas. If you are having difficulty
understanding a point I a making, you need to explain exactly what the
problem is.

Robert: Thank you for reiterating what MattLB and myself have been
posting here for a few years now (concerning oxidized cholesterol).
Otherwise, I don't know what you're getting at. I'm not going to do
the research for you. If I happen to come across an abstract that
appears to possibly satisfy you, I'll post it. Otherwise, go ahead and
subject your thryoid to all the oxidative stress you wish.

Thanks for this great thread, which has enabled me to identify and block a
bunch of crossposting idiots and trolls.

A

I don't think many of them are seeing your posts anymore. You are posting
your snips in vain.

"Andrew Heenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Thanks for this great thread, which has enabled me to identify and block a
bunch of crossposting idiots and trolls.

A

You too, eh?

"Andrew Heenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| Thanks for this great thread, which has enabled me to identify and block a
| bunch of crossposting idiots and trolls.
|
| A
|
|

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Laurie: exactly what is your claim? I'll take on all comers, but you
have to clearly articulate your ideas.

=====
repeat post:

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

..., remember than a linoleic acid molecule is a linoleic acid molecule,
regardless of whether it came from an animal or a plant.

....

Quoted message said:

So, while linoleic acid is not something you want more than trace amounts
of in your diet, *if it comes from lard*, it has no antioxdiant
protection, whereas if *it comes from good quality nuts*, it does.

Self contradiction; a sure method to upgrade one's credibility.

Laurie
======

Clearly-articulated enough?? Clearly-articulated enough the first time
it was posted to completely ignore it?
But, let me be even more clear; people who contradict themselves have NO
credibility.

Laurie

If you are having difficulty

Quoted message said:

understanding a point I a making, you need to explain exactly what the
problem is.

Robert: Thank you for reiterating what MattLB and myself have been
posting here for a few years now (concerning oxidized cholesterol).
Otherwise, I don't know what you're getting at. I'm not going to do
the research for you. If I happen to come across an abstract that
appears to possibly satisfy you, I'll post it. Otherwise, go ahead and
subject your thryoid to all the oxidative stress you wish.

"Laurie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Laurie: exactly what is your claim? I'll take on all comers, but you
have to clearly articulate your ideas.

=====
repeat post:

"montygram" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

..., remember than a linoleic acid molecule is a linoleic acid molecule,
regardless of whether it came from an animal or a plant.

...

Quoted message said:

So, while linoleic acid is not something you want more than trace

amounts

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

of in your diet, *if it comes from lard*, it has no antioxdiant
protection, whereas if *it comes from good quality nuts*, it does.

Self contradiction; a sure method to upgrade one's credibility.

Laurie
======

Sounds like a contradiction to me plain and simple.
To Monty, peoples bodies and tissues are exposed to oxidants every minute of
the day and there are anti-oxidant systems that the body already has. In
addition the body produces a vast amount of oxidants and free radicals
generated by it's use of oxygen so they are localized within each cell in
addition to those oxidants chemicals the cell is bathed in outside the cell.
With a minute damage to the cell by any known mechanism of injury then the
cell collapses because it can not resist that oxidative stress. To measure
oxidative changes in a damaged cell is a joke.It proves that the cell was
damaged and not that the primary defect was a result of oxidative stress.
You just don't get it.

Quoted message said:

Clearly-articulated enough?? Clearly-articulated enough the first

time

Quoted message said:

it was posted to completely ignore it?
But, let me be even more clear; people who contradict themselves have

NO

Quoted message said:

credibility.

Laurie

If you are having difficulty

Quoted message said:

understanding a point I a making, you need to explain exactly what the
problem is.

Robert: Thank you for reiterating what MattLB and myself have been
posting here for a few years now (concerning oxidized cholesterol).
Otherwise, I don't know what you're getting at. I'm not going to do
the research for you. If I happen to come across an abstract that
appears to possibly satisfy you, I'll post it. Otherwise, go ahead and
subject your thryoid to all the oxidative stress you wish.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

*if it comes from lard*, it has no antioxdiant protection, whereas if *it
comes from good quality nuts*, it does.

Quoted message said:

Self contradiction; a sure method to upgrade one's credibility.

please read up on antioxidants and antioxidant protection, then post.
thanks.

MMu said:

please read up on antioxidants and antioxidant protection, then post.

More crossposted horseshit.